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Tags john benneth , james randi , homeopathy

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Old 2nd March 2004, 01:16 AM   #1
WWu777
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Article praising Benneth's triumphs over Randi

Winston-

Would you please forward my article below to the discussion groups? Thanks for being such a good friend to John. He speaks highly of you

Mel

Homeopathic gold mine may save millions

by Melissa Ardenwilde
melissaardenwilde@juno.com

Although subtle energy researcher John Benneth may not have yet become the richest man in the world, after coming up with scientifically replicative proof for homeopathy in 1999, its growth exploded at 20% a year and Benneth took up residence in Hearst's old mansion, the Mackay, over the Gould and Curry gold mine, what at one time was known as the richest place on Earth.

After Hearst exhausted the gold from his mine, four Irishmen, Mackay, Fair, O'Brien and Flood, used Hearst's mansion as a starting place to dig the El Dorado tunnel into "the big bonanza" the greatest gold and silver strike of all time that made Mackay the richest man in America. Now under Benneth's control, the old Hearst mansion is being used again for what Benneth believes is a spiritual bonanza.

In late January of 1999 energy medicine scoffer James "the Amazing" Randi, offered Benneth his million dollar challenge for proof for homeopathy.

Benneth responded by producing methods using instrumental measures and mycological, botanical and zoological reactions for proof that homeopathy is not placebo. After months of trying to discredit Benneth, Randi failed to disprove even one of Benneth's many methods that show the difference between serially agitated dilutes (SADs -homeopathically potentized solutions) and their liquid vehicles.

Previous to 1999, one had to search health food stores, get them from practitioners or mail order for homeopathic remedies. Now, thanks to Benneth, you can find them in just about every major supermarket and drug store.

Benneth was consulted a year ago last summer by the BBC for its special on homeopathy in which the Randi challenge was taken. And recently the Chinese government consulted with him about how to end the SARS epidemic.

Some people are thanking Benneth for saving .so many lives. Others are saying he's now trying to hide his windfall, claiming to be impoverished

Sources close to Benneth speculate that Randi secretly paid Benneth the million dollars he was offering for proof, and that Benneth in turn invested it in the world's only two publicly held manufacturers of homeopathic products, Boiron and Dolisos, knowing full well that the homeopathic industry would skyrocket when it was discovered Randi had failed to debunk him.

A compromise reported by unconfirmed sources say Benneth agreed to the BBC's deliberately failing the test proving homeopathy with Randi so as Randi could save face and continue to offer the prize without having to pay it out again and again..

After Benneth submitted proof to Randi for homeopathy using a simple method of measuring the gas output of yeast treated with homeopathic Staphysagria, an extract from Larkspur, Goldman Sachs, the bank for the prize money, demanded that Randi remove their name from his web page.

Staphysagria is used in the homeopathic treatment of rape.

Randi subsequently went into China where he attempted to debunk the Falun Gong, energy medicine practitioners for the Chinese government. Failing that, Randi returned to the U.S. and went into hiding where he suffered a heart attack while his bookings fell off to zero.

Some sources, which have requested to remain secret, have claimed that Benneth secretly treated Randi's heart condition with homeopathic Aurum metallicum (energetic gold) and saved Randi's life.

Benneth is now claiming that homeopathic gold can be used to treat patients suffering from heart conditions.

"I believe Aurum metallicum and other energetic remedies made from gold are the number one health remedies," says Benneth from his office below the vault that use to guard millions in Hearst and Mackay's bullion. "I believe everyone can benefit from homeopathic gold.."

Is it a tribute now to Benneth that Randi sells pens he claims have been dipped in homeopathic gold?

"Putting aurum on a pen could have a 'Midas' like effect on the individual," admitted Benneth. "My experience and study has shown it to be a great relief from stress, anxiety and the pain of heart break."
However, Benneth denies any collusion with Randi, or that he is a rich man in anything other than "spiritual riches."

"The body cures itself from the inside out," he says, " from the top down, from the most important organs to the least, from the last occurrence of trauma or disease to the first. Therefore, the heart is the most important target for healing first."

"The heart," he says, "is the great repository of emotional memories. This is why people lose memories after heart attacks. Cardiac arrest is the result of a broken heart. The heart stops because it is trying to purge itself of an irreconcilable memory. Aurum corrects this need. "

Some are now saying that Benneth has discovered a second bonanza, or "gold rush." on the Comstock in Nevada.

