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Tags glenn beck , racism charges

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Old 12th January 2022, 03:07 AM   #161
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
People can be racist only if they admit they are racist to non racists!

Oooh!!! We've got one of those!!
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Old 12th January 2022, 07:33 AM   #162
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Taking him at his word, Glenn Beck, looking for an inspirational photo for his wall, could only come up with one with a defeated black man who came back and helped inspire America vs. the Nazis. And he made sure that, when he was being filmed scamming his viewers with junk ads, the painting of the black man was visible in the frame.

Virtue signaling?
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Old 12th January 2022, 08:02 AM   #163
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
People can be racist only if they admit they are racist to non racists!
What exactly is the standard for determining that a person is not racist, or that a single action somebody takes is not racist?... because the excuses I'm seeing here for the accusations of racism consist entirely of ways to try to wiggle out of falsifiability and thus get to just arbitrarily proclaim that it's there, anywhere & everywhere the accuser feels like proclaiming it, even when nothing at all indicates that it is.

Reading this is the same experience as reading theists writing about how their God is totally obviously undeniably real but has been conveniently redefined (for the moment) as what sounds like a description of something that isn't real, with no traits or actions by which to distinguish it from something unreal... followed up with excuses for situations in which some kind of observation would normally be expected but "oh no no no, it wouldn't actually appear for you like that! It wants to stay mysterious!".
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Old 12th January 2022, 08:33 AM   #164
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Isnít this a bit like if a guy who was famous for appealing to, IDK, death metal satanists, had an inverted cross on his wall, and people went ďWell actually, thatís a Cross of Saint Peter, very well known Catholic saint, Iím pretty sure everybody knows that. The guy obviously venerates his martyrs, thatís why it ended up in his video where his fans can see itĒ
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Old 12th January 2022, 12:17 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by Lithrael View Post
Isnít this a bit like if a guy who was famous for appealing to, IDK, death metal satanists, had an inverted cross on his wall, and people went ďWell actually, thatís a Cross of Saint Peter, very well known Catholic saint, Iím pretty sure everybody knows that. The guy obviously venerates his martyrs, thatís why it ended up in his video where his fans can see itĒ
No, nothing at all like that cuz the guy with a history of appealing to death metal satanists told us he wasn't a death metal satanist.
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Old 12th January 2022, 12:32 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by Lithrael View Post
Isn’t this a bit like if a guy who was famous for appealing to, IDK, death metal satanists, had an inverted cross on his wall, and people went “Well actually, that’s a Cross of Saint Peter, very well known Catholic saint, I’m pretty sure everybody knows that. The guy obviously venerates his martyrs, that’s why it ended up in his video where his fans can see it”
It was back in post #55 that I offered this:

Originally Posted by Paul2 View Post
Perhaps it is a bit like a spouse losing 100 pounds and getting down to a nice, trim weight and the other spouse celebrating the diet by sharing a picture of how fat the spouse was before the diet. Tone-deaf at a bare minimum, more likely some form of being passive-aggressive.
ETA: Lithrael's analogy fits better than mine.
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Old 12th January 2022, 01:00 PM   #167
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I'm really not getting this whole accusation of dog whistling. Sounds a lot like conspiracy theorists insisting that the Illuminati is putting clues all over the place in public view. I mean...why? Are racists all hoisting their eyebrows up and down rapidly at each other over a painting of an early twentieth century boxing match? Isn't the simplest explanation that he is an historical boxing fan who is proud of the painting he did? I don't see why other racists are supposed to get all white-supremacist giddy over seeing this.

Eta: what is the dog whistle in this other work by Beck entitled "Fearless", featuring Jesse Owens?

https://glenn-beck.myshopify.com/col...s-poster-print
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Old 12th January 2022, 01:05 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
What exactly is the standard for determining that a person is not racist, or that a single action somebody takes is not racist?... because the excuses I'm seeing here for the accusations of racism consist entirely of ways to try to wiggle out of falsifiability and thus get to just arbitrarily proclaim that it's there, anywhere & everywhere the accuser feels like proclaiming it, even when nothing at all indicates that it is.

