Pink Slime

Draca · 24th March 2012, 12:18 AM

I've been following the Pink Slime story with disgust. Obviously we can not count on the government to provide protection or honesty on what is being sold as food. Absolutely outraged that major stores have gotten away with selling this. Our food supply is poisoned.

What I'm most outraged at is that it isn't even labeled to give people a choice, and there are no plans to require it to be labeled in the future. The USDA has utterly betrayed the American people in favor of big business.

Quote from ABC News "A USDA source told ABC news it’s up to the grocery stores to disclose what’s in their ground beef and the Agriculture Department has no jurisdiction."

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...ns-pink-slime/

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...grocery-store/

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...ime-free-beef/

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...nk-slime-beef/

Joey McGee · 24th March 2012, 12:38 AM

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I AGREE

Chemophobia?

Here's a comment from your second link

Quote:

I am an Agricultural Engineer, this is my field. Meat is a fundamentally expensive product to produce, so processors look for any cost savings they can find. These filler materials are quite a normal thing in industry. You cannot get sick from this, chances are you have eaten this before and you are only grossed out because you know what is in it. I guarantee everybody that if you really knew what was in your products, and how they were manufactured (from make-up, food, soaps, and even pharmaceutics), you would never touch them again. Either get over it, kill it yourself or go without.

Can we have some evidence that our food supply is poisoned?

I'm all for transparency about products, how they are made and where they come from. That seems to be the only legitimate issue.

eta

This advertisement appeared in the WSJ yesterday. I think that what Nancy Donley has to say there is extremely important.

Draca · 24th March 2012, 01:05 AM

Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross.

Joey McGee · 24th March 2012, 01:15 AM

What a dog is meant to be fed? So evolution shaped that meat in those places in cows for humans to feed to their dogs? No, that's a fearmongering, baseless argument.

Quote:

Myth 5:

Dangerous chemicals are added to boneless lean beef trimmings.

Fact:

This is a reference to ammonium hydroxide, essentially ammonia and water, both naturally occurring compounds that have been used to make foods safe since 1974, when the Food and Drug Administration declared it GRAS or Generally Recognized as Safe, the highest safety attribution the agency assigns to compounds. Boneless lean beef trimmings receive a puff of ammonia to eliminate bacteria safely and effectively. When combined with moisture naturally in beef, ammonium hydroxide is formed, which is a naturally occurring compound found in many foods, in our own bodies and the environment. Food safety experts and scientists agree it is an effective way to ensure safer ground beef.

http://beefisbeef.com/2012/03/15/top...of-pink-slime/

At a time when food issues are looming as a serious challenge to human health in the next few decades, this kind of campaign is what is disgusting. I'll change my mind if there is a real case presented.

Brian-M · 24th March 2012, 02:06 AM

I've never heard of "Pink Slime" before. After looking at the first link and the Wikipedia article, I'm left with one question...

What's wrong with using beef trimmings in ground meat?

Seriously, I don't see the problem.

ETA: Or is it the ammonia gas that's disturbing people for some reason?

Jekyll's Guest · 24th March 2012, 04:07 AM

Originally Posted by Brian-M

I've never heard of "Pink Slime" before. After looking at the first link and the Wikipedia article, I'm left with one question...

What's wrong with using beef trimmings in ground meat?

Seriously, I don't see the problem.

ETA: Or is it the ammonia gas that's disturbing people for some reason?

It's the combination of the word slime, and pictures of pink ooze. It was fine when we didn't know, but now people look at their ground beef and picture pink ooze.

Ryokan · 24th March 2012, 05:06 AM

Originally Posted by Draca

Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross.

Would you prefer E. Coli?

arthwollipot · 24th March 2012, 05:36 AM

I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true.

aggle-rithm · 24th March 2012, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by Draca

Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross.

Whatever you do, don't think about how many maggots are allowed by the FDA to be in a jar of mayonaise.

MatildaGage · 24th March 2012, 05:48 AM

It seems there is a substantial number of meat eaters who are grossed out by the entire concept of meat production.

I was one of those--I had to push the very idea (raising, slaughter, butchering, processing) out of my head. I got to the point where I wouldn't even touch it. I had to just slip it into the pan directly from the package and had to deliberately distract myself from thinking about how gross it is.

My advice is, if it bothers you that much, a very simple solution is to not eat it. There are plenty of alternatives that are healthy and much less gross--and cheaper too.

Now I don't spend so much effort trying to avoid being disgusted by what's on my plate and in my fridge. Life's too short for all that self-imposed angst.

