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Tags Andrew Wakefield , GMC

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Old 28th January 2010, 08:04 AM   #1
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Andrew Wakefield - GMC ruling

Breaking news:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/20...l-children-gmc

Quote:
Dr Andrew Wakefield, the expert at the centre of the MMR controversy, "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant" and did not act in the best interests of children involved in his research, the General Medical Council (GMC) ruled today.

Wakefield also acted dishonestly and was misleading and irresponsible in the way he described research which was later published in The Lancet medical journal, the GMC said.
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:07 AM   #2
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FYI...

"MMR" stands for "Measles, Mumps and Rubella" and refers to the vaccine.

So, is the OP anti-vax or pro-vax?
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:08 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Nothing like a speedy conclusion....what's that, 12 years later?
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:11 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
Nothing like a speedy conclusion....what's that, 12 years later?

Conclusion? From the story in the OP:
Quote:
Verdicts on the "facts" to the allegations were delivered at the disciplinary hearing in central London.

The GMC will now decide whether these verdicts could amount to serious professional misconduct – which will be debated at a later date.
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:12 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
Nothing like a speedy conclusion....what's that, 12 years later?
Quote:
The GMC will now decide whether these verdicts could amount to serious professional misconduct – which will be debated at a later date.
Well you can't rush these things...
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:19 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Ivor the Engineer View Post
Well you can't rush these things...
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle7006306.ece

Quote:
Final verdicts, on whether Dr Wakefield and his co-defendants are guilty of serious professional misconduct, are expected by June.
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:21 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by the times View Post
june
- 2015.
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:28 AM   #8
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I am very glad to see the word "dishonest" being used in the ruling.
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Old 28th January 2010, 08:44 AM   #9
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Why? You feel it's a threatened species of adjective?
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Old 28th January 2010, 09:01 AM   #10
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/8483865.stm
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Old 28th January 2010, 09:56 AM   #11
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Not very repentent is he?
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Old 28th January 2010, 10:01 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by dafydd View Post
From dafydd's link
Quote:
...and paid children £5 for blood samples at his son's birthday party.
That sounds very ethical.

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Old 28th January 2010, 10:11 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Dave_46 View Post
From dafydd's link

Quote:
...and paid children £5 for blood samples at his son's birthday party.
That sounds very ethical.

Dave
Five pounds is £5 more than I've ever got for a blood sample.
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Old 28th January 2010, 04:57 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by richardm View Post
Not very repentent is he?

He seemed to be poisoning the well in the Mail at the weekend:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...onclusion.html
Quote:
While Dr Wakefield, 52, believes the GMC should vindicate his professional reputation, in an exclusive interview with The Mail on Sunday he said he fears a ‘political’ verdict.

‘My lawyers feel confident that we have answered all the charges against us,’ he said from his home in Austin, Texas. ‘If there’s any justice, we should be cleared. However, there’s the political backlash to consider. I fear the GMC will want to make an example of us.

‘The issue was not about me, but about how to crush dissent. I scare the establishment because I care and I am diligent. I think they’re terrified because they’ve not done adequate safety studies. I’ve been treated in the standard way in which people who raise these kinds of questions are treated.

‘It’s extremely challenging, but if I fail to stand up to the bullies, the price to be paid is enormous.’
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Old 29th January 2010, 02:01 AM   #15
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I find it ironic that he finds the charges against him are unsupported.
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Old 29th January 2010, 03:49 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
I am very glad to see the word "dishonest" being used in the ruling.
More than that, they not only said he was dishonest but that he knew he was being dishonest.
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Old 29th January 2010, 07:12 AM   #17
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Of course his swarm of groupies are going to scream "witch-hunt" and "stifling dissent". I heard one of them yelling that Dr. Wakefield was the only person who cared about the children. (Yeah, cared enough to subject them to colonoscopies and lumbar punctures without any particularly good reason....)

I just wonder how far that interpretation will penetrate into the mainstream consciousness. I would hope that most rational parents would now be beginning to see this affair for what it really is.

