"Drugs that cure are not profitable"

sophia8

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Another Big Pharma Conspiracy rant, I'm afraid.
The reason I've posted it here and not in the Conspiracy forum is becuase I'm interested in one specific point:
Investigations with antibiotics have been stopped because they were too effective and completely cured. As no new antibiotics have been developed, infectious organisms have become resistant and today tuberculosis, which in my childhood had been defeated, reappears and has killed this past year a million people.
I know about antibiotic-resistant tuberculosis bacilli; but I just don't believe they've really stopped trying to produce new antibiotics for it. Anybody with more knowledge like to comment?
 
Go to clinical trials.gov. Browse by topic. Go to Tuberculosis, Multidrug-resistant.

Linda
 
Another Big Pharma Conspiracy rant, I'm afraid.
The reason I've posted it here and not in the Conspiracy forum is becuase I'm interested in one specific point:
I know about antibiotic-resistant tuberculosis bacilli; but I just don't believe they've really stopped trying to produce new antibiotics for it. Anybody with more knowledge like to comment?

Funny how they don't say what they are talking about.
 
Funny how they don't say what they are talking about.

And I am even more suspicious because there is only one source for this alleged interview
"“The drug that completely cures is not profitable” (Interview with the Nobel Prize for Medicine Richard J. Roberts). Lluís Amiguet – La Vanguardia."

All of them link to the Healing Diabetes page.

Until , I found this:
http://translate.google.com/transla...+J.+Roberts&hl=en&biw=1003&bih=539&prmd=ivnso

Which is a personal blog...

Maybe this person:
http://translate.google.com/transla...r+peral+fos&hl=en&biw=1003&bih=539&prmd=ivnso
 
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When I had surgery a few years ago they put me on a brand new antibiotic that cost a lot of money. So clearly some new antibiotics are still being patented.
 
Thanks DD. I can't find any trace of the article online, other than that one blog. It's not in the La Vanguardia archives, for sure.
Plus, I can't find any indications that the actual Dr Sir Richard Roberts (as Debretts insists he should be styled) is that kind of a loony, or indeed any kind of a loony - he's on Wikipedia's list of British atheists. In 2008, he signed a letter calling for the resignation of a Royal Society education director who suggested that creationism be taught in schools; in March this year, he was amongst several academics who resigned from the LSE in protest against its connections with the Gaddaffi family and regime. Apart from that, he seems to have kept a pretty low profile, just teaching and writing papers.
Also, if his Wikipedia mugshot is anything to go by, he doesn't look a whole lot like the swivel-eyed loon pictured on the diabetes blog. That, plus the fact that somebody's made a clumsy attempt to link to that page on Richard's Wikipedia page, plus the very clumsy English that the alleged Richard Roberts uses throughout the interview, makes me wonder if fakery's afoot.
 
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Investigations with antibiotics have been stopped because they were too effective and completely cured.

So I am wondering, is the person who wrote this completely clueless, or just dishonest?

Because no one serious could say something so stupid.

ETA: Just as an example, I found 42 papers describing investigations with antibiotics published in the Journal of the American Chemical Society in this year alone. One journal. 6 months.

Clueless, clueless, clueless...
 
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Yeah,the company that comes up with a cure for Cancer is not going to make a dime off of it....no profit there.
 
I wonder if anyone would care to comment on this business article. I know very little about how pharmaceutical companies decide how or where to place their research dollars into drugs--as a vet, most of our antibiotics are also human antibiotics, with a few exceptions. I also realize the source of this article--I came across it when I started Googling about antibiotics.

Report: Antibiotic research and revenue declining
Report: Antibiotic drug revenue falling due to generics, research shifting to hospital drugs

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Report-Antibiotic-research-apf-2593909340.html?x=0&.v=1
 
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Well, we know that if a drug cures me of lung cancer no one else will ever get lung cancer.
 