MG1962 · 24th March 2012, 06:24 AM

My only beef (get it beef ha ha ha) is the economics of the situation. I am paying for X amount of ground up beef, but in fact only getting Y amount with the balance being made up of filler.

And the fact the filler is not described or apparently admitted too on the labeling - (I will check this claim on my next shopping trip) is very troubling. Having said all that I can see circumstances where I would purchase the product (knowingly) and use it as intended. A cheap way to fill peoples bellies when the budget is a bit tight

defaultdotxbe · 24th March 2012, 06:29 AM

Originally Posted by MG1962

My only beef (get it beef ha ha ha) is the economics of the situation. I am paying for X amount of ground up beef, but in fact only getting Y amount with the balance being made up of filler.

And the fact the filler is not described or apparently admitted too on the labeling - (I will check this claim on my next shopping trip) is very troubling. Having said all that I can see circumstances where I would purchase the product (knowingly) and use it as intended. A cheap way to fill peoples bellies when the budget is a bit tight

you pay for X amount of beef, and since the "filler" is made of beef you receive X amount of beef

MG1962 · 24th March 2012, 06:39 AM

Originally Posted by defaultdotxbe

you pay for X amount of beef, and since the "filler" is made of beef you receive X amount of beef

But the articles suggest the 'filler' does not have the nutritional value of beef. It is the same when you get the different qualities of ground beef 70/30 80/20 etc. A consumer sees a price break on the lower quality beef and purchases according to their need, be it health or simple budget constraints

shadron · 24th March 2012, 06:41 AM

Originally Posted by Draca

Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross.

"nutritionally poisoned" is a non-sequitur. It is either nutritional or not, but in neither case is it poisoned. Dogs need nutrition just like the rest of us animals do, and they seem to live on it well enough, so it is neither non-nutritional nor poison. Ammonia is added to many things to kill bacteria; I'm sorry if you never noticed. Do you eat hot dogs? You do know it has been used in human food since 1993? You better count on becoming a vegan, because this sort of thing is going to become more prevalent, not less, until meat becomes altogether too expensive to have at all.

Caper · 24th March 2012, 06:43 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true.

I agree. It's great they borrowed a page from the American Indian.

casebro · 24th March 2012, 06:44 AM

I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts').

But I do stay away from the factory made 'chubs' of ground beef. Not because of the by-products, but the "deboned meat". DM is acquired by grinding up all the gristle and bone, filtering out the bone chips, and adding it to the ground meat. No flavor and no texture. Deboned Meat is the "Pink Slime". Logic is " It ain't bone, it must be meat".

I do have a dedicated electric meat grinder, and use it mostly to make my own sausage. But will occasionally run a whole brisket through it, and fill the freezer with hamburger. Mostly because I find that the best quality ground beef is too low in fat for best flavor. It's cheaper than buying hamburger, and as a side effect I can set aside some excess fat for home made pie crust.

BobTheCoward · 24th March 2012, 06:47 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true.

And, as far as I can tell, its still yummy and safe.

MG1962 · 24th March 2012, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by casebro

I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts').

I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like?

Halfcentaur · 24th March 2012, 07:01 AM

I just saw a sign at my market saying they never used pink slime, and I wondered what the heck they were talking about. Ew.

defaultdotxbe · 24th March 2012, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by MG1962

But the articles suggest the 'filler' does not have the nutritional value of beef. It is the same when you get the different qualities of ground beef 70/30 80/20 etc. A consumer sees a price break on the lower quality beef and purchases according to their need, be it health or simple budget constraints

so what is the nutritional value of "beef" defined as? i thought it was a generic term referring to meat from a cow (which as i mention, the filler is)

Originally Posted by casebro

I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts').

But I do stay away from the factory made 'chubs' of ground beef. Not because of the by-products, but the "deboned meat". DM is acquired by grinding up all the gristle and bone, filtering out the bone chips, and adding it to the ground meat. No flavor and no texture. Deboned Meat is the "Pink Slime". Logic is " It ain't bone, it must be meat".

I do have a dedicated electric meat grinder, and use it mostly to make my own sausage. But will occasionally run a whole brisket through it, and fill the freezer with hamburger. Mostly because I find that the best quality ground beef is too low in fat for best flavor. It's cheaper than buying hamburger, and as a side effect I can set aside some excess fat for home made pie crust.

the hilighted bit is not true, in 2004 mechanically separated beef was banned for use in products intended for human consumption. the process by which "pink slime" is made stipulates that bones must emerge from the process intact

although mechanically separated pork and chicken can still be used (mostly in hot dogs)

MG1962 · 24th March 2012, 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by Halfcentaur

I just saw a sign at my market saying they never used pink slime, and I wondered what the heck they were talking about. Ew.

