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Tags ADE 651 , bomb detectors , dowsing , electronic dowsing , gt200 , H3 Tec , sniffex

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Old 16th February 2009, 03:52 PM   #1
patchbunny
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H3 Gold detector? Wha?

Found a thread on the Mythbusters forums talking about the H3Tec Treasure detector. Apaprently, it can detect atoms from up to 2 miles away through "Nano-Ionic Resonance" Enter in what you're looking for, and it will key in on those atoms.

Looking about the archives, I can't find mention of this anywhere. Anyone know about it? Is this related to that DKL detector that Tom Clancy fell for?
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Old 16th February 2009, 04:06 PM   #2
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Sounds a lot like the "sniffex". Search "dowsing" and you'll probably find it or a sibling discussed here. I know I've read quite a few posts here over the years related to similar claims.
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Old 17th February 2009, 06:57 AM   #3
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Human fingernails contain gold. Are they marketing this as a personfinder?
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Old 17th February 2009, 07:27 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Silly Green Monkey View Post
Human fingernails contain gold. Are they marketing this as a personfinder?
I believe they market it as being able to do that, as well as find explosives. Another article is here.
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Old 17th February 2009, 07:57 AM   #5
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Yes, sounding more and more like the sniffex:
http://www.randi.org/jr/2007-02/022307sniffex.html#i1

H3 TEC sure smells like a clever dowsing scam along the same lines. I'd love to see an actual test.
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Old 25th March 2009, 10:36 PM   #6
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I personally saw and held an H3Tec unit at a recent Treasure Show. It is definitely just a dowsing rod, nothing else.

At one point, I saw two potential "customers" with units outside, looking for a hidden silver coin (the units were "programmed" for silver). I walked out to see how they were doing, they were having zero luck getting the H3Tec to work. Both of them scanned me, and completely failed to get any response from the 10-ounce silver bar I was carrying.

I also attended the H3Tec seminar, where I listened to their "technical" claims. It was 100% nonsense.
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Old 25th March 2009, 11:21 PM   #7
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I'll bet it can find one of the oceans easy...
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Old 1st August 2009, 07:49 PM   #8
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Mr. Omar Oliblish

Originally Posted by patchbunny View Post
Found a thread on the Mythbusters forums talking about the H3Tec Treasure detector. Apaprently, it can detect atoms from up to 2 miles away through "Nano-Ionic Resonance" Enter in what you're looking for, and it will key in on those atoms.

Looking about the archives, I can't find mention of this anywhere. Anyone know about it? Is this related to that DKL detector that Tom Clancy fell for?
The H3Tec is part of Charles L. Christensen. Chuck got some of his technology from Stephen Jepson of Spring City, Utah. Stephen was the master, who really found things with his unit, but Charles did not know a lot about it, none the less Charles decided to commercialize it for his "gold" I worked with Stephen for a few years. He and I were of the best of friends and shared common knowledge for a long time. Unfortunately Stephen Jepson passed away a few months ago and left his partners without the vital knowledge to operate his LRL. The problems with the H3Tec is that it hits and misses, but mostly misses, because what they do not know, Stephen did, but did not pass on. Also when they do get theirs working, they cannot define whether they are reading on flower gold, a gold vein or a solid brick or coin of gold. Here in Utah there are endless small deposits of flower gold in them there hills and since they cannot tell the relative density when they do have it working correctly, it makes for a lot of digging. The depth of a target was also mastered by Stephen Jepson and Chuck cannot do it. I have one of Stephens units and it can be built for about $1,200.00, but the detection technology and knowledge takes a long time to teach and I am not in the business of commercializing it.
Sincerely, Omar
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Old 1st August 2009, 08:34 PM   #9
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Guys, my wife looks at me disapprovingly when I speak of my curse-removal scam service. And I grew up in a nest of lawyers, so I know how to make it "for entertainment purposes only." Yeesh, if these guys can stay outta jail i should have no problem.

However, every phony name I come up with, somebody else is running a scam providing a service under that name.

