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Tags donald trump , immigration incidents , immigration issues , racism charges

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Old 10th February 2017, 05:47 PM   #1
Stacko
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Papers Please

Lacking documentation!? I though citizens weren't required to carry documentation.

Quote:
Federal immigration officials declined Friday to say how many people had been detained in the recent raids. A DHS official confirmed that while immigration agents were targeting criminals, they also were taking into custody non-criminals in the vicinity who were found to be lacking documentation.

“Big cities tend to have a lot of illegal immigrants,” said one immigration official who was not authorized to speak publicly because of the sensitive nature of the operation. “They’re going to a target-rich environment.”

Meanwhile, immigration advocacy and legal aid groups said ICE had declined to give them any information about how many people had been taken into custody.
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Old 10th February 2017, 05:59 PM   #2
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Yeah, the part about trailing children home from school so they can deport a parent is charming. There's nothing that screams your party's Christian commitment to The Sanctity of the Family like exiling Mom or Dad.

It's like, instead of seriously addressing the issues of illegal immigration, especially that of American children whose parents have been living here without authorization, they put Snidely Whiplash in charge and told him to deport dangerous criminals; or, if that took actual effort, random homemakers and laborers.
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:03 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by sts60 View Post
Yeah, the part about trailing children home from school so they can deport a parent is charming. There's nothing that screams your party's Christian commitment to The Sanctity of the Family like exiling Mom or Dad.

It's like, instead of seriously addressing the issues of illegal immigration, especially that of American children whose parents have been living here without authorization, they put Snidely Whiplash in charge and told him to deport dangerous criminals; or, if that took actual effort, random homemakers and laborers.
But they're stealin' our jerbs!

Conservatives: Compasionate and Pro Life.. As long as they are pre-born 'merkins.
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:03 PM   #4
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I think Reinhardt Heydrich is a better choice then Snidely Whiplash.
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:05 PM   #5
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How does that even work?

"Are you an American citizen?"
"Yeah, now **** off pig."
"Let's see some paperwork proving it. A birth certificate..."
"Which part of **** off pig didn't you get? Was it the pig part or the **** off part?"
"OK, I guess you're an American."
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:27 PM   #6
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SOme American citizenes are going to be swept up on the grounds that "anybody with a brown skin and a Hispanic surname Is probably a wetback.

There are going to some interesting legal complacations arising out of this.

The response of the Trumpets just reinforces my belief that hatred and bigotry is the driving force behing the hardcore of the Trump movement.
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:35 PM   #7
marplots
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
SOme American citizenes are going to be swept up on the grounds that "anybody with a brown skin and a Hispanic surname Is probably a wetback.

There are going to some interesting legal complacations arising out of this.
What would probable cause even look like?
"I saw the suspect eating a taco."
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:38 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
What would probable cause even look like?
"I saw the suspect eating a taco."
They looked Mexican
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:50 PM   #9
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In my Northern California community, there are Mexican-American families that have been here longer than mine (and my family has been here for a long time.)

Whenever someone says "it isn't about racism" they should be slapped. It's entirely about racism.
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Old 10th February 2017, 06:56 PM   #10
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I've got no problem with "Okay, fine, your child was born here. Do you want to take him with you on the bus to Mexico, or should we send him to an orphan's home?"

It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:01 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
I'm more concerned with the practical matters. How are you going to tell if I'm an American or not? Who has the burden of proof here?
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:12 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I've got no problem with "Okay, fine, your child was born here. Do you want to take him with you on the bus to Mexico, or should we send him to an orphan's home?"

It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
I have no problem deporting illegal aliens. What I have a problem with is citizens and legal residents being harassed based on the color of their skin.
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:13 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Reinhardt Heydrich is a better choice then Snidely Whiplash.
Are they killing them, or is there slave labor?
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:25 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
I'm more concerned with the practical matters. How are you going to tell if I'm an American or not? Who has the burden of proof here?
The government does. But if you don't have a lawyer or a judge who is willing to listen, the burden of proof might be rather low.
https://www.aclu.org/blog/speakeasy/...s-own-citizens

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Old 10th February 2017, 07:29 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Shalamar View Post
But they're stealin' our jerbs!