Its like soylent green only betterer - Only FDA approved pensioners where used in the production.

Halfcentaur · 24th March 2012, 07:59 AM

I've always been very picky about my ground beef texture and have only bought ground meat from the same place the last 10 years, and my emotional mind is grateful they claim to have never used this vile slime. But I shudder in my emotional heart soul to think of the times I ate ground beefs from the hand of trusted others.

ehcks · 24th March 2012, 08:08 AM

Food is food. If it tastes good and doesn't make me sick, I don't care.

Last time I got sick from something I ate was lobster at the navy base galley because they cooked it wrong. Ground beef is poison? Tell that to my stomach.

defaultdotxbe · 24th March 2012, 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by ehcks

Food is food. If it tastes good and doesn't make me sick, I don't care.

Last time I got sick from something I ate was lobster at the navy base galley because they cooked it wrong. Ground beef is poison? Tell that to my stomach.

thats pretty much been my observation as well

1: apparently i've been eating this stuff my entire life
2: i am well nourished
3: i am in good health

conclusion: i kindof want a cheeseburger now

casebro · 24th March 2012, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by MG1962

I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like?

I've been buying hog melts at the Vietnamese grocers. It tastes somewhere between meat and liver. It has the color of liver, and the long skinny strips have a consistency closer to meat than liver. I could see that it would add flavor to ground products. In fact, a friend was a meat cutter and told me it is used in some of the fast food chains. I use it to make 'dirty rice' mostly as dog food, but I'll eat a bowl or two from every batch too. Not much luck finding recipes other wise, <Melt Recipe> always comes up as a cheeseburger on rye.

Aside: I once toured a plant for one of the big fast food chains. Saw what looked like whole deboned carcasses heading into a huge grinder. Bins the size of a pallet. Interesting that they had a recipe. It was about 15% fat, mostly steer meat, with set amounts of cow and bull. I've always wondered about how some places have beefier tasting patties, I figured it's because of higher bull content. I know there are two reasons to make steers out of bulls- docility, and bulls taste gamier. Now I've got a hankering to try a bull steak.

eta: Now I'm wonder if the free range cattle thing is really about eating bull meat? If we can taste the difference, maybe there is something healthier about it? Just as we taste the difference between olive and sunflower oils? Maybe the culprit ain't the beef, it's the lack of bull? I wonder how herds are managed in 'low heart attack rate' countries?

WildCat · 24th March 2012, 10:08 AM

Originally Posted by MatildaGage

My advice is, if it bothers you that much, a very simple solution is to not eat it. There are plenty of alternatives that are healthy and much less gross--and cheaper too.

Until you discover what they use as fertilizer on organic vegetable farms...

Skeptic Ginger · 24th March 2012, 10:09 AM

Framing worth noting:

Anti-corporate activists name for the stuff: Pink Slime
Commercial producers name for the product: Lean Beef Trimmings

This might explain what I've been trying to figure out for years now. The hamburger I consume some years back started tasting awful, mostly because of the texture that seemed 'grisley' to me. It got to the point that the only hamburger I found not to have that texture which I found distasteful was the organic stuff at Whole Foods. It costs as much as a good steak from Safeway. Whole Foods grinds their own burger at the store.

QFC meat department claimed they also ground their own hamburger but it turns out the Kroger brand contained the 'product'. They are now reporting they will quit using it.

I was talking to the Whole Foods butcher about this just a couple days ago. I asked him if it was possible there was some new way the meat was taken off the bone or some other processing thing that would account for the grisley texture of all the commercial hamburger. The butcher didn't know of anything.

It will be interesting to see if indeed this is why hamburger texture has become an issue for me.

Skeptic Ginger · 24th March 2012, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Halfcentaur

I've always been very picky about my ground beef texture and have only bought ground meat from the same place the last 10 years, and my emotional mind is grateful they claim to have never used this vile slime. But I shudder in my emotional heart soul to think of the times I ate ground beefs from the hand of trusted others.

"Texture", you too. Hmmm. But Casebro talks about "no texture" and for me it is rubbery or grisley texture that is at issue. What is the texture issue you speak of?

