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Tags adolf hitler , donald trump , Nazi comparisons , nazi germany , Trump controversies

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Old 27th May 2021, 12:18 AM   #1
Stacyhs
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The Rise of Hitler and The Age of Trump: A Comparison

Bob001 linked this article in another thread and I found it so interesting and relevant that I thought it deserved a thread of its own.

We are so reluctant to mention Hitler and the rise of Naziism when it comes to discussing Trump and the current direction of the GOP because of the inevitable protests and accusations of "drama" and "hyperbole" from the conservatives that we generally avoid doing so. However, the events of the past year, and especially the last 6-7 months, have shown a clear correlation between what happened in Germany starting in the early 1920's and what is happening here now. In the linked article, historian Benjamin Carter Hett, who has authored several books on the rise of Nazi Germany, discusses how the Nazis took over the German government, not by force, but from within and how our own democracy is in danger of the same authoritarian takeover from within.
Quote:
The past is not always a perfect prologue. But when the past echoes so loudly in the present one would be wise not to ignore it. History's bell is ringing loudly in the Age of Trump in America.

In a recent essay for the Los Angeles Times, historian Benjamin Carter Hett explored the frightening resonances between Adolf Hitler's attempted coup in Germany in 1923 (what has come to be known as the "Beer Hall Putsch") and Trump and his followers' coup attempt this past January:

Hitler learned his lesson: A sophisticated modern state could not be overturned by a violent coup led by outsiders, against the police and the army. He realized he would have to work within the system.

Over the following decade, this is exactly what he did. The Nazis ran in elections until they were the largest party in Germany's parliament, gridlocking legislative business. Even more insidiously, the Nazis worked to infiltrate crucial institutions like the police and the army. In 1931, Berlin police responded incredibly sluggishly to a massive Nazi riot in the center of the city. It turned out senior police officials silently sympathized with the Nazis and had colluded in hobbling the police response.

Hitler grew steadily more attractive to business and military leaders who saw him and his movement as their only salvation from the growing Communist Party. Early in 1933 they opened the doors of power to him. ...

After the violent attack on the U.S. Capitol, 139 Republican members of the House and eight members of the Senate, led by Sens. Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz, came out of hiding to vote to object to the electoral college vote count. While a police officer lay dying, they supported Trump's lie of a stolen election and embraced the insurrectionists' cause.


Hett then engages in a particularly disturbing what-if scenario, one that has troubled many people familiar with the patterns of history:

Imagine the events of the past weeks and months if someone like Hawley had been the secretary of state in Georgia, or someone like retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn held a significant military command. Imagine what would have happened if the Republicans held majorities in both houses of Congress and could have overturned the electoral college results. Imagine if the courts had been more generously stocked with judges willing to entertain the Trump campaign's ludicrous arguments.

Above all, imagine if the president had been a bit more competent, a bit more strategic, a bit more daring. Hitler, after all, was at least willing to be present at the violence his words inspired. He was also more persuasive in his dealings with important officials.
Hett answers several questions and makes equally disturbing observations in the rest of the article. Among those questions:

1) As a historian of modern Germany, what did you see when you watched the events of Jan. 6?

2) What parallels do you see between Trump and the larger right-wing movement's use of the Big Lie, as compared to the way Hitler and the Nazis used it?

Liz Cheney tried to warn her GOP colleagues that they are endangering the very democracy they say they are defending and she was punished for speaking truth to power. How can McConnell, McCarthy and so many other GOP Congress members NOT see just how dangerous their support of Trump's Big Lie is to our very democracy? How can they care so little for our country?
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Old 27th May 2021, 02:36 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Liz Cheney tried to warn her GOP colleagues that they are endangering the very democracy they say they are defending and she was punished for speaking truth to power. How can McConnell, McCarthy and so many other GOP Congress members NOT see just how dangerous their support of Trump's Big Lie is to our very democracy? How can they care so little for our country?
Because they have convinced themselves that power is theirs by right and if the voters think otherwise, well then clearly the voters can't be trusted. Also consider those who genuinely believe god is on their side, what does that make the opposition?
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Old 27th May 2021, 03:05 AM   #3
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Both are Jewish in their bloodlines on both sides .