Conservatives: Compasionate and Pro Life.. As long as they are pre-born 'merkins.
I 'spects they indeed are pubic wigs!!!!!
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:29 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
...your country you say? Are you American? Can you prove it?
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:31 PM   #17
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For the curious or unknowing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merkin
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:40 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I've got no problem with "Okay, fine, your child was born here. Do you want to take him with you on the bus to Mexico, or should we send him to an orphan's home?"

It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
That's cold, casebro. And hypocritical of all those faux Conservatives who claim to be all about the importance of family.

Tell me why you want your tax dollars wasted on crap like this:
Deported mom becomes face of debate on Trump immigration policy
Quote:
An undocumented mother of two American-born children who was deported to her native Mexico has become the focus of a national debate over the Trump administration's crackdown on illegal immigration.
She was charged and convicted of a felony in 2008 for using a fake SSN to work. That was her only crime. She was to check in once a year, which she did every year since, then this year when she did they deported her.

Conservatives make excuses why we can't charge employers, who could easily check if employees are using their own SSNs, for a crime of hiring undocumented workers. Always an excuse about passing legislation to make employers use eVerify despite the fact all banks are required to use it when you open an account.

Why is this mother the focus of your complaint, casebro? In what fantasy world do you think she took some poor American citizen's job?
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:44 PM   #19
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I am a brown skinned American (Mexican, Anglo, Native American mutt). I am not afraid of ICE agents coming to get me. That's seems a very irrational fear that hasn't been anywhere close to borne out in reality. Let me know when American citizens are arrested solely because they "look Mexican." Of course you won't have to because the stink that will be raised (and I'll be the first one farting) if ICE does start arresting on appearance only will let me know.
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:44 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
SOme American citizenes are going to be swept up on the grounds that "anybody with a brown skin and a Hispanic surname Is probably a wetback.

There are going to some interesting legal complacations arising out of this.

The response of the Trumpets just reinforces my belief that hatred and bigotry is the driving force behing the hardcore of the Trump movement.
Do you remember that mentally disabled kid they mistakenly deported a few years ago? He wasn't the only one.

5 Americans Who Were Wrongly Deported by US Immigration
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:45 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
I am a brown skinned American (Mexican, Anglo, Native American mutt). I am not afraid of ICE agents coming to get me. That's seems a very irrational fear that hasn't been anywhere close to borne out in reality. Let me know when American citizens are arrested solely because they "look Mexican." Of course you won't have to because the stink that will be raised (and I'll be the first one farting) if ICE does start arresting on appearance only will let me know.
Ahem... see the post above.

They didn't deport them to Canada.
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:52 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
I've got no problem with "Okay, fine, your child was born here. Do you want to take him with you on the bus to Mexico, or should we send him to an orphan's home?"

It OUR country. We can set up laws of our own, to govern OUR country. And Trump's job is to enforce those laws. Why do so many of you have a problem with that?
Because we have some compassion....

And I suspect you have "issues" with Hispanics.

And why do I suspect by "Our" you mean White Europeans?
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Last edited by dudalb; 10th February 2017 at 08:00 PM.
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Old 10th February 2017, 07:53 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Giz View Post
Are they killing them, or is there slave labor?
I was thinking more of the round up tactics....
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Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

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Old 10th February 2017, 07:57 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by fuelair View Post
For the curious or unknowing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merkin
It's also, by the way, the term used long ago for a cannon swab. Hmm.
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:03 PM   #25
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I wonder what would happen if a Mexican snuck in, made it to Florida, then they where to call the authorities on them sleds & I sit they were Cuban...
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:06 PM   #26
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Trump has sold a bunch of ignorant voters that if we get rid of all Mexicans our economic troubles would vanish. Sort of like what You Know Who did with the Jews.....
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:11 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I was thinking more of the round up tactics....
Hmmmm. The FBI arrest people who pose a threat to the state. .. so did the SS. Therefore Comey = Himmler.

Am I doing this right?
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:19 PM   #28
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Wow.

Folks here need to take a step back, and try to regain a grip on reality.

Just look at your own posts and listen to yourselves. You claim to be skeptics, yet you surrender yourselves to unsubstantiated panic driven rumors without even attempting to verify anything found elsewhere, or presented here.

I developed a respect for this site over the years because of the fact-based emotionless responses made to the 9/11 truthers. You folks shut those people down, you went with the facts, and you looked good doing it.