So far Mr. Randi has refused to comment.

Melissa Ardenwilde
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Old 2nd March 2004, 01:31 AM   #2
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Ok....
Would you be interested in purchaseing my special enerybased radition crystal shield to protect you from all the gard radition realised by all thoes nasy white holes?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 01:34 AM   #3
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So let's examine some of the evidence.....


Benneth responded by producing methods using instrumental measures and mycological, botanical and zoological reactions for proof that homeopathy is not placebo. After months of trying to discredit Benneth, Randi failed to disprove even one of Benneth's many methods that show the difference between serially agitated dilutes (SADs -homeopathically potentized solutions) and their liquid vehicles

Please provide links to documentary evidence of these studies so that both the protocol and results can be examined. Merely asserting that there is proof is not enough

Benneth was consulted a year ago last summer by the BBC for its special on homeopathy in which the Randi challenge was taken. And recently the Chinese government consulted with him about how to end the SARS epidemic.

If the first part is true then, if Benneth makes a lot of money from homoeopathic remedies it makes sense for him to be involved.

Please provide evidence for the second claim. As far as I am aware, the SARS "epidemic" was conquered by good old fashioned medicine in the usual way.


A compromise reported by unconfirmed sources say Benneth agreed to the BBC's deliberately failing the test proving homeopathy with Randi so as Randi could save face and continue to offer the prize without having to pay it out again and again..

If the sources are unconfirmed then they cannot be believed. I'm sure the BBC would be interested in libellous claims of this nature.


Sources close to Benneth speculate that Randi secretly paid Benneth the million dollars he was offering for proof, and that Benneth in turn invested it in the world's only two publicly held manufacturers of homeopathic products

Is there any evidence of payment ? Unless Jref has an extra million just lying around I's asy no

Is it a tribute now to Benneth that Randi sells pens he claims have been dipped in homeopathic gold?

Is this true ?

Another set of "evidence" which is pure bland assertion
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Old 2nd March 2004, 01:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Don
Is it a tribute now to Benneth that Randi sells pens he claims have been dipped in homeopathic gold?
Is this true ?
[/b]
Sort of.
Quote:
Official JREF Pen
Good quality item. Writes in any language. Sexy maroon color, trimmed in homeopathic gold. Takes standard refills.
http://www.randi.org/shopping/index.html
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Old 2nd March 2004, 02:28 AM   #5
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What is it with these guys and the sense of humour bypass?

And the plausibility bypass while we're at it! If Horizon had really fiddled that test any way at all, the resulting stink would have made the Hutton enquiry and Gilligan's litle slip of the tongue look like a Sunday school picnic.

Rolfe.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 02:58 AM   #6
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Winston: Thank you for citing this article here, which clearly shows us the credibility of Mr. Benneth.

I won't go into the details, as the entire piece is evidently total fiction (a diplomatic term for "bald-faced lies"), and any resemblance to the truth is obviously entirely coincidal and unintended.

We now know where we have Mr. Benneth (and you), and we know we can safely ignore anything either of you write in the future.

Thanks again,
Hans
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Old 2nd March 2004, 03:32 AM   #7
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Thanks for clearing that up. I feel much more confident about all the information now that I know that "Some sources, which have requested to remain secret" and "Some people" have clarified things. Sounds like a good scientific basis for the claims to me.

I'm certainly convinced.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 03:36 AM   #8
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Deep in the homoeopathic wood
where fairies and pixies play
You'll find the enchanted neighborhood
of Winston's childhood days
A unicorn named Eeyore is his friend
and thinking's so hard to do
He's Rabid and Pigheaded and quite out there,
but that's just Winnie the Wu

Winnie the Wu
Winnie the Wu
Tubby little head all stuffed with fluff
He's Winnie the Wu
Winnie the Wu
Willy nilly silly old dear


(with apologies to Richard M. Sherman and Robert B. Sherman )
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Old 2nd March 2004, 03:47 AM   #9
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LOL, that was hilarious! It reminded me of one of those old episodes of "Soap"!