Before a brain collapse over that assertion about Adolf , read Miles Mathis' reports on the matter .Trump's genealogy is well known and public .
The details and back- up scholarship are immense and it is pointless disagreeing until you have read the 'dossier '
You will need to read it a few times to absorb, and disagreeing with it would require a few month's work at minimum and the scope of one or more books to cover it completely .

Of course Compliance Gullibles will reject it before they get to paragraph two but information like this is not suitable for them in the first place .Something about thirsty horses and water -----
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Old 27th May 2021, 03:16 AM   #4
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Are Trump and the GOP Leadership following the Dictators' Handbook?

No doubt.

They are Authoritarians at heart and see no point in the Rule of Law or Participatory Democracy unless it directly benefits them.


But even though a huge number of Politicians and voters have not learned the lessons of the 20th Century, I have hope that the political class that actually matters has:

Corporate America.

Hitlers rise to power would have been impossible without the massive support by industrialists and bankers who saw great profit in a dominant Germany.
Corporate America on the other hand is looking for China and, soon, India to make the Great Bucks, not the US. They don'T want to antagonize and alienate the rest of the world, and they have no time for far-right US Politicians who have proven to be, time and time again, to be simply incompetent.
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Old 27th May 2021, 03:45 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
Of course Compliance Gullibles will reject it before they get to paragraph two but information like this is not suitable for them in the first place .Something about thirsty horses and water -----
Asserting things does not make it true. Your problem is accepting these statements without any verification.
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Old 27th May 2021, 03:47 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Are Trump and the GOP Leadership following the Dictators' Handbook?

No doubt.

They are Authoritarians at heart and see no point in the Rule of Law or Participatory Democracy unless it directly benefits them.


But even though a huge number of Politicians and voters have not learned the lessons of the 20th Century, I have hope that the political class that actually matters has:

Corporate America.

Hitlers rise to power would have been impossible without the massive support by industrialists and bankers who saw great profit in a dominant Germany.
Corporate America on the other hand is looking for China and, soon, India to make the Great Bucks, not the US. They don'T want to antagonize and alienate the rest of the world, and they have no time for far-right US Politicians who have proven to be, time and time again, to be simply incompetent.

I love surreal comedy .

Sleepy the Puppet Pres is already looking more and more like a budding Dictator than Trump ever did .
OK . I accept he is only a stand - in for Susan Rice passing on Obama's rulings , but like any left wing nut jobs , the route to power is always paved with Authoritarianism .
And with his push to wipe out youngsters with the poison vaccines he is giving a good imitation of Genocide in full view .
A great lover of the endless wars approach , Sleepy has wrecked Trump's foreign policy of not starting wars but finding solutions wherever possible .

And so it goes on . The ones to compare with the likes of a Dictator are those from the barmy left . Not the Trumps of this world .
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Old 27th May 2021, 03:57 AM   #7
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One crucial difference I see with the Germany of the 1920s-1930s and the USA of the 2020s is this (from the OP):
Quote:
Hitler grew steadily more attractive to business and military leaders who saw him and his movement as their only salvation from the growing Communist Party. Early in 1933 they opened the doors of power to him.
There is no such internal threat in the U.S. although trump and his supporters try and create one by endlessly bleating about "socialism." [See post above.] But in Germany it took the specter of a powerful Soviet Union and a worldwide Depression to bring Hitler to full power. We seemed to have dodged that bullet. The socialism meme works with certain people but I don't think most business and military leaders buy into it. Hopefully it stays that way but I agree, the threat is real.

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Old 27th May 2021, 04:46 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
One crucial difference I see with the Germany of the 1920s-1930s and the USA of the 2020s is this (from the OP):


There is no such internal threat in the U.S. although trump and his supporters try and create one by endlessly bleating about "socialism." [See post above.] But in Germany it took the specter of a powerful Soviet Union and a worldwide Depression to bring Hitler to full power. We seemed to have dodged that bullet. The socialism meme works with certain people but I don't think most business and military leaders buy into it. Hopefully it stays that way but I agree, the threat is real.
Agreed, and to add. There's also not a similar level of outright revolutionary activity. You don't see Freikorps and communists fighting for literal control of cities and regions of the country. Hitler's grabs for power were among many other similar attempts, often with individual cities or regions briefly being declared independent sovereignty under this or that communist or extreme right authority. Lots of street fighting over turf was happening.