Reading this is the same experience as reading theists writing about how their God is totally obviously undeniably real but has been conveniently redefined (for the moment) as what sounds like a description of something that isn't real, with no traits or actions by which to distinguish it from something unreal... followed up with excuses for situations in which some kind of observation would normally be expected but "oh no no no, it wouldn't actually appear for you like that! It wants to stay mysterious!".
At the risk of having to repeat myself yet again it is not a matter of proclaiming anything about anyone, its a matter of looking at everything in totality, and deciding which of two (or more) ideas is more likely to be true. None of any of this happened in a vacuum - the attitudes and histories of the people involved are not only relevant, they are paramount to deciding what you believe.

If that painting was hanging on the wall in the office of Dr Martin Luther King Jr, it will invoke an entirely different meaning and significance than if it were hanging on the wall in the office of David Duke. The reason for this is clear and obvious - the history, record and the attitude of the person whose office it is.

Despite what people like Ziggurat would have you believe, the known history of racism and support for white supremacy exhibited by Glenn Beck over a number of nears is evidence that informs us of his motivation. That evidence cannot be simply hand-waved away.


I do not believe Glenn Becks bull-**** story.
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Old 12th January 2022, 03:23 PM   #169
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Okay granting Beck's wacky history and all that I still don't know where we go from here...

It's either veneration of the "American fighting spirit", maybe with a dash of racial tokenism, or a blatant racist dog whistle. Don't ya'll think the former is just as if not more likely given Beck's main audience and the circles he inhabits?
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Old 12th January 2022, 04:59 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
This is getting stupid.
It's 9-11 Truther-level stupid. The Truthers believe that those behind the attacks of 9-11 feel compelled to admit their guilt publicly, but, and here's the galling part, only the Truthers recognize it when it happens. It's like the dog-whistle racism; while only racists are suppose to hear it, amazingly liberals pick it up every time.
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Old 12th January 2022, 05:10 PM   #171
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
It's 9-11 Truther-level stupid. The Truthers believe that those behind the attacks of 9-11 feel compelled to admit their guilt publicly, but, and here's the galling part, only the Truthers recognize it when it happens. It's like the dog-whistle racism; while only racists are suppose to hear it, amazingly liberals pick it up every time.
Some people think they're using a dog whistle when they're really using a megaphone.
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Old 12th January 2022, 05:34 PM   #172
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This reminds me of anti-gay preachers who turn out to be gay, people who want to hunt down all the ubiquitous pedophiles all around them and turn out to be pedophiles themselves, a handful of oddballs in this forum who keep bringing up Bernie in the form of claims that others who don't do that are really the ones who are stuck on Bernie, and people who keep making accusations of sexism out of everything no matter how far from sexism the subject really is. The only way to keep coming up with such flimsy excuses to infuse race into everything is to actually be the type of person who routinely has race on stuck on your mind and can't go for long without thinking of race again yourself.
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Old 12th January 2022, 06:05 PM   #173
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
This reminds me of anti-gay preachers who turn out to be gay, people who want to hunt down all the ubiquitous pedophiles all around them and turn out to be pedophiles themselves, a handful of oddballs in this forum who keep bringing up Bernie in the form of claims that others who don't do that are really the ones who are stuck on Bernie, and people who keep making accusations of sexism out of everything no matter how far from sexism the subject really is. The only way to keep coming up with such flimsy excuses to infuse race into everything is to actually be the type of person who routinely has race on stuck on your mind and can't go for long without thinking of race again yourself.
Yeah, it's really 'us' who are the racists! What other comedies have you written?

