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Tags chiropractic , John McTimoney

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Old 10th June 2009, 08:03 PM   #1
AndyD
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McTimoney Chiropractic in hiding?

I see this has been mentioned in the Simon Singh vs BCA thread but it is a story in its own right and deserves, I feel, it's own thread. If the mods disagree I guess I can live with that.

The science and sceptical blogosphere is alive with news that McTimoney Chiropractic Association has sent an email to all its members telling them to basically get rid of any advertising material that could see them prosecuted as a result of complaints to the General Chiropractic Council.

I've blogged it at McTimoney Chiropractic re-aligned

But it is better covered by UK bloggers who were involved in the complaints campaign that resulted in this highly unusual action. There's a growing list of articles on my site linked above but here are some of the earliest:

Zeno's Blog: McTimoney Chiropractic Association
Quackometer: McTimoney Chiropractic Association
Lay Scientist: McTimoney Chiropractic Association
Chiropracticlive: McTimoney Chiropractic Association - rumoured to have leaked the email.
Gimpy Blog: McTimoney Chiropractic Association
DC's Improbable Science: McTimoney Chiropractic Association

Last edited by AndyD; 10th June 2009 at 08:11 PM. Reason: had a few more minutes so added links here
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Old 11th June 2009, 02:29 AM   #2
Michael C
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Wow! Now who's looking silly? Maybe they should just put "For Entertainment Only" stickers on all their publicity material.

Here's Pharyngula and Times Online.
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Old 11th June 2009, 04:20 AM   #3
rjh01
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But is it a real e-mail or a fake? I know it is all over the Internet but that proves nothing.

I suppose the evidence that it is real is the fact that many Chiropractors have changed their webpages all in the last day or so. Is there any other evidence?
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Old 11th June 2009, 04:30 AM   #4
JJM
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Originally Posted by rjh01 View Post
But is it a real e-mail or a fake? I know it is all over the Internet but that proves nothing.

I suppose the evidence that it is real is the fact that many Chiropractors have changed their webpages all in the last day or so. Is there any other evidence?
The fact that McTimoney site http://www.mctimoney-chiropractic.org/ is changed is good evidence. In the "sticky" thread on S. Singh you can find the archived McTimoney page, including the false claims.
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Old 11th June 2009, 06:31 AM   #5
AndyD
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There were two primary things supporting this as the real deal.

Firstly, it was apparently leaked by an ex-communicated chiropractor, Richard Lanigan (chiropracticlive.com), who has enough on his plate fighting his own battle with the GCC, without resorting to outright fraud (I would think).

Secondly, though more telling by far, is as JJM points out above - McTimoney's own website (including internal pages which often survive half-hearted purges) has gone.

So, for this not to be genuine, we would presumably be looking at a fraud and hacking scenario combined.

(I'm not a lawyer but it looks clear-cut to a layman like me).

The strange thing, I guess, is that the mainstream media don't seem to have noticed it yet. But they often seem to miss negative stories about CAM while they're busy looking for the next "Amazing Breakthrough". They might also be frightened of libel threats.

Oh, and before anyone says "Wow! Great news for Simon Singh!" - it really is unlikely to have much impact beyond a short-lived warm, fuzzy glow. The MCA is not the BCA. Even if it were, this wouldn't prove they "knew there was no evideince" when Singh wrote his article AND, Simon Singh doesn't claim the BCA were knowingly promoting bogus treatments so even if there was evidence that they were, that wouldn't help his current appeal against that notion.

At least, that's how I see it. But, as I repeat often on my blog, no one should take my word for anything.
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Old 11th June 2009, 10:15 AM   #6
JJM
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http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=145176
Quote:
{snip} However, if that's not the case, and it seems as if there hasn't been time for that to have happened, then we really ought to ask, who leaked?

Rolfe.
If anyone knows, it is best to be quiet rather than close a source of information. It is important that we know the document is legitimate; but the shutdown of the web-pages is strong evidence for it.
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Old 11th June 2009, 12:04 PM   #7
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You have to wonder, though, what effect that this must be having on a graduate with the brand new shingle dangling outside his office is thinking. Providing that he isn't already totally cynical about the profession which he just spent years of his life and considerable wealth learning, and that the teachers, cynical or not, have finished jamming down his throat, he's got to be wondering, "What the hell? Why do we have to be doing this? Wasn't the prof right about all those adjustments that I have practiced for years?" It's got to be a major bummer. It's likely to be too late to change them, but I do hope it really shakes some of them up.
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Old 11th June 2009, 01:32 PM   #8
BenBurch
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Does this have any effect on the suit the Bogus Chiropractors Association has against Simon Singh?
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Old 11th June 2009, 03:14 PM   #9
shadron
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Ben, AndyD (along with Jack of Kent and BlueWode, of course) seems to be our unofficial liaison with this affair. If you don't read anyone else's postings here, at least read his; in particular the one that is three postings ahead of yours.

Last edited by shadron; 11th June 2009 at 03:16 PM.
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Old 11th June 2009, 03:45 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by shadron View Post
Ben, AndyD (along with Jack of Kent and BlueWode, of course) seems to be our unofficial liaison with this affair. If you don't read anyone else's postings here, at least read his; in particular the one that is three postings ahead of yours.
OK, thanks!

You know, what they are doing is just SO wrong.

And I am seriously thinking a book on the BCA, this suit, and the bunkum that is Chiropractic ought to be written, and maybe I should write it.

Because they COULD sue me, but I have almost nothing they could get out of me in a suit.
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Old 11th June 2009, 10:21 PM   #11
AndyD
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I read "somewhere" that when faced with a libel suit, you should never claim to be virtually broke. I can't remember the reasoning though - probably because you're actually a much easier target if you can't even afford a lawyer (legal aid often doesn't extend to libel cases - I believe).

You'd still have a hefty publishing bill to pay and no books left to sell after they're all recalled because you couldn't defend them.

Re the leak: It "appears" to have come from Richard Lanigan and since he posted it in full on his own blog, I don't think he wants his identity kept secret. As for how he got it, you'd have to ask him that but he is/was a chiropractor.

BTW, I'm not an official liaison/source. I just noticed it wasn't already posted here so I posted it. I have maintained a reasonable list of blogs covering it though. The Times Online have posted a short article on it now too.

For legal opinion, stick with Jack of Kent. For direct information on the campaign, stick with the bloggers involved, like zeno.
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Old 12th June 2009, 06:35 PM   #12
shadron
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Originally Posted by AndyD View Post
BTW, I'm not an official liaison/source. I just noticed it wasn't already posted here so I posted it. I have maintained a reasonable list of blogs covering it though. The Times Online have posted a short article on it now too.

For legal opinion, stick with Jack of Kent. For direct information on the campaign, stick with the bloggers involved, like zeno.
Absolutely; you may notice I used the term "unofficial", but you do seem to have your ear to the ground. In any case, you had the answer to Ben's question.
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Old 13th June 2009, 12:39 AM   #13
AndyD
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Quote:
Absolutely; you may notice I used the term "unofficial"
Yes, I see.

Note to self: Must learn to read, must learn to read...

It would appear, from the Lay Science blog, that the BCA and UCA have also sent out notices now, though somewhat less alarmist than the MCA email.
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Old 13th June 2009, 09:17 AM   #14
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According to the other thread, the Osteopaths are beginning to get a twinge, as well. Just rather some rather sharply worded admonishments about misleading advertisements in their forums, at this point. There's also a link to the blog of the guy who did the initial complaints about the 500 chiros, and how exactly he went about it. See http://www.internationalskeptics.com...&postcount=354

Last edited by shadron; 13th June 2009 at 09:22 AM.
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