WildCat · 24th March 2012, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by casebro

eta: Now I'm wonder if the free range cattle thing is really about eating bull meat?

I think it's mostly grass fed vs. corn fed beef.

Cleon · 24th March 2012, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

I think it's mostly grass fed vs. corn fed beef.

Animal welfare, too. Factory farm cattle are crammed in very tightly, and don't have a lot of room to move around.

There's also an environmental angle; the waste results of factory farming are, uh, not exactly pleasant.

Cleon · 24th March 2012, 10:27 AM

Regarding "pink slime;" I think there's enough legitimately wrong with factory farming practices that making **** up is unnecessary. Sure, it sounds unappetizing, but it's not like you're eating wood chips and formaldehyde.

Skeptic Ginger · 24th March 2012, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

Regarding "pink slime;" I think there's enough legitimately wrong with factory farming practices that making **** up is unnecessary. Sure, it sounds unappetizing, but it's not like you're eating wood chips and formaldehyde.

If the stuff is what has been making the texture of burger awful, it is a problem that this was not disclosed.

Jekyll's Guest · 24th March 2012, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by MG1962

I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like?

It's...hard to expleen.

rustypouch · 24th March 2012, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

Animal welfare, too. Factory farm cattle are crammed in very tightly, and don't have a lot of room to move around.

There's also an environmental angle; the waste results of factory farming are, uh, not exactly pleasant.

No, they're not pleasant. But raising beef conventionally, in feedlots and such, is more sustainable than raising it in a free-range, organic method.

As for pink slime, it just reeks of scare tactics to me. Someone devised a way to separate meat from fat and connective tissue, but it leaves the meat in a paste-like form. Good for them for finding a use for meat that would have otherwise been wasted.

With all the worries about ammonia being used in the process, I wonder if the same people also avoid eating grits because lye is used in the process.

defaultdotxbe · 24th March 2012, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by rustypouch

With all the worries about ammonia being used in the process, I wonder if the same people also avoid eating grits because lye is used in the process.

i dont know about grits but i think everyone should avoid eating lutefisk

Mick Houlahan · 24th March 2012, 11:10 AM

This outrage is silly - what did people THINK went into their meat? Upton Sinclair made it pretty clear, and there's no reason to think the meat industry's changed much since "The Jungle." What happened here was that people saw that photo of mechanically separated turkey or chicken parts (that's the stuff that looks like pink toothpaste,) and started screaming about what's in their beef. Or, more precisely, what's in their KIDS' beef, because nothing starts a panic better than a perceived threat to people's precious darlings. That dingbat "chef" Jamie Oliver also helped by creating a huge strawman argument on his cooking show - complete with a locked kitchen cabinet containing a bottle of liquid ammonia among other household poisons, which he poured straight into a container of beef trimmings in a misleading demonstration of how beef is treated at the plant. This was after he made an aside - "this is what I IMAGINE HAPPENING." All this was done with a group of kids in attendance, naturally, to improve the theater.

LSSBB · 24th March 2012, 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by defaultdotxbe

i dont know about grits but i think everyone should avoid eating lutefisk

Or balut

Oliver · 24th March 2012, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Draca

The USDA has utterly betrayed the American people in favor of big business.

That's news to you? Did you see the Food, Inc. documentary yet?

Originally Posted by Brian-M

Seriously, I don't see the problem.

There is a great Jamie Oliver episode talking about the Green Slime - and to me it doesn't really look or sound all that tasty, to be honest.

Actually I wonder why they don't reuse the content of the guts as well using the ammonia washing process, if they get away with it in the US anyway.

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

pipelineaudio · 24th March 2012, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by lssbb

or balut

gack!

Verde · 24th March 2012, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by LSSBB

Or balut

With a side order of durian.

Good eating, but say goodbye to your date for the evening.

V.

24th March 2012, 12:18 AM	#1
Draca Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,222	Pink Slime I've been following the Pink Slime story with disgust. Obviously we can not count on the government to provide protection or honesty on what is being sold as food. Absolutely outraged that major stores have gotten away with selling this. Our food supply is poisoned. What I'm most outraged at is that it isn't even labeled to give people a choice, and there are no plans to require it to be labeled in the future. The USDA has utterly betrayed the American people in favor of big business. Quote from ABC News "A USDA source told ABC news it’s up to the grocery stores to disclose what’s in their ground beef and the Agriculture Department has no jurisdiction." http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...ns-pink-slime/ http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...grocery-store/ http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...ime-free-beef/ http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...nk-slime-beef/
Draca Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,222	__________________ “If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.” ― Malcolm X Last edited by Draca; 24th March 2012 at 12:21 AM.