And you say I can't let it go...LOL! And I don't bring up Bernie himself; I point out others...mostly just one... who moans and gripes and denigrates Biden constantly because he's not 'progressive' enough. And I did it two, maybe three, times in 77 pages.
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Old 12th January 2022, 06:56 PM   #174
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Isn't it weird that in boxing that gesture means "You're out!", but in baseball it means "You're safe!"?
Not to mention the most popular treat at a ball game has always been a hot dog, AKA wiener, a monstrosity that was inflicted on the world byÖGermany!
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Old 12th January 2022, 07:38 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
This reminds me of anti-gay preachers who turn out to be gay, people who want to hunt down all the ubiquitous pedophiles all around them and turn out to be pedophiles themselves, a handful of oddballs in this forum who keep bringing up Bernie in the form of claims that others who don't do that are really the ones who are stuck on Bernie, and people who keep making accusations of sexism out of everything no matter how far from sexism the subject really is. The only way to keep coming up with such flimsy excuses to infuse race into everything is to actually be the type of person who routinely has race on stuck on your mind and can't go for long without thinking of race again yourself.
Interesting idea. It is just like when Beck called Obama a racist. Then he apologized. Then took it back and said he really meant it.
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Old 12th January 2022, 08:58 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin View Post
Not to mention the most popular treat at a ball game has always been a hot dog, AKA wiener, a monstrosity that was inflicted on the world byÖGermany!
Weiner? A monstrosity?

Apparently, the women didn't think so!
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Old 13th January 2022, 08:00 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
Okay granting Beck's wacky history and all that I still don't know where we go from here...

It's either veneration of the "American fighting spirit", maybe with a dash of racial tokenism, or a blatant racist dog whistle. Don't ya'll think the former is just as if not more likely given Beck's main audience and the circles he inhabits?
But wouldn't a picture of the american winning be better for that?
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Old 13th January 2022, 08:27 AM   #178
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
But wouldn't a picture of the american winning be better for that?
Look at the two pics on page one. The one of Louis winning is just...not a visually artistic picture. Its kind of just him standing there and Schmeling on the mat. The pic of the ref in his dramatic pose makes the powerful look, I would think. Just from the visual impact, the ref pic is more striking, and isn't that what artwork is supposed to be about? I don't think art always needs to be about political positions.
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Old 13th January 2022, 09:19 AM   #179
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Ultimately, it really doesn't matter. Nothing here changes the fact that Beck went from a moderately funny radio talk show host to a full-on conspiracy theory, misinformation peddling sleazy nut-job. I don't know if he is genuinely racist or is merely playing a character so he can cash in on listeners' racism. Is there even really a difference? *shrug*
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Old 13th January 2022, 12:46 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
But wouldn't a picture of the american winning be better for that?
Definitely not. That's just not how the concept of "get knocked down, get back up" gets illustrated.

Seeing anybody suggest, as has now happened in this thread several times, that that concept would be expected to get illustrated with images of the second part instead of the first, is a very strange, almost surreal experience for me, it's so perfectly backward from reality. If it's just an ad-hoc lie concocted just to facilitate a political attack, then it makes nosense because nobody could be fooled. But... what if it isn't? For there to really actually be people so vastly disconnected from the culture I grew up in as to actually get something as basic as the "get knocked down, get back up" meme completely reversed, would be a fascinating case of schism between subcultures...
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Old 13th January 2022, 02:00 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Look at the two pics on page one. The one of Louis winning is just...not a visually artistic picture. Its kind of just him standing there and Schmeling on the mat. The pic of the ref in his dramatic pose makes the powerful look, I would think. Just from the visual impact, the ref pic is more striking, and isn't that what artwork is supposed to be about? I don't think art always needs to be about political positions.
It is better as a piece of artwork, but that is not why Beck painted it. It had nothing to do with 'art' but with a message.
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Old 13th January 2022, 02:47 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
It is better as a piece of artwork, but that is not why Beck painted it. It had nothing to do with 'art' but with a message.
Well, the schmuck fancies himself an artist, so maybe a little to do with artistic merit, seeing as both pics are different pages of the same story?