As others have pointed out, antibiotics are still being investigated but it is true that there was a decline in that field of research in the late 70s through the early 90s. The way in which we find new varieties has also largely changed. In the past the process was fundamentally simple, you basically used a culture plate as a proverbial boxing ring in which different microbes (mostly filamentous soil bacteria or moulds) would compete with representative pathogens. The vast majority of antibiotics used today are molecules that were discovered by this method between WWII and the mid 60s (or semisynthetic derivatives thereof). This method has become much less productive and far more complex methods are being employed which partly explains why less drugs have come to market. A lot of the preliminary research is now done by smaller biotech firms, university and other research labs which may sell the technology on as opposed to the past where it would have been carried out by the pharmaceutical giants first hand. There is some truth in the claim that such drugs are not profitable, for example, a potent antibiotic may cure cystitis or gonorrhoea in a single dose. Moreover, new antibiotics often don't get much use immediately after being launched as microbiologists (rightly) encourage doctors to prescribe them only for infections already resistant to standard drugs - this combined with a finite patent is an issue. For diseases largely confined to the developing world there is little monetary incentive to find drugs, for instance, the drug eflornithine was known to be effective against african sleeping sickness but was only pursued when it was later found to be useful as a hair removal treatment (profitable).
 
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I wonder if anyone would care to comment on this business article. I know very little about how pharmaceutical companies decide how or where to place their research dollars into drugs--as a vet, most of our antibiotics are also human antibiotics, with a few exceptions. I also realize the source of this article--I came across it when I started Googling about antibiotics.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Report-Antibiotic-research-apf-2593909340.html?x=0&.v=1
The OP link has an ounce of truth but goes off track a bit when they speak of motive as if profit is inherently evil:
- And why do they stop investigating?
Because drug companies often are not as interested in healing you as in getting your money, so that investigation, suddenly, is diverted to the discovery of drugs that do not heal completely, but chronify the disease and make you experience an improvement that disappears when you stop taking the drug.
That's not exactly right. A cure for AIDS would be extremely profitable, for example.

There is an issue with pharmaceutical companies investing in new antibiotic research. It ties up capital with the expectation of only long term return on investment. Short term recoup of investment capital is not going to happen with a new antibiotic because the medical community would be motivated to conserve the drug, not use it widely at first. In addition, there is more money in a drug like a statin one takes daily for the rest of their lives compared to a single course of an antibiotic. And the companies often choose to invest R&D dollars to make copycat drugs designed to take part of a known market rather than gambling on an unknown market. These are simply prudent corporate decisions, not some evil greedy conspiracy.

But research dollars don't all come from the private sector. If the NIH, for example, invests in new antibiotics thereby cutting the initial capital investment in R&D, a drug company could then come in to produce the drug at a profit. What the public needs to understand is public dollar investment is not all bad.
 
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Well, we know that if a drug cures me of lung cancer no one else will ever get lung cancer.
There is absolutely no doubt antibiotic resistance will continue to spread and become more complete. The problem however is the time frame for return on investment in R&D.

With any new class of antibiotic, it's going to be reserved for drug resistant pathogens. The sooner we use it the sooner resistance will develop to the new drug. A pharmaceutical company has to consider how long it will take until the R&D investment will result in a profit. They have to consider what else they might use that R&D money for and compare the potential.

If it were strictly left up to Libertarian fantasized market forces, we wouldn't see a new antibiotic until drug resistant strains were rampant and killing thousands (such as they are with tuberculosis thus you see private R&D investment in that area). Private public partnerships sometimes actually do make sense.
 
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As others have pointed out, antibiotics are still being investigated but it is true that there was a decline in that field of research in the late 70s through the early 90s. The way in which we find new varieties has also largely changed. In the past the process was fundamentally simple, you basically used a culture plate as a proverbial boxing ring in which different microbes (mostly filamentous soil bacteria or moulds) would compete with representative pathogens. The vast majority of antibiotics used today are molecules that were discovered by this method between WWII and the mid 60s (or semisynthetic derivatives thereof). This method has become much less productive and far more complex methods are being employed which partly explains why less drugs have come to market. A lot of the preliminary research is now done by smaller biotech firms, university and other research labs which may sell the technology on as opposed to the past where it would have been carried out by the pharmaceutical giants first hand. There is some truth in the claim that such drugs are not profitable, for example, a potent antibiotic may cure cystitis or gonorrhoea in a single dose. Moreover, new antibiotics often don't get much use immediately after being launched as microbiologists (rightly) encourage doctors to prescribe them only for infections already resistant to standard drugs - this combined with a finite patent is an issue. For diseases largely confined to the developing world there is little monetary incentive to find drugs, for instance, the drug eflornithine was known to be effective against african sleeping sickness but was only pursued when it was later found to be useful as a hair removal treatment (profitable).
Good points.

:welcome4
 
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@Tracy Dalziel and Skeptic Ginger:

Thanks for your informative replies. :)
 

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