I was interested in one of Wakefield's defenders on TV saying it was all very well to criticise the procedures he carried out on these chldren, but not one of the parents had lodged a complaint. This is so often what happens in the case of woo-woo treatments where the patient (or the patient's carer) becomes highly invested in the treatment - the therapist can push this to outright cruelty, and yet the victim remains compliant. I think it's more so when the patient is being represented by a carer (animal or child patient) - because the "client" is not suffering themselves, it's easier to take the line that "it's all for your own good".

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Old 29th January 2010, 07:23 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
Of course his swarm of groupies are going to scream "witch-hunt" and "stifling dissent". I heard one of them yelling that Dr. Wakefield was the only person who cared about the children. (Yeah, cared enough to subject them to colonoscopies and lumbar punctures without any particularly good reason....)

They don't seem to be quoting the "callous disregard" bit.
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Old 29th January 2010, 11:50 AM   #19
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i haven't read the full report...so is he being reprimanded solely for the way in which he conducted his now discredited study, for the way he over-publicised and over-hyped its results afterwards, or for both?

There was a piece on the BBC radio news about it, followed by a vox-pop 30 second quote from an anti-vax campaigner bleating about how it was a big pharma conspiracy of silence. Good old BBC "balance" - 50% fact 50% utter BS

And why in heaven's name has it taken over a decade for the GMC to get off their well pampered backsides and issue a ruling? Surely they don't normally take such a long time do they?
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Old 29th January 2010, 11:59 AM   #20
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The fraccin media headline has the nerve to advertise wakefield as being censured!!!'

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2010/...wakefield.html

*vomit*
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Old 29th January 2010, 12:02 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Eos of the Eons View Post
The fraccin media headline has the nerve to advertise wakefield as being censured!!!'

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2010/...wakefield.html

*vomit*
Sorry, I don't get it - what's the problem with that headline?

(ETA - or are you confusing the word censured - meaning reprimanded, with censored)
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Old 29th January 2010, 12:23 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Professor Yaffle View Post
Sorry, I don't get it - what's the problem with that headline?

(ETA - or are you confusing the word censured - meaning reprimanded, with censored)
I may not be the only one
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Old 29th January 2010, 12:52 PM   #23
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Today's GMC verdict was also a 10-year-old case. The doctor was not struck off. People are outraged and declare that it's all just an old boys' club that protects its members....

Rolfe.
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Old 29th January 2010, 12:57 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
i haven't read the full report...so is he being reprimanded solely for the way in which he conducted his now discredited study, for the way he over-publicised and over-hyped its results afterwards, or for both?

There was a piece on the BBC radio news about it, followed by a vox-pop 30 second quote from an anti-vax campaigner bleating about how it was a big pharma conspiracy of silence. Good old BBC "balance" - 50% fact 50% utter BS

And why in heaven's name has it taken over a decade for the GMC to get off their well pampered backsides and issue a ruling? Surely they don't normally take such a long time do they?
Andy, you can get a succinct description of the charges and findings here.

Este
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Old 29th January 2010, 01:11 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Estellea View Post
Andy, you can get a succinct description of the charges and findings here.

Este
Thanks for the link.

Given that it's pretty damning about professional conduct, why has it taken so long....?
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Old 29th January 2010, 01:19 PM   #26
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Post 24 has some hints....
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Old 29th January 2010, 02:06 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Post 24 has some hints....
you know, i clicked on your link expecting a link to another thread....only to be taken a mouse scroll away

i'd have thought the GMC would have been keen to ditch and disown Wakefield ASAP years ago. But maybe it is "all doctors together" (even the really crappy ones..)
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Old 29th January 2010, 06:54 PM   #28
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I read somewhere else the reason it took so long was that the GMC rules did not allow them to force Wakefield and the other defendants to hand over evidence. Apparently those rules have changed.