Brilliant, keep it up!
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Old 2nd March 2004, 06:04 AM   #10
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Quote:
"The heart," he says, "is the great repository of emotional memories. This is why people lose memories after heart attacks. Cardiac arrest is the result of a broken heart. The heart stops because it is trying to purge itself of an irreconcilable memory. Aurum corrects this need. "
All righty then.

~~ Paul
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Old 2nd March 2004, 06:40 AM   #11
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Quote:
The heart," he says, "is the great repository of emotional memories. This is why people lose memories after heart attacks. Cardiac arrest is the result of a broken heart. The heart stops because it is trying to purge itself of an irreconcilable memory. Aurum corrects this need. "
LOL. This is great stuff. So, does a person lose all their memories if they have a heart transplant? To they inherit all the memories of the donor?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 06:52 AM   #12
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No, silly. Just the emotional memories.

And if you're given the hand of a serial murderer, it will come to life and slay everyone around you!
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Old 2nd March 2004, 06:56 AM   #13
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Quote:
Staphysagria is used in the homeopathic treatment of rape.
??????????? !!!!!!! ggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Quote:
The heart," he says, "is the great repository of emotional memories. This is why people lose memories after heart attacks. Cardiac arrest is the result of a broken heart. The heart stops because it is trying to purge itself of an irreconcilable memory. Aurum corrects this need. "
depends on the culture, I guess, because some countries believe the LIVER is the repository of emotion and feeling. Others feel the BRAIN is.


Well, I for one am glad that this person was privy to Randi's secret conspiracy of being unable to prove himself, and even having his life saved by homeopathy, and helped him out in a difficult time when
Quote:
his bookings fell off to zero.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 07:25 AM   #14
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Was this article published in any place other than internet discussion groups?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 07:56 AM   #15
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Sources close to Benneth speculate that Randi secretly paid Benneth the million dollars he was offering for proof, and that Benneth in turn invested it in the world's only two publicly held manufacturers of homeopathic products, Boiron and Dolisos, knowing full well that the homeopathic industry would skyrocket when it was discovered Randi had failed to debunk him.

A compromise reported by unconfirmed sources say Benneth agreed to the BBC's deliberately failing the test proving homeopathy with Randi so as Randi could save face and continue to offer the prize without having to pay it out again and again..
Ah, yes the security of the free world demands that the Super Secret Secptic Conspiracy be protected!
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:01 AM   #16
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oh No! The sheer weight of logic in Winstons post is too much for me to comprehend. I can see clearly now.....such evidence.... how could i have been sooo blind.........
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:04 AM   #17
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Well, I just spent a couple minutes reading that, ahem, "article," and it reminds me that I need to buy a sack of fertilizer for my garden.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:07 AM   #18
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Bwahahahahahahahahahahaha!!
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:10 AM   #19
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So, what exactly is the difference between an article and a third-party post? Actual publication, I imagine, would be one.

And who the heck is "Melissa Ardenwilde"? She doesn't even google.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:13 AM   #20
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For those researching information in this article, please note that the author is not referring to San Simeon castle built by W.R. Hearst, but rather his father's mansion, currently a U.S. National Park Service landmark which is available for tours and weddings. I am unsure why the mansion's official site still lists Mary and Brian Bills of Reno as the owners.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:21 AM   #21
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Re: Article praising Benneth's triumphs over Randi

Quote:
Originally posted by WWu777
Sources close to Benneth speculate that Randi secretly paid Benneth the million dollars he was offering for proof, and that Benneth in turn invested it in the world's only two publicly held manufacturers of homeopathic products, Boiron and Dolisos, knowing full well that the homeopathic industry would skyrocket when it was discovered Randi had failed to debunk him.
As Benneth went onto usenet and continually claimed that there was no million, and that he had "confirmed" that fact with Goldman-Sachs, Melissa seems to be calling Benneth a complete liar -- here he was profiting off a back room deal for a million (plus!), yet claiming no million exists to the rest of the paranormal community.

And then he agrees to have homeopathy take a dive in the Horizon test. Man, Benneth must be some dishonest, lying, fraudulent scum to do all that for his own profit, if you believe the "unnamed sources."

So, Winston, speaking as someone who chamioned Benneth for years -- do you believe that Benneth is a complete liar who has hidden his private profiteering and allowed the TRUTH about homeopathy to be hidden?