24th March 2012, 01:05 AM	#3
Draca Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,222	Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross.
Draca Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,222	__________________ “If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.” ― Malcolm X

24th March 2012, 01:15 AM	#4
Joey McGee I am become death, the destroyer of worlds Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 10,257	What a dog is meant to be fed? So evolution shaped that meat in those places in cows for humans to feed to their dogs? No, that's a fearmongering, baseless argument. Quote: Myth 5: Dangerous chemicals are added to boneless lean beef trimmings. Fact: This is a reference to ammonium hydroxide, essentially ammonia and water, both naturally occurring compounds that have been used to make foods safe since 1974, when the Food and Drug Administration declared it GRAS or Generally Recognized as Safe, the highest safety attribution the agency assigns to compounds. Boneless lean beef trimmings receive a puff of ammonia to eliminate bacteria safely and effectively. When combined with moisture naturally in beef, ammonium hydroxide is formed, which is a naturally occurring compound found in many foods, in our own bodies and the environment. Food safety experts and scientists agree it is an effective way to ensure safer ground beef. http://beefisbeef.com/2012/03/15/top...of-pink-slime/ At a time when food issues are looming as a serious challenge to human health in the next few decades, this kind of campaign is what is disgusting. I'll change my mind if there is a real case presented.
	__________________ "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit." - Aristotle - Checklist of Rationality Habits http://rationality.org/checklist/ "I took a bite out of the earth. Sorry, I was drunk." - Joey McGee "I can't think that it would be terrible of me to say — and it is occasionally true — that I need physics more than friends." - J. Robert Oppenheimer

24th March 2012, 02:06 AM	#5
Brian-M Daydreamer Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 8,044	I've never heard of "Pink Slime" before. After looking at the first link and the Wikipedia article, I'm left with one question... What's wrong with using beef trimmings in ground meat? Seriously, I don't see the problem. ETA: Or is it the ammonia gas that's disturbing people for some reason?
Brian-M Daydreamer Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 8,044	__________________ "That is just what you feel, that isn't reality." - hamelekim Last edited by Brian-M; 24th March 2012 at 02:12 AM.

24th March 2012, 05:36 AM	#8
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Location, Location Posts: 55,228	I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true.
	__________________ Read my fantasy novel for free!

24th March 2012, 04:07 AM	#6
Jekyll's Guest Master Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,205	Originally Posted by Brian-M I've never heard of "Pink Slime" before. After looking at the first link and the Wikipedia article, I'm left with one question... What's wrong with using beef trimmings in ground meat? Seriously, I don't see the problem. ETA: Or is it the ammonia gas that's disturbing people for some reason? It's the combination of the word slime, and pictures of pink ooze. It was fine when we didn't know, but now people look at their ground beef and picture pink ooze.

24th March 2012, 05:06 AM	#7
Ryokan Insert something funny here Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Norway Posts: 9,652	Originally Posted by Draca Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross. Would you prefer E. Coli?

24th March 2012, 05:38 AM	#9
aggle-rithm Ardent Formulist Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 15,334	Originally Posted by Draca Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross. Whatever you do, don't think about how many maggots are allowed by the FDA to be in a jar of mayonaise.
	__________________ To understand recursion, you must first understand recursion. Woo's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be adequately explained by aliens.

24th March 2012, 05:48 AM	#10
MatildaGage Muse Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 799	It seems there is a substantial number of meat eaters who are grossed out by the entire concept of meat production. I was one of those--I had to push the very idea (raising, slaughter, butchering, processing) out of my head. I got to the point where I wouldn't even touch it. I had to just slip it into the pan directly from the package and had to deliberately distract myself from thinking about how gross it is. My advice is, if it bothers you that much, a very simple solution is to not eat it. There are plenty of alternatives that are healthy and much less gross--and cheaper too. Now I don't spend so much effort trying to avoid being disgusted by what's on my plate and in my fridge. Life's too short for all that self-imposed angst.
MatildaGage Muse Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 799	__________________ End the grisly, barbaric practice of metzitzah b'peh.