But now, I see many of those same people giving in to and going along with the same type of baseless garbage the truthers did simply because the person who you wanted to win the election, didn't.

This used to be a go-to place for objective facts that I would recommend to others, but I could not make that same recommendation now.
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:19 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
I am a brown skinned American (Mexican, Anglo, Native American mutt). I am not afraid of ICE agents coming to get me. That's seems a very irrational fear that hasn't been anywhere close to borne out in reality. Let me know when American citizens are arrested solely because they "look Mexican." Of course you won't have to because the stink that will be raised (and I'll be the first one farting) if ICE does start arresting on appearance only will let me know.
********. Congratulations to you if you've never been harassed, but I live in a community with a fluxing population of Mexicans and Mexican-Americans, and the citizens do get harassed just for having brown skin and a Spanish name.
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:22 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by willim View Post
Wow.

Folks here need to take a step back, and try to regain a grip on reality.

Just look at your own posts and listen to yourselves. You claim to be skeptics, yet you surrender yourselves to unsubstantiated panic driven rumors without even attempting to verify anything found elsewhere, or presented here.

I developed a respect for this site over the years because of the fact-based emotionless responses made to the 9/11 truthers. You folks shut those people down, you went with the facts, and you looked good doing it.

But now, I see many of those same people giving in to and going along with the same type of baseless garbage the truthers did simply because the person who you wanted to win the election, didn't.

This used to be a go-to place for objective facts that I would recommend to others, but I could not make that same recommendation now.
Politics is where skepticism goes to die.
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Old 10th February 2017, 08:53 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by willim View Post
Wow.

Folks here need to take a step back, and try to regain a grip on reality.

Just look at your own posts and listen to yourselves. You claim to be skeptics, yet you surrender yourselves to unsubstantiated panic driven rumors without even attempting to verify anything found elsewhere, or presented here.

I developed a respect for this site over the years because of the fact-based emotionless responses made to the 9/11 truthers. You folks shut those people down, you went with the facts, and you looked good doing it.

But now, I see many of those same people giving in to and going along with the same type of baseless garbage the truthers did simply because the person who you wanted to win the election, didn't.

This used to be a go-to place for objective facts that I would recommend to others, but I could not make that same recommendation now.
The person just elected promotes ideas that are the antithesis to skepticism. He has created a backlash among scientists. He also, to put it mildly, rather sensative to even trivial criticism or portrayals in less than glowing terms. His selected team is rather suspect in motive and or competence. He is reportedly and self expressed to be not having patience for details.

These things have not gone unnoticed by foreign politicians. While there is some over reaction, he has been a suboptimal choice.
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Old 10th February 2017, 09:09 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
The person just elected promotes ideas that are the antithesis to skepticism. He has created a backlash among scientists. He also, to put it mildly, rather sensative to even trivial criticism or portrayals in less than glowing terms. His selected team is rather suspect in motive and or competence. He is reportedly and self expressed to be not having patience for details.

These things have not gone unnoticed by foreign politicians. While there is some over reaction, he has been a suboptimal choice.
I don't substantially disagree with you. That still doesn't mean I or my fellow Americans of "Latino" descent have to start worrying about being harassed by "La Migra." I have never been harassed by any immigration official in any of my travels coming back from Mexico. I have never even been hassled for immigration at the inland CBP checkpoint on my way up north. Not even when I went to San Antonio as late as last weekend. I'll certainly let you know if that changes as you can be damn sure I won't be quiet about it.

Can you imagine the **** storm that would happen if an American citizen was hassled and deported? And I'm not talking about people who give fake names to authorities or stuff like that. I'm talking about a citizen like me, going about his daily business and somehow got deported just for being brown. Not likely to happen.
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Old 10th February 2017, 09:40 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
I don't substantially disagree with you. That still doesn't mean I or my fellow Americans of "Latino" descent have to start worrying about being harassed by "La Migra." I have never been harassed by any immigration official in any of my travels coming back from Mexico. I have never even been hassled for immigration at the inland CBP checkpoint on my way up north. Not even when I went to San Antonio as late as last weekend. I'll certainly let you know if that changes as you can be damn sure I won't be quiet about it.