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Old 1st August 2009, 09:14 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Omar Oliblish View Post
Stephen was the master, who really found things with his unit
No he didn't.
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Old 1st August 2009, 09:55 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Omar Oliblish View Post
The H3Tec is part of Charles L. Christensen. Chuck got some of his technology from Stephen Jepson of Spring City, Utah. Stephen was the master, who really found things with his unit, but Charles did not know a lot about it, none the less Charles decided to commercialize it for his "gold" I worked with Stephen for a few years. He and I were of the best of friends and shared common knowledge for a long time. Unfortunately Stephen Jepson passed away a few months ago and left his partners without the vital knowledge to operate his LRL. The problems with the H3Tec is that it hits and misses, but mostly misses, because what they do not know, Stephen did, but did not pass on. Also when they do get theirs working, they cannot define whether they are reading on flower gold, a gold vein or a solid brick or coin of gold. Here in Utah there are endless small deposits of flower gold in them there hills and since they cannot tell the relative density when they do have it working correctly, it makes for a lot of digging. The depth of a target was also mastered by Stephen Jepson and Chuck cannot do it. I have one of Stephens units and it can be built for about $1,200.00, but the detection technology and knowledge takes a long time to teach and I am not in the business of commercializing it.
Sincerely, Omar
Cant accept that- technology is almost impossible to hide.

Everything built has a principle of physics, an application of said and is constructed of parts to perform that function.

For a device to operate- it has to follow that process. There are many devices we know are 100% theoretically" possible but the technology/materials/power to construct them hasnt been developed. ( part 3 above)

These dowsing rod "thingies" have a weak thread on 1 above but dont work on 2 and 3.
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Old 28th December 2009, 03:25 AM   #12
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Scamola!

Anyone who knows anything of panning for gold knows that EVERY tributary, river, creek etc in the world has gold in it. Its simply so minute and sparse its not easy to find. Anyone claiming to have a detector that can detect it from 2 miles is a scam artist! If it were possible, the detector could detect an atom of gold no less than 10 feet from where you were standing, probably leap out of your hand and bury itself in the ground if it were that sensitive 2 miles away. This fellow is simply too lazy to pan for it and trying to make money from gold by bilking others. There are atoms of gold beneath your feet just about anywhere there is soil period! Atoms of gold are all around you. Its simply isnt economically feasible to retrieve it.

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Old 28th December 2009, 02:01 PM   #13
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The Batteries Are Dead In My Dowsing Rod

H3 Tec won the Scum of the Minute Award from Skeptic's Dictionary

Scum of the Minute

First place goes to H3 Tec, promoter of nano-ionic resonance as the key to detecting the presence of stuff. The H3 Tec is the latest replacement for the Quadro Tracker and the DKL Lifeguard. You have to wonder why there are still undetected roadside bombs going off in Iraq. This fantastic device should be detecting them without fail. In any case, after this endless war, the devices can be used to find lost golf balls or dentures.

http://www.skepdic.com/news/newsletter103.html

What do you get when you wrap a dowsing rod with a metal case? An easy way to find Gold? Oil? Drugs? Explosives? Landmines? No, you get H3 Tec's glorified metal stick inside a metal case. The inventor apparently was inspired by Star Trek into building his own "tricorder." The result is as much science fiction fantasy as the show.

http://sniffexquestions.blogspot.com...-military.html

It seems some people still have their old fashioned BS detectors on high.
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Old 11th July 2010, 02:34 PM   #14
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H3Tec Update

I've just obtained an H3Tec device. There is no question, it is a dowsing rod scam. They have also just been awarded a patent on it, US7750634, which even shows a drawing of a dowsing rod (Fig 3), demonstrating that the USPTO will approve anything without question.
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Old 12th July 2010, 12:18 AM   #15
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United States Patent 7,750,634
Christensen July 6, 2010
Methods and apparatus for detecting elements and compounds
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Old 12th July 2010, 12:57 AM   #16
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They be good for losing the winter blues,like the ones doctors recommend,especially if they discover gold in the living room.
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Old 12th July 2010, 07:03 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by TechHead View Post
I've just obtained an H3Tec device. There is no question, it is a dowsing rod scam. They have also just been awarded a patent on it, US7750634, which even shows a drawing of a dowsing rod (Fig 3), demonstrating that the USPTO will approve anything without question.
How about posting some pics?
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Old 12th July 2010, 07:12 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by TechHead View Post
I've just obtained an H3Tec device. There is no question, it is a dowsing rod scam. They have also just been awarded a patent on it, US7750634, which even shows a drawing of a dowsing rod (Fig 3), demonstrating that the USPTO will approve anything without question.
If you know that this doesn't work, why not open an inter partes reexamination on the patent?
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Old 12th July 2010, 07:52 AM   #19
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Is there a process for suggesting a reexamination of the technical qualifications of the patent examiner?
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Old 12th July 2010, 07:54 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Kestrel View Post
Is there a process for suggesting a reexamination of the technical qualifications of the patent examiner?
Heck no. Objections must be to the patent, not the examiner.
That'd go over like a ton of bricks.
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Old 12th July 2010, 07:57 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by AvalonXQ View Post
If you know that this doesn't work, why not open an inter partes reexamination on the patent?
IIRC, patented items don't have to work.
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Old 12th July 2010, 08:03 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by LTC8K6 View Post
IIRC, patented items don't have to work.
If the disclosure doesn't allow one of ordinary skill in the art to practice what the patent claims, the patent doesn't meet the enablement requirement and is invalid.