The right wing also enjoyed extreme leniency from the judicial system. Failed right wing coups were not a disaster for these people because they often ended with lenient wrist-slap sentences. Hilter personally failed to seize government and rather than serving a long sentence and/or being deported back to Austria, he got a brief visit to a luxury prison giving him time to collect his thoughts, publish Mein Kampf, and be back in the action in a timely way. US cops are definitely showing a clear preference for extreme right politics, but above the street level I'm not seeing quite as much open enabling by our judicial system. J6 rioters are getting the book thrown at them.

Trump has his brownshirts in the form of fascist groups like the Proud Boys or III%er types, but while similar in type, there is no similarity in scale.

None of this is to diminish the threat that the extreme right poses to this country. Drawing parallels to history is a useful thought experiment, but there is no requirement for things to be an exact duplicate of the past to still happen. History rhymes but doesn't repeat.

More broadly, the attempts of MAGA fash to seize power can be compared to other fascist takeovers, not just to Hitler. I always found that Trump personally seems more like a bumbling, opportunistic Mussolini type rather than a dyed in the wool ideologue like Hilter.
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Old 27th May 2021, 04:48 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
I love surreal comedy .

Sleepy the Puppet Pres is already looking more and more like a budding Dictator than Trump ever did .
Do you have any examples of him becoming a dictator? Other than him being on the other team, that is.

Quote:
I accept he is only a stand - in for Susan Rice passing on Obama's rulings
Why do you accept it?

Quote:
And with his push to wipe out youngsters with the poison vaccines he is giving a good imitation of Genocide in full view .
When the vaccine doesn't end up killing people are you going to come back here to apologise for promoting such dangerous ideas?

Quote:
A great lover of the endless wars approach , Sleepy has wrecked Trump's foreign policy of not starting wars but finding solutions wherever possible .
No wars have been started. What are you talking about?
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Old 27th May 2021, 04:48 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
One crucial difference I see with the Germany of the 1920s-1930s and the USA of the 2020s is this (from the OP):


There is no such internal threat in the U.S. although trump and his supporters try and create one by endlessly bleating about "socialism." [See post above.] But in Germany it took the specter of a powerful Soviet Union and a worldwide Depression to bring Hitler to full power. We seemed to have dodged that bullet. The socialism meme works with certain people but I don't think most business and military leaders buy into it. Hopefully it stays that way but I agree, the threat is real.
I don't think it matters that the threat of socialism (or satanic baby-killing rituals) is real or not, so long as many people believe it.
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Old 27th May 2021, 05:15 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
And with his push to wipe out youngsters with the poison vaccines he is giving a good imitation of Genocide in full view .
Are you saying that the vaccines that Trump keeps on wanting credit for are poison? So you think that Trump created this poison and Biden is handing out the poison Trump had made? Are Trump and Biden in league?
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Old 27th May 2021, 05:30 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post

And with his push to wipe out youngsters with the poison vaccines he is giving a good imitation of Genocide in full view .
50 percent of the American public is vaccinated. When will people start dying?

I had both my teenage sons vaccinated in February - when will they die?
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Old 27th May 2021, 05:32 AM   #13
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to adopt a quote by Lenin *

In America you cannot have a Revolution because you might miss your favorite shows .

*
Quote:
in Germany ‘you cannot have a revolution because you have to step on the lawn'
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Old 27th May 2021, 05:35 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by TheSupermeerkat View Post
50 percent of the American public is vaccinated. When will people start dying?

I had both my teenage sons vaccinated in February - when will they die?
In the next two weeks.
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Old 27th May 2021, 05:44 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
In the next two weeks.
So... like The Money Pit.
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Old 27th May 2021, 07:23 AM   #16
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The only problem with Godwin's law is that it can lead people to the false assumption that nothing is ever like Hitler.
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Old 27th May 2021, 07:33 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
Both are Jewish in their bloodlines on both sides .
Even if true, so what? How would having Jewish ancestry be any more relevant than both of them disliking the smell of cat pee? It's hard not to see such a statement as an anti-Semitic dog whistle.
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Old 27th May 2021, 07:33 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
Both are Jewish in their bloodlines on both sides .
Bollocks. Even if I, or indeed anyone with a working brain, was to take the spewings of a cretin like 'pi equals four' Mathis seriously, why does "Jewish in their bloodlines" matter?
Except, of course, to the childishly stupid anti-semites out there.
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Old 27th May 2021, 07:41 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
Even if true, so what? How would having Jewish ancestry be any more relevant than both of them disliking the smell of cat pee? It's hard not to see such a statement as an anti-Semitic dog whistle.
That's not a dog whistle, that's a fog horn.
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Old 27th May 2021, 07:47 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
That's not a dog whistle, that's a fog horn.
Sorry, I can't hear you. I have a Jewish banana in my ear.
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Old 27th May 2021, 08:13 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
Sorry, I can't hear you. I have a Jewish banana in my ear.
I have been waiting for so long for this to be relevant so I could post it:

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
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Old 27th May 2021, 08:30 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
The only problem with Godwin's law is that it can lead people to the false assumption that nothing is ever like Hitler.
Thing is, Godwin's law is only about (the odds of) the Nazis being brought up in a conversation. It doesn't say whether the comparison or analogy is bad or unjustified.
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Old 27th May 2021, 08:33 AM   #23
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The guy who coined Godwin's Law is on record as saying that comparing modern GOP tactics/behaviors to Hitler is 100% on point.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...internet-rule/

https://www.esquire.com/news-politic...esville-nazis/
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Old 27th May 2021, 08:42 AM   #24
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I don't know. Does this really fit?

Quote:
Inside The Wild GOP Civil War by Kelly Weill

When Stephen Lloyd showed up at the Multnomah County, Oregon,
Republican Party’s most recent meeting on May 17, he was not treated
like a man who, until earlier this month, had been the group’s chairman.
“I was met by a group of Proud Boys who had their arms crossed in front
of their chest, kind of all puffed up in front of the doorways,” Lloyd told
The Daily Beast. Lloyd was allowed into the meeting, where he began
passing out documents detailing his concerns with the party’s recent
lurch to the far right. Others in his wing of the Portland, Oregon-based
GOP local were not so fortunate.

“I get a text message on my phone from one of our party members saying,
‘Stephen, they’re not letting me in the building,’” Lloyd said. “So I go downstairs.
I say, ‘Hey, why aren’t you letting a Republican Party member in the building?’
They said that she’s not a Republican Party member. And I said, ‘Yes, she is.
She’s registered as a Republican.’ And then they said, ‘Well, she’s not a precinct
chairperson. So she’s not allowed in the building.’” (The party’s acting secretary
and chair did not return requests for comment.)
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Old 27th May 2021, 09:22 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
One crucial difference I see with the Germany of the 1920s-1930s and the USA of the 2020s is this (from the OP):

There is no such internal threat in the U.S. although trump and his supporters try and create one by endlessly bleating about "socialism." [See post above.] But in Germany it took the specter of a powerful Soviet Union and a worldwide Depression to bring Hitler to full power. We seemed to have dodged that bullet. The socialism meme works with certain people but I don't think most business and military leaders buy into it. Hopefully it stays that way but I agree, the threat is real.
Yes to all of that.

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Are Trump and the GOP Leadership following the Dictators' Handbook?

No doubt.

They are Authoritarians at heart and see no point in the Rule of Law or Participatory Democracy unless it directly benefits them. ...


Hitlers rise to power would have been impossible without the massive support by industrialists and bankers who saw great profit in a dominant Germany.
Corporate America on the other hand is looking for China and, soon, India to make the Great Bucks, not the US. They don'T want to antagonize and alienate the rest of the world, and they have no time for far-right US Politicians who have proven to be, time and time again, to be simply incompetent.
If Dump had been re-elected we'd be in big trouble because with McConnell leading the moneyed masses along, there would be "industrialists and bankers who saw great profit" in Dump gutting all the environmental regulations and creating tax wonderlands just for them.


One big difference is Dump is incompetent. Another is Dump isn't about MAGA or anything remotely like it. Dump is about Dump. His mental illness is so severe he can't put his personal promotion aside even for a brief interval in order to strengthen his position in the country.

Thankfully for us he's too old to be much of a cult leader. Instead of his followers growing in numbers, after Jan 6 those followers are dispersing.

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Old 27th May 2021, 10:03 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Agreed, and to add. There's also not a similar level of outright revolutionary activity. You don't see Freikorps and communists fighting for literal control of cities and regions of the country. Hitler's grabs for power were among many other similar attempts, often with individual cities or regions briefly being declared independent sovereignty under this or that communist or extreme right authority. Lots of street fighting over turf was happening.

