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#1 |
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 41,226
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Dr Crockett Grabbe - "Peer-reviewed article in Journal of Engineering Mechanics"
"Dr. Crockett Grabbe is a physicist who received his PhD from CalTech in 1978. He received a Bachelors of Science with Highest Honors from the University of Texas in 1972."
He "has succeeded in getting a paper successfully through peer-review with editors of the Journal of Engineering Mechanics. His paper confronts Bazant who previously published a paper supportive of the "official 9/11 narrative" in the same journal." - Steven Jones The paper will be published in the October edition. http://911blogger.com/news/2012-09-2...ring-mechanics Anyone know what this guy's angle is on 9/11? ETA: He has published a Kindle book, National Swindle of the World Trade Center which lists some of his claims - the usual debunked crap (fires not hot enough, squibs, etc) |
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"We stigmatize and send to the margins people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid" - Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift". |
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#2 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,899
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(RedIbis, on the other hand, exists to me only in quoted form). - Gravy (Mark Roberts) |
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#3 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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I wouldn't get too excited about this. If there was anything really exciting, he wouldn't have waited 11 years. Some stuff about him...
I'm a little confused about what I'm looking at. I think it is his 2010 publication. http://ascelibrary.org/doi/abs/10.10...3-7889.0000025 It appears to be a critique of Bazant. It is only 1 page long and appears in the 'Discussions & Closure' section of the journal. It's not a research paper. Strangely, the author's affiliations are listed as Research Scientist, Dept. of Physics and Astronomy, Univ. of Iowa. INN World News calls him "professor of physics at the University of Iowa" But he is not listed on the department's webpage. Also, when I did a Google Scholar search in his name, the results were very strange. Throughout the 1990s, he published a great deal about geophysics. The last paper he published was in 2000. After that, he published one thing in The Journal of 9/11 Studies co-authored with Dr. Steve. That's it. So he hasn't published anything in 12 years except 1 piece on 9/11 conspiracy, and his name isn't listed on the faculty of the school he gives as his affiliation. He doesn't look very old. He's not a member of this forum, so I will say bad things about him. I wonder if he went crazy. Does anyone know anyone teaching at Iowa? I know people who graduated there, but that was in Ed Psych and a long time ago. They won't be any help here. Anyone else? |
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#4 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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This might explain something
http://www.prx.org/pieces/60173-croc...ain-hemorrhage
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http://www.sealane.org/physics/ The CV on the page lists these notes as part of a presentation he did Crockett Grabbe, "Showing South Tower of WTC Collapsed from Forces Stronger than Gravity," American Assoc. of Physics Teachers Chicago Meeting, Feb. 15, 2009. http://www.sealane.org/writings/Chicago209pap.html and Crockett Grabbe, "Showing South Tower of WTC Collapsed from Forces Stronger than Gravity," American Assoc. of Physics Teachers Chicago Meeting, Feb. 15, 2009. http://www.sealane.org/writings/Chicago209pap.html His CV here lists publications I did not find with Google Scholar. Crockett Grabbe - Explosives Caused the World Trade Center to Collapse http://www.prx.org/pieces/66053-croc...the-world-trad and then there's Space weapons and the strategic defense initiative by Crockett L. Grabbe |
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#5 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Dog House
Posts: 26,103
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He is an crazy 911 truth nut. blogger? LOL, blogger is the source for idiotic claims on 911, a nest of woo.
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#6 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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I just found this
http://www.sealane.org/writings/Bazantrpy.html Interestingly, his affiliation is listed as SeaLane Research & Consulting of which he is the only employee. I just read through Crockett Grabbe, "Showing South Tower of WTC Collapsed from Forces Stronger than Gravity," American Assoc. of Physics Teachers Chicago Meeting, Feb. 15, 2009. http://www.sealane.org/writings/Chicago209pap.html He appears to be trying to argue that there were bombs going off all over the WTC South Tower and that
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http://www.sealane.org/physics/publi...s/WTCslides/05
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#7 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 18,272
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The Bazant-paper that Grabbe allegedly "refutes" in JEM is probably a more recent one from, iirc, 2011. Tony Szamboti along with a couple of collaborators also tried to publish a discussion piece on that, but apparently failed. So Grabbe did better.
Rehashing ozeco41's reasoning (and, coincidentally, Major_Tom's), Bazant is far out in a field where his WTC models don't resemble the actual collapses as he focuses on column resistance when in fact the main failure mode was tearing-out of the much weaker column-to-floor connectors, with columns following mostly behind. Tony criticises some of Bazant's choices of values, such as mass of falling material or thickness of columns, but commits the same mistake of ignoring that it mostly wasn't the columns that failed but the floors. I'd suppose Grabbe is on the same track. |
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#8 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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I'm a little surprised at his 2010 opinion piece. He cites his own work and stuff from the J of 9/11 Studies. I wonder if the Journal of Engineering Mechanics has a very liberal policy about their Opinion section and edit things submitted from qualified people only for style. These guys have been fishing around for long enough. It's not surprising they've found something respectable that they can publish in. I didn't know that Tony had also tried this with them and failed, so it seems that even with this liberal standard, they can't get much published.
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#9 |
Pedantic Bore
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Abandon All Hope
Posts: 6,808
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Perhaps Crockett Grabbe is an unfortunate victim of nominative determinism?