None of this excuses anything he's ever done or said, of course. But media characters aren't entirely one-dimensional. I'm pretty confident he could foster a sincere appreciation for messages he finds in pics of historical athletes on the side, while still being a world class chump.
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Old 13th January 2022, 06:07 PM   #183
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[quote=Thermal;13703028]Well, the schmuck fancies himself an artist,;/QUOTE]

He's actually not a bad artist.


Quote:
so maybe a little to do with artistic merit, seeing as both pics are different pages of the same story?
No.
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Old 13th January 2022, 08:59 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Definitely not. That's just not how the concept of "get knocked down, get back up" gets illustrated..
Rubbish.. THE iconic "redemption" boxing photo of all time is this one...



Ali (then still going by the name Clay) was 8–1 against with the bookies in the first flight. No-one gave him chance, but he won when Liston didn't come out for the seventh round. The fight was shrouded in controversy - there were accusations of a fix, and then Liston said he quit the fight because of a shoulder injury. All in all, it was being inferred that Clay wasn't any good as a fighter, he didn't "really" win. All this made Clay very angry - he felt he wasn't being given his due.

Then came the rematch, and this time, no messing around. The odds were still against Clay (8-5) but he put Liston on the deck in the first minute of the first round, and it was all over so quick that many people had not even taken their seats.

That photo above is the moment of Clay's redemption - from that moment the world really took him seriously... and what was he saying to Liston at that moment?

"Get up and fight, sucker!"
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Old 13th January 2022, 09:37 PM   #185
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Rubbish.. THE iconic "redemption" boxing photo of all time is this one...

That might be the most famous photo ever, of a boxer taking a dive. Liston is widely suspected of doing so. In boxing circles, it is known as the "phantom punch". Ali had already convincingly won the first fight between the two, retiring Liston on his stool. Hence, I don't see redemption as a major theme.

Louis was a 10-1 favorite over Schmeling in the first fight, which made his loss even more embarrassing.

Quote:
“He felt he’d let the entire black race down because he was not supposed to lose that fight. He was supposed to win it, and win it with great applause,” Louis Barrow Jr says, speaking from his home in Jacksonville, Florida.
Quote:
A few weeks before the rematch, Louis visited President Franklin Delano Roosevelt at the White House. The New York Times quoted Roosevelt as telling the fighter, "Joe, we need muscles like yours to beat Germany."

Ultimately, the story arc of Louis/Schmeling is a much, much greater tale of redemption.
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Old 13th January 2022, 10:42 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Rubbish..
Do you have an explanation for why my earlier image-searches came out as they did? It certainly looked to me like the results of image-searching an idea which is normally illustrated from the perspective of the "get knocked down" moment rather than the "get back up" moment.

Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
THE iconic "redemption" boxing photo of all time is this one...
That inspired another round of image-searching.

In the first page of results, almost all of the results for "boxing redemption" are emotionally neutral; both boxers are in the frame about equally and neither has clearly dramatically won or lost. Of the seven that clearly focused on a winner or loser, it was the loser five times and the winner two times.

I also tried "boxing revenge". This time, because an article with the word "revenge" in it could be just reporting what happened rather than telling a "get knocked down get back up" dramatic personal story, I clicked each of the nine images on the first page that showed a clear winner/loser, and read the page associated with each image to see which was which. (I don't know these people or their stories on sight myself.) I had to eliminate six as unusable for various reasons. (They didn't seem to have a real GKDGBU story being told, or the pages were long lists of different short articlets & associated images where the word "revenge" wasn't associated with the image I'd gone there for... one even turned out to be from a video game.) Of the remaining three, one showed when somebody got revenge, and two showed when somebody suffered the loss that he needed revenge for.