N/A
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:26 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Upchurch
And who the heck is "Melissa Ardenwilde"? She doesn't even google.
Given the blatant lies and fantasies written in this article would be hard for even a Benneth worshipper to come up with, I can safely say that this person is without a doubt a Benneth sock puppet.

He has faked new articles before as well as tried to use sock puppets to attack Randi.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:37 AM   #23
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Does anyone else get the distinct impression that this Wu fellow and trolling this board because he's got an axe to grind with skeptics?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:38 AM   #24
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Re: Article praising Benneth's triumphs over Randi

"Last summer, Randi offered a range of possible times at Mount St. Mary's College in Maryland(?), but Benneth turned him down because he didn't feel prepared and the terms of the test were still far from settled. Later, when those terms seemed to have been settled (admittedly with others publicly [on Usenet and a cc list] negotiating on Benneth's behalf because Randi complained that Benneth was spamming him with too many digressive rants and diatribes, but with Benneth's presumed behind-the-scenes participation in the negotiation through Alain Jean-Mairet and to a lesser extent me - and certainly with his witnessing of it), Benneth refused to re-submit a written protocol, at Alain and Randi's request, that would reflect those terms. Instead he called for an opportunity to less formally and expensively demonstrate his yeast test to Randi's volunteer expert, the NIST biochemist Mike Epstein (whose name had been kept secret from Benneth out of fear that premature revelation would lead to "spamming" or harassing of Epstein, derailing the negotiations). When Randi agreed that such a demonstratrion - done double-blind - would constitute winning the preliminary round of testing, Benneth failed to respond to the offer (whether by accepting it, criticizing it, asking for the name of the biochemist, etc.) and instead ignored it and instead escalated his war of words against Randi and eventually Epstein (when he discovered his identity), Mount St. Mary's, and even (in attenuated form) myself and Alain. We all, it seems, are conspiring with Randi. That being the case, I'm just wondering when I can expect my first pay cheque from Mr. Moneybags. " -Syd Baumel

ALain and Syd are/were noth supporters of homeopathy. They, and many others liek them are disgusted with Benneth.

Benneth is mentally ill.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 08:42 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jet Grind
Does anyone else get the distinct impression that this Wu fellow and trolling this board because he's got an axe to grind with skeptics?
JG,

What a horrid little skeptic you are, with that closed mind of yours. Whenever you get it out of this atheistic kabal of a mind-control cult you will clearly cease this subject/motive shift fallacy.

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Old 2nd March 2004, 09:14 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by BillHoyt

JG,

What a horrid little skeptic you are, with that closed mind of yours. Whenever you get it out of this atheistic kabal of a mind-control cult you will clearly cease this subject/motive shift fallacy.

LOL

Anyway, does Randi keep the results of his challenges available anywhere in the public? I know that Randi has tested homeopaths before since I have seen it on Tech TV's "Secret Strange and True" (as expected, they failed miserabley) but there must have been others.

And one question for Mr. Wu: Can you provide some outside sources for the alleged facts in this article, particularly reputable ones?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 09:59 AM   #27
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Re: Article praising Benneth's triumphs over Randi

Quote:
Originally posted by WWu777
Staphysagria is used in the homeopathic treatment of rape.
Like many of you, I found this to be a particularly outrageous statement, so I googled "Staphysagria", and the first link shows a huge list of symptoms that it is used for: http://www.abchomeopathy.com/r.php/Staph

Crude joke warning... If easily offended, do not continue......



















One of the symptoms is listed as: "male; thick emission from penis; after masturbation;". Now, I ask you, isn't that the whole point?
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Old 2nd March 2004, 03:17 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ladewig
For those researching information in this article, please note that the author is not referring to San Simeon castle built by W.R. Hearst, but rather his father's mansion, currently a U.S. National Park Service landmark which is available for tours and weddings. I am unsure why the mansion's official site still lists Mary and Brian Bills of Reno as the owners.
There is this from Winston's "Mackay" incarnation

And this.

I suspect some kind of Kato Kaelin leech-boy arrangement going on.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 03:31 PM   #29
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I love being a pioneer! You see, I've been down this road with Winston before, and believe me folks, he's got stacks more JUST as impressive!

Wait until you get to the stuff about the Chinese ghosts in Nevada! And the 10,000 sightings of Bigfoot! And... Oh, gee, I wouldn't want to spoil it for anyone...!