24th March 2012, 06:24 AM	#11
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252	My only beef (get it beef ha ha ha) is the economics of the situation. I am paying for X amount of ground up beef, but in fact only getting Y amount with the balance being made up of filler. And the fact the filler is not described or apparently admitted too on the labeling - (I will check this claim on my next shopping trip) is very troubling. Having said all that I can see circumstances where I would purchase the product (knowingly) and use it as intended. A cheap way to fill peoples bellies when the budget is a bit tight
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252

24th March 2012, 06:29 AM	#12
defaultdotxbe Drunken Shikigami Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 7,474	Originally Posted by MG1962 My only beef (get it beef ha ha ha) is the economics of the situation. I am paying for X amount of ground up beef, but in fact only getting Y amount with the balance being made up of filler. And the fact the filler is not described or apparently admitted too on the labeling - (I will check this claim on my next shopping trip) is very troubling. Having said all that I can see circumstances where I would purchase the product (knowingly) and use it as intended. A cheap way to fill peoples bellies when the budget is a bit tight you pay for X amount of beef, and since the "filler" is made of beef you receive X amount of beef
	__________________ I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein

24th March 2012, 06:39 AM	#13
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252	Originally Posted by defaultdotxbe you pay for X amount of beef, and since the "filler" is made of beef you receive X amount of beef But the articles suggest the 'filler' does not have the nutritional value of beef. It is the same when you get the different qualities of ground beef 70/30 80/20 etc. A consumer sees a price break on the lower quality beef and purchases according to their need, be it health or simple budget constraints
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252

24th March 2012, 06:41 AM	#14
shadron Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 5,918	Originally Posted by Draca Being fed what is meant to be dog food is being nutritionally poisoned in my opinion. Not to mention the ammonia added to kill off all of the ecoli. Beyond gross. "nutritionally poisoned" is a non-sequitur. It is either nutritional or not, but in neither case is it poisoned. Dogs need nutrition just like the rest of us animals do, and they seem to live on it well enough, so it is neither non-nutritional nor poison. Ammonia is added to many things to kill bacteria; I'm sorry if you never noticed. Do you eat hot dogs? You do know it has been used in human food since 1993? You better count on becoming a vegan, because this sort of thing is going to become more prevalent, not less, until meat becomes altogether too expensive to have at all.
shadron Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 5,918	Last edited by shadron; 24th March 2012 at 06:43 AM.

24th March 2012, 06:43 AM	#15
Caper Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 5,727	Originally Posted by arthwollipot I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true. I agree. It's great they borrowed a page from the American Indian.
Caper Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 5,727

24th March 2012, 06:44 AM	#16
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 13,698	I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts'). But I do stay away from the factory made 'chubs' of ground beef. Not because of the by-products, but the "deboned meat". DM is acquired by grinding up all the gristle and bone, filtering out the bone chips, and adding it to the ground meat. No flavor and no texture. Deboned Meat is the "Pink Slime". Logic is " It ain't bone, it must be meat". I do have a dedicated electric meat grinder, and use it mostly to make my own sausage. But will occasionally run a whole brisket through it, and fill the freezer with hamburger. Mostly because I find that the best quality ground beef is too low in fat for best flavor. It's cheaper than buying hamburger, and as a side effect I can set aside some excess fat for home made pie crust.
	__________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Medium minds discuss events. Small minds spend all their time on U-Tube and Facebook.

24th March 2012, 06:47 AM	#17
BobTheCoward Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 7,449	Originally Posted by arthwollipot I for one am very happy that we have a method of recovering edible products from carcasses that would otherwise be discarded. The claim of added ammonia is, at the very least, exaggerated. There are many claims made about so-called "pink slime" that just aren't true. And, as far as I can tell, its still yummy and safe.

24th March 2012, 06:54 AM	#18
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252	Originally Posted by casebro I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts'). I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like?
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252

24th March 2012, 07:01 AM	#19
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 6,620	I just saw a sign at my market saying they never used pink slime, and I wondered what the heck they were talking about. Ew.
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 6,620

24th March 2012, 07:30 AM	#20
defaultdotxbe Drunken Shikigami Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 7,474	Originally Posted by MG1962 But the articles suggest the 'filler' does not have the nutritional value of beef. It is the same when you get the different qualities of ground beef 70/30 80/20 etc. A consumer sees a price break on the lower quality beef and purchases according to their need, be it health or simple budget constraints so what is the nutritional value of "beef" defined as? i thought it was a generic term referring to meat from a cow (which as i mention, the filler is) Originally Posted by casebro I eat all the stuff anyways. Heart, tongue liver, kidney,spleen (called 'melts'). But I do stay away from the factory made 'chubs' of ground beef. Not because of the by-products, but the "deboned meat". DM is acquired by grinding up all the gristle and bone, filtering out the bone chips, and adding it to the ground meat. No flavor and no texture. Deboned Meat is the "Pink Slime". Logic is " It ain't bone, it must be meat". I do have a dedicated electric meat grinder, and use it mostly to make my own sausage. But will occasionally run a whole brisket through it, and fill the freezer with hamburger. Mostly because I find that the best quality ground beef is too low in fat for best flavor. It's cheaper than buying hamburger, and as a side effect I can set aside some excess fat for home made pie crust. the hilighted bit is not true, in 2004 mechanically separated beef was banned for use in products intended for human consumption. the process by which "pink slime" is made stipulates that bones must emerge from the process intact although mechanically separated pork and chicken can still be used (mostly in hot dogs)
	__________________ I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein

24th March 2012, 07:31 AM	#21
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252	Originally Posted by Halfcentaur I just saw a sign at my market saying they never used pink slime, and I wondered what the heck they were talking about. Ew. Its like soylent green only betterer - Only FDA approved pensioners where used in the production.
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 17,252

24th March 2012, 07:59 AM	#22
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 6,620	I've always been very picky about my ground beef texture and have only bought ground meat from the same place the last 10 years, and my emotional mind is grateful they claim to have never used this vile slime. But I shudder in my emotional heart soul to think of the times I ate ground beefs from the hand of trusted others.
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 6,620

24th March 2012, 08:08 AM	#23
ehcks Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302	Food is food. If it tastes good and doesn't make me sick, I don't care. Last time I got sick from something I ate was lobster at the navy base galley because they cooked it wrong. Ground beef is poison? Tell that to my stomach.
ehcks Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302	__________________ Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor

24th March 2012, 08:21 AM	#24
defaultdotxbe Drunken Shikigami Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 7,474	Originally Posted by ehcks Food is food. If it tastes good and doesn't make me sick, I don't care. Last time I got sick from something I ate was lobster at the navy base galley because they cooked it wrong. Ground beef is poison? Tell that to my stomach. thats pretty much been my observation as well 1: apparently i've been eating this stuff my entire life 2: i am well nourished 3: i am in good health conclusion: i kindof want a cheeseburger now
	__________________ I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein

24th March 2012, 08:48 AM	#25
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 13,698	Originally Posted by MG1962 I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like? I've been buying hog melts at the Vietnamese grocers. It tastes somewhere between meat and liver. It has the color of liver, and the long skinny strips have a consistency closer to meat than liver. I could see that it would add flavor to ground products. In fact, a friend was a meat cutter and told me it is used in some of the fast food chains. I use it to make 'dirty rice' mostly as dog food, but I'll eat a bowl or two from every batch too. Not much luck finding recipes other wise, <Melt Recipe> always comes up as a cheeseburger on rye. Aside: I once toured a plant for one of the big fast food chains. Saw what looked like whole deboned carcasses heading into a huge grinder. Bins the size of a pallet. Interesting that they had a recipe. It was about 15% fat, mostly steer meat, with set amounts of cow and bull. I've always wondered about how some places have beefier tasting patties, I figured it's because of higher bull content. I know there are two reasons to make steers out of bulls- docility, and bulls taste gamier. Now I've got a hankering to try a bull steak. eta: Now I'm wonder if the free range cattle thing is really about eating bull meat? If we can taste the difference, maybe there is something healthier about it? Just as we taste the difference between olive and sunflower oils? Maybe the culprit ain't the beef, it's the lack of bull? I wonder how herds are managed in 'low heart attack rate' countries?
	__________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Medium minds discuss events. Small minds spend all their time on U-Tube and Facebook. Last edited by casebro; 24th March 2012 at 08:52 AM.

24th March 2012, 10:08 AM	#26
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 59,856	Originally Posted by MatildaGage My advice is, if it bothers you that much, a very simple solution is to not eat it. There are plenty of alternatives that are healthy and much less gross--and cheaper too. Until you discover what they use as fertilizer on organic vegetable farms...
	__________________ Vive la liberté!

24th March 2012, 10:09 AM	#27
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 61,163	Framing worth noting: Anti-corporate activists name for the stuff: Pink Slime Commercial producers name for the product: Lean Beef Trimmings This might explain what I've been trying to figure out for years now. The hamburger I consume some years back started tasting awful, mostly because of the texture that seemed 'grisley' to me. It got to the point that the only hamburger I found not to have that texture which I found distasteful was the organic stuff at Whole Foods. It costs as much as a good steak from Safeway. Whole Foods grinds their own burger at the store. QFC meat department claimed they also ground their own hamburger but it turns out the Kroger brand contained the 'product'. They are now reporting they will quit using it. I was talking to the Whole Foods butcher about this just a couple days ago. I asked him if it was possible there was some new way the meat was taken off the bone or some other processing thing that would account for the grisley texture of all the commercial hamburger. The butcher didn't know of anything. It will be interesting to see if indeed this is why hamburger texture has become an issue for me.