IOW, patented items have to work.
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Old 12th July 2010, 08:11 AM   #23
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I'm pretty sure you can find lots of patented things that don't work. I think I've had this conversation a few times before regarding other patented devices such as the MEG.

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/6,362,718
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Old 12th July 2010, 09:14 AM   #24
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Patents don't have to work, they just have to show something new or innovative in their design or construction.
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Old 12th July 2010, 10:44 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by LTC8K6 View Post
I'm pretty sure you can find lots of patented things that don't work. I think I've had this conversation a few times before regarding other patented devices such as the MEG.

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/6,362,718
Again, what has to work is what you claim. If following the instructions in the patent won't lead to an invention that matches the claims, then the patent isn't valid.
What part of the patent claims in the patent you linked to above won't work?
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Old 12th July 2010, 01:25 PM   #26
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The MEG is a well known bogus free-energy device that has a patent. It was all over the internet a few years ago. I was involved in a few discussions here and there about it along with other such devices. The free energy never materialized, of course.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motionl...etic_generator
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Old 12th July 2010, 01:33 PM   #27
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The MEG patent doesn't claim free energy. It claims this:

Quote:
An electromagnetic generator comprising: a permanent magnet having magnetic poles at opposite ends; a magnetic core including first and second magnetic paths between said opposite ends of said permanent magnet, wherein said magnetic core comprises a closed loop, said permanent magnet extends within said closed loop, and said opposite ends of said permanent magnet are disposed adjacent opposite sides of said closed loop and against internal surfaces of said magnetic core comprising said closed loop; a first input coil extending around a portion of said first magnetic path, a second input coil extending around a portion of said second magnetic path, a first output coil extending around a portion of said first magnetic path for providing a first electrical output; a second output coil extending around a portion of said second magnetic path for providing a second electrical output; and a switching circuit driving electrical current alternately through said first and second input coils, wherein said electrical current driven through said first input coil causes said first input coil to produce a magnetic field opposing a concentration of magnetic flux from said permanent magnet within said first magnetic path, and said electrical current driven through said second input coil causes said second input coil to produce a magnetic field opposing a concentration of magnetic flux from said permanent magnet within said second magnetic path.
If the patent teaches you how to do that, then the patent is enabled.

In contrast, the patent for the OP device is claiming a process for detection. If the device can't actually detect according to the claimed process, then someone should get the patent invalidated.
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Old 12th July 2010, 01:42 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Omar Oliblish View Post
The H3Tec is part of Charles L. Christensen. Chuck got some of his technology from Stephen Jepson of Spring City, Utah. Stephen was the master, who really found things with his unit, but Charles did not know a lot about it, none the less Charles decided to commercialize it for his "gold" I worked with Stephen for a few years. He and I were of the best of friends and shared common knowledge for a long time. Unfortunately Stephen Jepson passed away a few months ago and left his partners without the vital knowledge to operate his LRL. The problems with the H3Tec is that it hits and misses, but mostly misses, because what they do not know, Stephen did, but did not pass on. Also when they do get theirs working, they cannot define whether they are reading on flower gold, a gold vein or a solid brick or coin of gold. Here in Utah there are endless small deposits of flower gold in them there hills and since they cannot tell the relative density when they do have it working correctly, it makes for a lot of digging. The depth of a target was also mastered by Stephen Jepson and Chuck cannot do it. I have one of Stephens units and it can be built for about $1,200.00, but the detection technology and knowledge takes a long time to teach and I am not in the business of commercializing it.
Sincerely, Omar
Whew! Let's all be thankful that this doesn't apply to all technology... in that devices stop working when the inventor of said devices dies.