The right wing also enjoyed extreme leniency from the judicial system. Failed right wing coups were not a disaster for these people because they often ended with lenient wrist-slap sentences. Hilter personally failed to seize government and rather than serving a long sentence and/or being deported back to Austria, he got a brief visit to a luxury prison giving him time to collect his thoughts, publish Mein Kampf, and be back in the action in a timely way. US cops are definitely showing a clear preference for extreme right politics, but above the street level I'm not seeing quite as much open enabling by our judicial system. J6 rioters are getting the book thrown at them.

Trump has his brownshirts in the form of fascist groups like the Proud Boys or III%er types, but while similar in type, there is no similarity in scale.

None of this is to diminish the threat that the extreme right poses to this country. Drawing parallels to history is a useful thought experiment, but there is no requirement for things to be an exact duplicate of the past to still happen. History rhymes but doesn't repeat.

More broadly, the attempts of MAGA fash to seize power can be compared to other fascist takeovers, not just to Hitler. I always found that Trump personally seems more like a bumbling, opportunistic Mussolini type rather than a dyed in the wool ideologue like Hilter.
You make some very interesting points. I agree that, as of now at least, the scale of similarity is small. However, we have seen a distinct rise in the growth of the far right and in their boldness to act not only among the public but among the political leaders.

I especially like your statement that "there is no requirement for things to be an exact duplicate of the past to still happen. History rhymes but doesn't repeat." I also agree that "Trump... seems more like a bumbling, opportunistic Mussolini type rather than a dyed in the wool ideologue like Hilter,", but we must remember that Mussolini also managed to gain power through elections, not by force.

"J6 rioters are getting the book thrown at them."

But how harsh their actual sentences be? Many of them are negotiating plea deals. So far, none has actually been sentenced. This article gives an excellent rundown of who those arrested are by background, job, military history, etc. and was published only yesterday:

"What we know about the "unprecedented" U.S. Capitol riot arrests"
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:10 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I have been waiting for so long for this to be relevant so I could post it:

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I AGREE
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:10 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
I don't think it matters that the threat of socialism (or satanic baby-killing rituals) is real or not, so long as many people believe it.
Exactly. The Big Lie isn't real but as long as Trump gets his supporters to believe him, it's real to them and it affects how they vote. The vaccine is safe and effective but Monica 56 believes it's "poison" and many, mostly Republicans, believe it's being forced on them or is dangerous, etc. so they refuse to get vaccinated. It's all untrue, of course, but as long as they believe it, it has the effect the anti-vaxxers and conspiracists want.
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:23 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Yes to all of that.


If Dump had been re-elected we'd be in big trouble because with McConnell leading the moneyed masses along, there would be "industrialists and bankers who saw great profit" in Dump gutting all the environmental regulations and creating tax wonderlands just for them.


One big difference is Dump is incompetent. Another is Dump isn't about MAGA or anything remotely like it. Dump is about Dump. His mental illness is so severe he can't put his personal promotion aside even for a brief interval in order to strengthen his position in the country.

Thankfully for us he's too old to be much of a cult leader. Instead of his followers growing in numbers, after Jan 6 those followers are dispersing.
But Trump isn't the problem: he's the result. Look at the kinds of Republicans who are being elected in the red states. Republicans aren't voting for more moderate legislators, they're voting in more radical ones who are more competent like Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz or even crazier like MTG and Boebert. They aren't 'dispersing' at all. Trump supporters will get behind whatever far right candidate echos Trump which is why they are all kneeling before him at Mar a Lago.
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:33 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
.....
But how harsh their actual sentences be? Many of them are negotiating plea deals. So far, none has actually been sentenced. This article gives an excellent rundown of who those arrested are by background, job, military history, etc. and was published only yesterday:
....
I'm not sure that's a bad thing. Criminal trials are expensive and complex, and juries are unpredictable. If the people who just followed others into the building without hurting anybody or wrecking anything make a deal, that still serves justice. They will have a federal criminal conviction that will affect them the rest of their lives.

The ringleaders, the vandals, the people who attacked cops are the ones the prosecutors should focus on, with the intention of locking them up pretty much forever.
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:37 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
I'm not sure that's a bad thing. Criminal trials are expensive and complex, and juries are unpredictable. If the people who just followed others into the building without hurting anybody or wrecking anything make a deal, that still serves justice. They will have a federal criminal conviction that will affect them the rest of their lives.