The Autism Omnibus cases in the USA were hampered by the slowness of getting evidence from the litigants. Things like medical records, etc.
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Old 29th January 2010, 07:04 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Ivor the Engineer View Post
Five pounds is £5 more than I've ever got for a blood sample.
I've given almost am armful for a biscuit and a cup of bad coffee...
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Old 30th January 2010, 02:19 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
I was interested in one of Wakefield's defenders on TV saying it was all very well to criticise the procedures he carried out on these chldren, but not one of the parents had lodged a complaint.
That's because the parent of the children in the original trial at least were looking for evidence against the MMR vaccine so they could sue the manufacturers. Also at least one of the other children used as an unwitting guinea pig was the son of the managing director of Wakefield's pharmaceutical company.

http://aillas.blogspot.com/

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Old 30th January 2010, 07:52 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by jon View Post
I've given almost am armful for a biscuit and a cup of bad coffee...
i've given it for a cheap night out on the beer
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Old 30th January 2010, 08:10 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Yuri Nalyssus View Post
That's because the parent of the children in the original trial at least were looking for evidence against the MMR vaccine so they could sue the manufacturers. Also at least one of the other children used as an unwitting guinea pig was the son of the managing director of Wakefield's pharmaceutical company.

http://aillas.blogspot.com/

Yuri
To be picky, only four or five of the Lancet 12 children's parents were involved in the lawsuit as far as we know.

I only mention this because I think it's important to be highly precise in tracking exactly what Wakefield did. If we exaggerate any one aspect of his unethical conduct his defenders have the opportunity to leap on it.

Of course those four or five were cherry-picked for the study and misrepresented as a serially admitted sample, and that's only the beginning of the methodological and ethical problems with Wakefield et. al. 1998.
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Old 30th January 2010, 08:48 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Kevin_Lowe View Post
To be picky, only four or five of the Lancet 12 children's parents were involved in the lawsuit as far as we know.

I only mention this because I think it's important to be highly precise in tracking exactly what Wakefield did. If we exaggerate any one aspect of his unethical conduct his defenders have the opportunity to leap on it.

Of course those four or five were cherry-picked for the study and misrepresented as a serially admitted sample, and that's only the beginning of the methodological and ethical problems with Wakefield et. al. 1998.
Thanks Kevin, I've fixed it. Don't apologise for the 'picky' thing, I totally agree - Pedant is my middle name (I don't use it though, as it spoils the joke ).

Cheers,

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Old 30th January 2010, 09:22 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Hydrogen Cyanide View Post
I read somewhere else the reason it took so long was that the GMC rules did not allow them to force Wakefield and the other defendants to hand over evidence. Apparently those rules have changed.

The Autism Omnibus cases in the USA were hampered by the slowness of getting evidence from the litigants. Things like medical records, etc.
HCN, as far as I know, the burden of evidence remained with the GMC and the defendants did not have to provide any evidence to support the GMC's charges.

Re: the birthday party. You know those caveats that investigators provide in studies with human research subjects? Such as, "Routine informed consent for clinical procedures was obtained by the insert investigator's name here.", "Informed consent procedures detailed additional research procedures to be performed, and specific written permission was provided by consenting parents and guardians and children capable of providing assent.", and "Study procedures were approved by the Institutional Review Boards of insert institution(s) names here."

So what did Wakers think he was going to do with those blood samples and phrase how they were obtained in a journal submission? It is either gross incompetence or sheer hubris to think that that was an acceptable thing to do and there is simply no other explanation that I can entertain.

Este
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Old 30th January 2010, 09:27 AM   #35
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Wakefield is just guilty of caring....

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-22005783/
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Old 30th January 2010, 01:28 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Professor Yaffle View Post
Wakefield is just guilty of caring....

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-22005783/
I can't read it. I bet they forget he was pushing for his own single jabs?
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Old 30th January 2010, 06:23 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Professor Yaffle View Post
Wakefield is just guilty of caring....

What happened to the "callous disregard for the distress and pain the children might suffer"?
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Old 1st February 2010, 08:57 AM   #38
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Mod Info Discussion of doctors covering for each other's misconduct split to here. Please limit this thread to discussion of the Wakefield decision.
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Old 2nd February 2010, 09:16 AM   #39
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The Lancet have fully retracted the original article now.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8493753.stm
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Old 2nd February 2010, 10:05 AM   #40
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NPR just briefly mentioned the retraction of the Wakefield study calling it "inaccurate" rather than falsified.
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