That's a total of 6/9 usable images in these two searches illustrating the GKDGBU/redemption story from the perspective of the initial loss/failure (I'll call this "type A" images below), and 3/9 illustrating it from the perspective of the later win/success (I'll call this "type B" images below). And it was more imbalanced than that in my earlier searches using phrases that were more focused on the concept as an inspirational motto associated with dramatic personal stories rather than more direct sports-reporting.

The images that have actually been produced and published and circulated to illustrate the GKDGBU/redemption narrative simply do not appear to be in agreement with you about how GKDGBU/redemption narratives are typically to be illustrated.

And remember, about the claim that Beck's description of that image as a "type A" image must not be true because the GKDGBU/redemption story must be illustrated with a "type B" image instead... disproving that claim didn't even require showing that "type A" is the only way to go or the more predominant way to go; it only requires showing that "type A" images are even a real thing at all. Showing not merely that they exist, but that they're actually most of the GKDGBU/redemption meme images out there by a significant margin, is just bonus, burying the claim even deeper.
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Old 13th January 2022, 10:54 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
That might be the most famous photo ever, of a boxer taking a dive. Liston is widely suspected of doing so. In boxing circles, it is known as the "phantom punch". Ali had already convincingly won the first fight between the two, retiring Liston on his stool.

Louis was a 10-1 favorite over Schmeling in the first fight, which made his loss even more embarrassing.






Ultimately, the story arc of Louis/Schmeling is a much, much greater tale of redemption.
Oh come off it.

Take the Clay/Liston fight fix to the CT section or Sports. Not here.
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:00 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Oh come off it.

Take the Clay/Liston fight fix to the CT section or Sports. Not here.
I'm commenting on the photo and bout referenced. I don't know or care about whether the fight was fixed; the point is that the photo is well-known for that. And it is a point of historical contention, among many. In fact, one could easily argue that the bout is most well-known for that controversy. "Redemption" is not really a major theme for that series, imo, as Ali won both. Perhaps "validation" is a better descriptor.

Why not focus on the bulk of my post, which explains why the Louis/Schmeling bouts are a much greater story of redemption?

Quote:
Louis was a 10-1 favorite over Schmeling in the first fight, which made his loss even more embarrassing.

Quote:
“He felt he’d let the entire black race down because he was not supposed to lose that fight. He was supposed to win it, and win it with great applause,” Louis Barrow Jr says, speaking from his home in Jacksonville, Florida.
Quote:
A few weeks before the rematch, Louis visited President Franklin Delano Roosevelt at the White House. The New York Times quoted Roosevelt as telling the fighter, "Joe, we need muscles like yours to beat Germany."

Ultimately, the story arc of Louis/Schmeling is a much, much greater tale of redemption.
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:22 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Do you have an explanation for why my earlier image-searches came out as they did? It certainly looked to me like the results of image-searching an idea which is normally illustrated from the perspective of the "get knocked down" moment rather than the "get back up" moment.

That inspired another round of image-searching.

In the first page of results, almost all of the results for "boxing redemption" are emotionally neutral; both boxers are in the frame about equally and neither has clearly dramatically won or lost. Of the seven that clearly focused on a winner or loser, it was the loser five times and the winner two times.

I also tried "boxing revenge". This time, because an article with the word "revenge" in it could be just reporting what happened rather than telling a "get knocked down get back up" dramatic personal story, I clicked each of the nine images on the first page that showed a clear winner/loser, and read the page associated with each image to see which was which. (I don't know these people or their stories on sight myself.) I had to eliminate six as unusable for various reasons. (They didn't seem to have a real GKDGBU story being told, or the pages were long lists of different short articlets & associated images where the word "revenge" wasn't associated with the image I'd gone there for... one even turned out to be from a video game.) Of the remaining three, one showed when somebody got revenge, and two showed when somebody suffered the loss that he needed revenge for.