The ringleaders, the vandals, the people who attacked cops are the ones the prosecutors should focus on, with the intention of locking them up pretty much forever.
Agreed.
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Old 27th May 2021, 10:38 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Exactly. The Big Lie isn't real but as long as Trump gets his supporters to believe him, it's real to them and it affects how they vote.
....
That goes back to the atomization of the media. It wasn't all that long ago that most of us got most of our information about the world from the network news broadcasts and the local daily paper. You didn't have to like it, but everybody shared the same fact base. Today it's possible for people to get all of their "information" from sources that only tell them what they already believe. The Trumpers, anti-vaxxers, stop the steal crowd etc. genuinely believe this stuff, and they can cite "sources" that support them.

Last edited by Bob001; 27th May 2021 at 10:41 AM.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:06 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Monica 56 View Post
....
And with his push to wipe out youngsters with the poison vaccines he is giving a good imitation of Genocide in full view .
....
Why do you believe this demented garbage? Seriously. What is are the sources of "information" that you rely on?
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:06 AM   #34
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In the article, Hett mentioned that after the war there remained Germans still loyal to Hitler just as there are those who will remain loyal to Trump no matter what.

Quote:
There were still hardcore Nazis in the 1950s in West Germany. They did not like the government. However, they got jobs and a new car and a new TV and they were doing OK economically.
I can attest to that. In 1957, my great-aunt and her husband returned to Germany so he could visit his brother whom he had not seen since a trip back to his native Germany in 1931. He had emigrated from there in 1912 and become a US citizen. He was shocked to find that his brother was still a loyal Nazi and had no feelings of guilt over the war at all. As Hett said, they were also doing quite well financially as they had their own shop, car and house but even so, the brother was still a Nazi at heart.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:13 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
That goes back to the atomization of the media. It wasn't all that long ago that most of us got most of our information about the world from the network news broadcasts and the local daily paper. You didn't have to like it, but everybody shared the same fact base. Today it's possible for people to get all of their "information" from sources that only tell them what they already believe. The Trumpers, anti-vaxxers, stop the steal crowd etc. genuinely believe this stuff, and they can cite "sources" that support them.
Absolutely. The trouble is, the sources they cite are just not credible but they won't accept that because they don't want to. As long as the source confirms their bias, they will accept it as true no matter what the actual facts or evidence say. One only has to look at the nonsense being spouted here by a certain poster to see that.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:14 AM   #36
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I'm no great student of history, but it has always fascinated me that the Nazi era only lasted 12 years, 1933 to 1945, and the worst crimes and atrocities happened during the last six or seven years. Once the collapse of civilization starts, it accelerates.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:15 AM   #37
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Here's the problem.

Go back tens years, give/take. Present the argument you would give to any random person ten years ago as to why getting all of our information from a handful of central sources is preferable.

"I'm from the future and while I understand why you want more varied news sources trust me ALL THE ONES YOU'RE GOING TO GET ARE COMPLETELY ******* BONKERS!" is the best I can do and that's not very convincing.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:18 AM   #38
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While it is true that there are some similarities between Trump and Hitler, but there are also a number of considerable differences between Trump and Hitler. As a result, I do not find that comparing Trump and Hitler does much good.

A biggest difference that I know of between Trump and Hitler is that came to power because he actually wanted to come to power, and that is why Hitler was middle-aged by the time he got into power.

Whereas Trump was much older when he came to power, and Trump got into power as the result of a weird quirk in the US electoral system that can enable a person who actually loses the popular vote but can still somehow manage to win the all important electoral college vote.

I still believe that Trump was probably about the most surprised person in the world when he found out that he would be the next President.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:23 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
But even though a huge number of Politicians and voters have not learned the lessons of the 20th Century, I have hope that the political class that actually matters has:

Corporate America.
I think we have reason for hope there. Remember Trump's business advisory councils that disbanded when they didn't like his reaction to Charlottesville? Corporations walked away from our version of Mussolini's National Council of Corporations.
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Old 27th May 2021, 11:26 AM   #40
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The biggest problem with the "Lookit history repeating itself" thing is how many people see it and WANT THINGS TO GO BADLY AGAIN just so they can be the "I toldyaso" guys.

The problem with history repeating itself is how often it is a self fulfilling prophecy.
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