Can you imagine the **** storm that would happen if an American citizen was hassled and deported? And I'm not talking about people who give fake names to authorities or stuff like that. I'm talking about a citizen like me, going about his daily business and somehow got deported just for being brown. Not likely to happen.
Guaranteed,considerng the level of competence we have seen from the Trump Adminsitration so far,It is going to happen.
I think we should get control of our borders,but I think that we need a policy of case by case basis for those who are here who have entered the country illegally. Yes,coming here illegally is against the law, but I don't think it's criminal in the sense of being evil .And anybody knows the deporting 11 Million people is just not going to happen. And I ma cynical enough to think if it were 11 Million White Canadians, it would not be an issue.
And, let's.,for the sake of argument , assume that most of Trump;s policies are basically good in their aim. So far, they have been badly bungled,and I don't see that changing given Trump's ego, his inability to admit he made a mistake,and his belief that his "gut feelings" are better then the advice of experts . That is a recipe for disaster.
And that might be the biggest problem I have with Trump:he is simply not equipped to be a good President.
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Last edited by dudalb; 10th February 2017 at 09:42 PM.
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Old 10th February 2017, 09:49 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
...

Can you imagine the **** storm that would happen if an American citizen was hassled and deported? And I'm not talking about people who give fake names to authorities or stuff like that. I'm talking about a citizen like me, going about his daily business and somehow got deported just for being brown. Not likely to happen.
Did you miss my post where this has already happened? No **** storm, barely an honorable mention by the press when some poor kid with mental disabilities was deported a few years back. It took his parents months to find him and bring him home.

I posted a link to 5 other cases.

Just because you haven't had any trouble is a pretty meaningless anecdote actually.

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Old 10th February 2017, 10:07 PM   #35
Armitage72
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Some American citizens are going to be swept up on the grounds that "anybody with a brown skin and a Hispanic surname Is probably a wetback.

Cheech Marin had better be careful. He's already been through this.

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Old 10th February 2017, 10:26 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Did you miss my post where this has already happened? No **** storm, barely an honorable mention by the press when some poor kid with mental disabilities was deported a few years back. It took his parents months to find him and bring him home.

I posted a link to 5 other cases.

Just because you haven't had any trouble is a pretty meaningless anecdote actually.
Needs repeating.

ETA: An argument I hear too frequently. I am/have done/have been something, so I don't recognize the possibility of differing circumstances. 10 year old logic.
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Old 10th February 2017, 10:28 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
Can you imagine the **** storm that would happen if an American citizen was hassled and deported? And I'm not talking about people who give fake names to authorities or stuff like that. I'm talking about a citizen like me, going about his daily business and somehow got deported just for being brown. Not likely to happen.
It appears that it's a very small storm....

https://news.vice.com/article/the-us...s-own-citizens
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Old 10th February 2017, 10:30 PM   #38
xjx388
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Did you miss my post where this has already happened? No **** storm, barely an honorable mention by the press when some poor kid with mental disabilities was deported a few years back. It took his parents months to find him and bring him home.

I posted a link to 5 other cases.

Just because you haven't had any trouble is pretty meaningless anecdote actually.
I saw them. I think we are talking about two different things. I have no doubt that US Citizens are mistakenly deported sometimes. Our legal systems are not perfect and there's room for improvement. That teenager cited earlier identified herself as Colombian for example. The mentally ill are especially vulnerable. Citizens, especially poor ones, can be in the criminal system and then be referred to immigration authorities because they can't prove their identities. It happens, sadly, and we need to be better on that front.

But I'm saying that someone like myself is not going to be rounded up by ICE simply because I'm brown. It would be near impossible for that to happen by mistake. There isn't going to be a purging of Brown People. No one is going to hassle me for my papers just because I look Mexican. It's just FUD to suggest it's a real possibility.
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Old 10th February 2017, 10:32 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by TheGoldcountry View Post
Needs repeating.

ETA: An argument I hear too frequently. I am/have done/have been something, so I don't recognize the possibility of differing circumstances. 10 year old logic.
And it's also 10 year old logic to say, "brown people better have their papers!" That's ridiculous.
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Old 10th February 2017, 10:33 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
It appears that it's a very small storm....

https://news.vice.com/article/the-us...s-own-citizens
OK, wow! That is a much bigger problem than I thought.
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