That's a total of 6/9 usable images in these two searches illustrating the GKDGBU/redemption story from the perspective of the initial loss/failure (I'll call this "type A" images below), and 3/9 illustrating it from the perspective of the later win/success (I'll call this "type B" images below). And it was more imbalanced than that in my earlier searches using phrases that were more focused on the concept as an inspirational motto associated with dramatic personal stories rather than more direct sports-reporting.

The images that have actually been produced and published and circulated to illustrate the GKDGBU/redemption narrative simply do not appear to be in agreement with you about how GKDGBU/redemption narratives are typically to be illustrated.

And remember, about the claim that Beck's description of that image as a "type A" image must not be true because the GKDGBU/redemption story must be illustrated with a "type B" image instead... disproving that claim didn't even require showing that "type A" is the only way to go or the more predominant way to go; it only requires showing that "type A" images are even a real thing at all. Showing not merely that they exist, but that they're actually most of the GKDGBU/redemption meme images out there by a significant margin, is just bonus, burying the claim even deeper.
Here you go... see if you can find the Louis v Schmeling fight in this list of the worlds most iconic sport photos... and see which is number 1

https://www.thesportster.com/enterta...rts-history-2/

Back on Topic
I bring it back to this, and I will KEEP bringing it back to this, every time I see the irrelevant bollocks you and Ziggurat et al keep posting.

"Watch what they do, not what they say" . The biggest clue in this issue, the thing you must take notice of above all else, is the known history of the person in question. Glenn Beck is a KNOWN overt racist, a KNOWN supporter of white supremacism. This is the KEY thing you must keep in mind when he does anything....

"Its not a matter of trying to find excuses to not believe an explanation, its a matter of deciding what is more believable. In this case, a media personalty who is well-known for his overt racism and support of white supremacists, paints a picture of a well known black boxer on the canvas after having been knocked down by a white boxer from Nazi Germany (fully knowing that the Nazis used that event to promote their racist Aryan propaganda) hangs the painting in full view of his mostly racist followers as he talks to them, because

a. It reminds him about some noble issue regarding never being down and out, or

b. he's dog-whistling his racism to the racists who watch his show.

For mine, Glenn Beck's history of racism speaks loudly to his motivations, and leads me to believe that "b" is the most the obvious correct answer - I find the latter far more likely to be the truth than the redemption inspiration bull-**** he's been spewing. This guy is a grifter, he lies for a living - now you can call it "the boy who cried wolf" or "leopards never change their spots" - I don't care...

I . DO . NOT . BELIEVE . HIM !!!!
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:29 PM   #190
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Quote:
I . DO . NOT . BELIEVE . HIM !!!!
I keep seeing this stated, as though it adds credibility to a claim.
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:44 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
"Watch what they do, not what they say" . The biggest clue in this issue, the thing you must take notice of above all else, is the known history of the person in question. Glenn Beck is a KNOWN overt racist, a KNOWN supporter of white supremacism. This is the KEY thing you must keep in mind when he does anything....
No. Even stipulating that description of his general nature, the argument simply does not work. All of the other reasons other than racism why anybody anywhere might ever do anything still exist for racists. That means racists often do things for reasons which have nothing to do with their racism. Racism does not mean having racism as the one and only reason to ever do anything. To establish that everything they ever do is about racism, you need to eliminate everything else that would have applied to non-racists. Otherwise, all you've got is a combination of confirmation bias, circularity, and something along the lines of projection or mind-reading. It's self-refuting irrationality right from the start, even in its general formula, no matter who the individual you apply it to is, or what specific thing they did in a particular case, or what one single aspect of them is the one you have your mind on the most.

Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
a. It reminds him about some noble issue regarding never being down and out, or

b. he's dog-whistling his racism to the racists who watch his show.
"B" is rather implausible all by itself, including for an actual racist, even if we didn't have a thoroughly common & ordinary alternative "A" to compare it with.
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Old 14th January 2022, 12:27 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
No. Even stipulating that description of his general nature, the argument simply does not work. All of the other reasons other than racism why anybody anywhere might ever do anything still exist for racists. That means racists often do things for reasons which have nothing to do with their racism. Racism does not mean having racism as the one and only reason to ever do anything. To establish that everything they ever do is about racism, you need to eliminate everything else that would have applied to non-racists. Otherwise, all you've got is a combination of confirmation bias, circularity, and something along the lines of projection or mind-reading. It's self-refuting irrationality right from the start, even in its general formula, no matter who the individual you apply it to is, or what specific thing they did in a particular case, or what one single aspect of them is the one you have your mind on the most.

"B" is rather implausible all by itself, including for an actual racist, even if we didn't have a thoroughly common & ordinary alternative "A" to compare it with.
It must be wonderful for you to go through life totally oblivious to reality.
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Old 14th January 2022, 12:35 AM   #193
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
That photo above is the moment of Clay's redemption
No. That's the moment of his triumph. There is a difference. He wasn't defeated in the first match.
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Old 14th January 2022, 12:48 AM   #194
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No. That's the moment of his triumph. There is a difference. He wasn't defeated in the first match.
Did you bother reading any of the rest of the post... I mean, if you had, you would have seen the context. But alas, no. You just prefer to pull stupid comments out of your nether regions.

Pro Tip: You don't actually have to loose step one for step two to be redemption
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Old 14th January 2022, 01:54 AM   #195
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
That photo above is the moment of Clay's redemption
No. That's the moment of his triumph. There is a difference. He wasn't defeated in the first match.
Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Did you bother reading any of the rest of the post... I mean, if you had, you would have seen the context. But alas, no. You just prefer to pull stupid comments out of your nether regions.

Pro Tip: You don't actually have to loose step one for step two to be redemption
Exactly. Zig has them backwards. Redemption is in his moment of triumph, not his loss. But that's only according to dictionary definition. Whadda they know?

redemption ; 1 ∑ the act of making something better or more acceptable


Synonyms: vindication, retrieval, recovery, fulfillment, making good, accomplishment.
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Old 14th January 2022, 02:31 AM   #196
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Exactly. Zig has them backwards. Redemption is in his moment of triumph, not his loss. But that's only according to dictionary definition. Whadda they know?

redemption ; 1 ∑ the act of making something better or more acceptable


Synonyms: vindication, retrieval, recovery, fulfillment, making good, accomplishment.
Republicans have everything backwards. Why would their understanding of the English language be an exception?
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Old 14th January 2022, 04:08 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Exactly. Zig has them backwards. Redemption is in his moment of triumph, not his loss. But that's only according to dictionary definition. Whadda they know?

redemption ; 1 ∑ the act of making something better or more acceptable


Synonyms: vindication, retrieval, recovery, fulfillment, making good, accomplishment.
Ali never lost to Liston. There was nothing for him to seek redemption for.

Nobody says, "I soundly vanquished my foe in the first fight by making him quit. Then I redeemed myself by beating him up a second time".

Louis being vanquished and then beating Schmeling, however, is a tale of redemption. The moment of Louis being counted out on the canvas set the stage for that. If he wins the first fight, there is no story of redemption. Period.

Of course, we all know this.
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Old 14th January 2022, 07:47 AM   #198
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Of course the actual context of the image is a narrative of a struggle that will eventually be won (and heck, Schmeling was actually a pretty cool guy iirc).

But without context itís just a picture of a black guy put on the mat by a white guy, and if thereís one thing I know about Nazi fans and white supremacists, itís that they elevate ignoring context to an art form.

Call this mind-reading if you will.
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Old 14th January 2022, 08:05 AM   #199
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The choice to call them a black guy and a white guy instead of just guys (or even just people) was yours.
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Old 14th January 2022, 08:17 AM   #200
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Yes it bloody well was. Because they actually are, I know itís hard to see this, a black guy and a white guy.

Iíve never run into a more obvious example of how disingenuous this Ďcolorblindí **** is.
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