Planes dropping from the skies on the day of Orville Wright's passing. Thomas Edison dies and light bulbs begin winking out around the world. That'd sure suck.
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Old 12th July 2010, 01:42 PM   #29
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Eh, never mind on the reexam. The USPTO won't examine enablement issues on reexam.
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Old 12th July 2010, 02:56 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Psiload View Post
Whew! Let's all be thankful that this doesn't apply to all technology... in that devices stop working when the inventor of said devices dies.

Planes dropping from the skies on the day of Orville Wright's passing. Thomas Edison dies and light bulbs begin winking out around the world. That'd sure suck.
Our trusty HP Laserjet blew its power supply in dramatic fashion the day Bill Packard died.

Spooky.
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Old 13th July 2010, 09:58 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by AvalonXQ View Post
The MEG patent doesn't claim free energy. It claims this:



If the patent teaches you how to do that, then the patent is enabled.

In contrast, the patent for the OP device is claiming a process for detection. If the device can't actually detect according to the claimed process, then someone should get the patent invalidated.
If it's a novel process then that's enough. If it doesn't work then nobody will buy your device. Patent Clerks don't have to have the device demonstrated to them, they just have to make sure no one else has a patent for the same thing.
there are thousands of patents for devices that have never been built ot tried out. How will you know if they work or not?
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Old 13th July 2010, 10:42 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
If it's a novel process then that's enough.
You have to actually teach how to perform the novel process, though -- and the novel process actually has to have some utility. But I agree that, in reality:
Quote:
Patent Clerks don't have to have the device demonstrated to them, they just have to make sure no one else has a patent for the same thing.
... which means that while there's an enablement requirement in theory, in practice many patents never met it and never had to demonstrate that they did. This disclosure is presumed enabled. This is a problem.
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Old 13th July 2010, 02:15 PM   #33
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Holy hannah, are the Iraqis spending our aid money on these, too??

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Old 22nd August 2010, 10:34 AM   #34
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H3Tec: A detailed look at a dowsing rod scam

Most people have heard of Sniffex, Quadro Tracker, DKL Lifeguard, ADE 651, and GT200. They are all products with claims of being able to remotely detect and indicate the presence of drugs, explosives, or live people. They are also all dowsing rod scams.

All of these products have been objectively tested and found to work no better than random chance guessing. In some cases (Quadro, Sniffex, ADE 651) the makers have been arrested for fraud. (Any news on Jim McCormick? Arrested in Jan, nothing more since...)

Another product has emerged: H3Tec. They are based in Ogden, Utah and the principles are Chuck and Kathy Christensen. I first ran into H3Tec at the Texas Treasure Show where they were selling the units as long-range (5 miles) treasure detectors. I was told that 2 units were sold at the show, for $10,000 each. A pic of the unit is below.

The Christensens also claim the H3Tec has been sold to the US Military for IED detection, and their promotional video shows a couple of GIs using it, see pic below. They also claim it is being used in oil exploration, and can also detect "certain" drugs.

I have obtained an H3Tec unit and performed testing and a complete teardown of the device. As I get time, I will post pics and discussions of what I found, and also various communications with the Christensens in which they threaten me. This should be entertaining!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg H3inCase.jpg (149.5 KB, 49 views)
File Type: jpg Military.jpg (62.6 KB, 34 views)
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Old 22nd August 2010, 10:47 AM   #35
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What did you pay for your unit? Do the Christensens have a web site?
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Old 22nd August 2010, 10:55 AM   #36
Gord_in_Toronto
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Gosh darn that looks so wonderfully high tech. How can it not work?

If you get a chance, could you ask about the significance of what looks like a diagram of a Lithium atom on the case?
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Old 22nd August 2010, 11:20 AM   #37
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The web site is http://www.h3tec.com.

I did not buy the unit, it was loaned to me. The owner is a little apprehensive about being sued by the Christensens (more on this later) so I cannot reveal how much was paid, and even the photos I post of the unit will be in B&W.

The significance of the atom is that it looks high-tech, therefore the device must be high-tech.
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Old 22nd August 2010, 11:30 AM   #38
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Well done TechHead. I'm very interested in your tear down and can't wait to see the Christensens squirm.
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Old 22nd August 2010, 11:40 AM   #39
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Hmmm... I know people living in Ogden right now. Maybe they can pre-emptively save some lives with some well-placed molotovs?
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Old 22nd August 2010, 12:04 PM   #40
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After looking at that first picture in the OP, I'm wondering if the H3 scans for body thetans?

Just noticed this thread on the H3:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=135646

Last edited by jimtron; 22nd August 2010 at 12:09 PM.
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