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Old 2nd March 2004, 07:30 PM   #30
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well, he wouldn't need to prove these claims to Mr.Randi. Real new medical treatments don't come to Mr.Randi. They go into double blind medical testing and get approval from the
FDA to market their product. Lots of money to be made, hey look at Vaigra. Any research indicating that this works would mean it would be gratefully tested and snatched up by a drug company. They have the bucks and attorneys and scientists to get this through the testing process necessary for FDA approval. With some sort of agreement of money paid out based on sales and everyone comes out rich. Plus, mankind is helped so that anyone that believed this really worked would move heaven and earth to make sure it gets into the medical mainstream where everyone can have the benefits. it should be noted that the FDA isn't evil. If something works safely they want it out there.

Mr.Randi is hardly the conduit for such a product.
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Old 2nd March 2004, 11:44 PM   #31
CFLarsen
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zep
I love being a pioneer! You see, I've been down this road with Winston before, and believe me folks, he's got stacks more JUST as impressive!

Wait until you get to the stuff about the Chinese ghosts in Nevada! And the 10,000 sightings of Bigfoot! And... Oh, gee, I wouldn't want to spoil it for anyone...!

Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
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Old 3rd March 2004, 12:28 AM   #32
Zep
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Quote:
Originally posted by CFLarsen


Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
Ar-ti-cle!
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Old 3rd March 2004, 12:44 AM   #33
CFLarsen
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I bet that took you longer to make than writing the article would have taken...
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Old 3rd March 2004, 12:48 AM   #34
Zep
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Still wrong!

No, Winston Wu is something I do not wish to dredge up again - too much angst (I was younger then, and stupider). Apart from the fact I may give away my Super Sekrit Axolotl Identity as a result.
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Old 3rd March 2004, 12:56 AM   #35
CFLarsen
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zep
Still wrong!

No, Winston Wu is something I do not wish to dredge up again - too much angst (I was younger then, and stupider). Apart from the fact I may give away my Super Sekrit Axolotl Identity as a result.
Sheeesh.....
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Old 3rd March 2004, 01:08 AM   #36
MRC_Hans
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Well, it is evident that Mr. WooWu is not interested in debate at all, he just wants to spread his utterly inane spam around.

Dear Mr. WooWu: Welcome to my ignore list.

Hans
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Old 3rd March 2004, 07:11 AM   #37
Thanz
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Quote:
Originally posted by MRC_Hans
Well, it is evident that Mr. WooWu is not interested in debate at all, he just wants to spread his utterly inane spam around.
That seems to be true.

On a possibly related note, I asked you a question in the ID thread in the Latest Commentary forum that has been ignored. I don't know if you just didn't see it, but I would appreciate a response.

Thank you.
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Old 3rd March 2004, 04:11 PM   #38
magicflute
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Advice to all new to Mr WWu-WWu. Save your sanity and put him on your ignore list!
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Old 3rd March 2004, 06:18 PM   #39
BillHoyt
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Quote:
Originally posted by magicflute
Advice to all new to Mr WWu-WWu. Save your sanity and put him on your ignore list!
magicflute,

While you may be ultimately right, it is important to keep in mind that the wider audience here needs to see both the behavior and the lack of logic. That means, we must engage him and others like him. Those that have no idea who he is may, perhaps, not understand how lame the ideas are. They may not clearly understand how fallacy-ridden the arguments are.

"Wus" are important because they write "stuff" that may look, to the untrained eye, to be really good. But then, a careful observer will note that Wu was not chased away or beaten on by evil, harsh skeptics. It will be clear tha Wu elected not to respond. That Wu withered.
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Old 3rd March 2004, 08:13 PM   #40
magicflute
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Sorry, but I have suffered Mr WWu from the newsgroups, and after having seen the same cr*p posted for the Nth time, by him and after having seen him disregard anything resembling a constructive discussion, I have run out of patience. I don't object at all anyone wishing to DISCUSS thier ideas in this forum. That is what they are intended for. By all means, whatever your views are, you are welcomed to participate. Mr. WWu does not participate. He just dumps garbage and polutes.
I will debate anyone about anything as long as they are willing and participate in a discussion. Coming into a forum and just dumping is not my idea of participation. I gave up on the skeptic newsgroups because of that practice of which he was one of the greatest culprits. I would not like to see the same happen here.
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