24th March 2012, 10:11 AM	#28
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 61,163	Originally Posted by Halfcentaur I've always been very picky about my ground beef texture and have only bought ground meat from the same place the last 10 years, and my emotional mind is grateful they claim to have never used this vile slime. But I shudder in my emotional heart soul to think of the times I ate ground beefs from the hand of trusted others. "Texture", you too. Hmmm. But Casebro talks about "no texture" and for me it is rubbery or grisley texture that is at issue. What is the texture issue you speak of?
	Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 24th March 2012 at 10:13 AM.

24th March 2012, 10:14 AM	#29
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 59,856	Originally Posted by casebro eta: Now I'm wonder if the free range cattle thing is really about eating bull meat? I think it's mostly grass fed vs. corn fed beef.
	__________________ Vive la liberté!

24th March 2012, 10:25 AM	#30
Cleon King of the Pod People Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 24,847	Originally Posted by WildCat I think it's mostly grass fed vs. corn fed beef. Animal welfare, too. Factory farm cattle are crammed in very tightly, and don't have a lot of room to move around. There's also an environmental angle; the waste results of factory farming are, uh, not exactly pleasant.
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

24th March 2012, 10:27 AM	#31
Cleon King of the Pod People Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 24,847	Regarding "pink slime;" I think there's enough legitimately wrong with factory farming practices that making **** up is unnecessary. Sure, it sounds unappetizing, but it's not like you're eating wood chips and formaldehyde.
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

24th March 2012, 10:39 AM	#32
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 61,163	Originally Posted by Cleon Regarding "pink slime;" I think there's enough legitimately wrong with factory farming practices that making **** up is unnecessary. Sure, it sounds unappetizing, but it's not like you're eating wood chips and formaldehyde. If the stuff is what has been making the texture of burger awful, it is a problem that this was not disclosed.

24th March 2012, 10:44 AM	#33
Jekyll's Guest Master Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,205	Originally Posted by MG1962 I have not heard of people eating spleen - whats it taste like? It's...hard to expleen.

24th March 2012, 11:01 AM	#34
rustypouch Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 6,517	Originally Posted by Cleon Animal welfare, too. Factory farm cattle are crammed in very tightly, and don't have a lot of room to move around. There's also an environmental angle; the waste results of factory farming are, uh, not exactly pleasant. No, they're not pleasant. But raising beef conventionally, in feedlots and such, is more sustainable than raising it in a free-range, organic method. As for pink slime, it just reeks of scare tactics to me. Someone devised a way to separate meat from fat and connective tissue, but it leaves the meat in a paste-like form. Good for them for finding a use for meat that would have otherwise been wasted. With all the worries about ammonia being used in the process, I wonder if the same people also avoid eating grits because lye is used in the process.
rustypouch Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 6,517

24th March 2012, 11:08 AM	#35
defaultdotxbe Drunken Shikigami Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 7,474	Originally Posted by rustypouch With all the worries about ammonia being used in the process, I wonder if the same people also avoid eating grits because lye is used in the process. i dont know about grits but i think everyone should avoid eating lutefisk
	__________________ I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein

24th March 2012, 11:10 AM	#36
Mick Houlahan Thinker Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 229	This outrage is silly - what did people THINK went into their meat? Upton Sinclair made it pretty clear, and there's no reason to think the meat industry's changed much since "The Jungle." What happened here was that people saw that photo of mechanically separated turkey or chicken parts (that's the stuff that looks like pink toothpaste,) and started screaming about what's in their beef. Or, more precisely, what's in their KIDS' beef, because nothing starts a panic better than a perceived threat to people's precious darlings. That dingbat "chef" Jamie Oliver also helped by creating a huge strawman argument on his cooking show - complete with a locked kitchen cabinet containing a bottle of liquid ammonia among other household poisons, which he poured straight into a container of beef trimmings in a misleading demonstration of how beef is treated at the plant. This was after he made an aside - "this is what I IMAGINE HAPPENING." All this was done with a group of kids in attendance, naturally, to improve the theater.
Mick Houlahan Thinker Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 229