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Do not weep. Do not wax indignant. Understand. - Baruch Spinoza You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. - Harlan Ellison |
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#10 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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Unfortunately, I think he is a victim of a much more serious condition.
http://www.prx.org/pieces/60173-croc...ain-hemorrhage
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#11 |
Pedantic Bore
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Abandon All Hope
Posts: 6,808
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That is unfortunate. It's frightening, sad and humbling just to contemplate just how fragile the human body and mind is. He has my sympathy and my respect for how he managed to claw his way back from the brink of death and disability, but that's as far as my respect for him goes.
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__________________
Do not weep. Do not wax indignant. Understand. - Baruch Spinoza You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. - Harlan Ellison |
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#12 |
"más divertido"
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: USA! USA!
Posts: 24,384
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"Squibs" that travel at highway speeds rather than supersonic are not indicative of explosives. Why don't these chowderheads think a little about what makes an explosive an explosive?
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#13 |
Graduate Poster
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,461
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Jones must be pretty envious that someone actually went through a real peer review.
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#14 |
Muse
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 974
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#15 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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#16 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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__________________
“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#17 |
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 41,226
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__________________
"We stigmatize and send to the margins people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid" - Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift". |
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#18 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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Someone might want to inform Scott Sommers that reading a scientific or technical paper is a little different than reading Facebook profiles. There often is more than one page. |
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“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#19 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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__________________
“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#20 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 18,272
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You don't understand what is "discarded" and what isn't.
The early FEMA-theory that NIST discarded was "pancaking" as the initiation mechanism for collapse, i.e. FEMA believed that the collapse started when some floor disconnected from columns and dropped onto the one below. NIST says this was not the first major failure that started the rapid phase of collapse, and that instead the rapid phase was iniated by the failure of inward bowing columns. In either case, the dominant mechanism for collapse progression was still what you might call "pancaking", i.e. floor failures racing ahead of column failures as the main driver. Do you have links to openly accessible copies of the Seffen paper itself, and the closure? For completeness's and context's sake. Thanks. |
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#21 |
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 41,226
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__________________
"We stigmatize and send to the margins people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid" - Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift". |
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#22 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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__________________
“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#23 |
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 41,226
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__________________
"We stigmatize and send to the margins people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid" - Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift". |
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#24 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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__________________
“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#25 |
I AM the Red Worm!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,452
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__________________
I'll be the best Congressman money can buy! As usual, he doesn't understand the relevant sciences, can't Google for the right thing, and appears to rely on the notion that a word salad liberally sprinkled with Google Croutons will make his argument seem coherent. -JayUtah |
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#26 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 5,398
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It's actually a common sophist technique. Mock everything except what is actually claimed. And even if you mock something the other guy claims, you still don't actually have to say it's wrong.
Congratulations. You pointed out someone was looking at the wrong website and corrected them on an entirely minor and almost irrelevant detail. How's that CD theory coming? Why should anyone bother? You've demonstrated an amazing faculty for conveniently misunderstanding other people. And if ON refuses to give you a link, I am absolutely sure you'll try and conflate "won't" with "can't". What does ergo have against Scott anyway? |
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#27 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,899
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__________________
(RedIbis, on the other hand, exists to me only in quoted form). - Gravy (Mark Roberts) |
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#28 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,865
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First off, this publication is not a paper. It is an opinion sent to the editor of the journal. The comparison is similar to 'a letter to the editor' being called 'an article'. Anyway...
Your point is fair enough. Except my judgement of him is based on a review of his other writings and opinions about 9/11. It's clear where he stands on these things and whether or not the opinion piece is good or not, his other work is weird. You may not feel it's weird, but from my side of the forum, he expresses points that no educated person should. This nonsense about 'squibs' is just silly. So while I admire him as a person and respect some of his academic work, in my search for why such a person would write such nonsense about 9/11, I have to look to his unusual neurological condition. |
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#29 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Dog House
Posts: 26,103
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No need for that, the guy believes the WTC was CD. That is nuts based on the evidence he has, zero evidence. He did come up with his theory after he had major brain problems, it takes years to learn to walk, and think rationally, it failed with him. It is sad he suffered the brain problem, it is sad he is not rational on 911.
Read his paper, it is poppycock. Do you do more than trash your fellow JREF members, or can you figure out this guy is full of nonsense? |
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#30 |
Graduate Poster
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#31 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Apr 2011
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#32 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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I'm not sure where you find NIST making this distinction. Please provide a citation. In any case, the problems with the pancaking model became obvious very quickly, and pancaking was quietly discarded.
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“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#33 |
Graduate Poster
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,461
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So quiet they put it online back in 2006:
NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab; see diagram). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon. |
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#34 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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Discussion articles are standard with the JEM, and standard in scientific publishing. They are in fact what advances scientific theory and understanding on a matter. They are not "letters to the editor". Good lord.
I thought I was just joking when I said that Scott Sommers doesn't understand scientific publishing. But it's true. He really, really doesn't. ![]() |
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“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#35 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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Thanks, Shek, for providing the backup to my point.
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“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#36 |
Graduate Poster
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,461
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Being "standard" doesn't mean they are peer reviewed as Jonesy, & apparently you, like to pretend. The ASCE has an entire page on submissions other than actual studies. The only type of submission they note that undergoes peer review, other than actual studies, are forums.
Your point was that they make no distinction. I showed they did. You really have a problem seeing eye to eye with reality. |
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#37 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,339
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Wrong again. Any discussion of an article published by JEM also goes through peer review.
What is it with 9/11 bedunkers and their complete ignorance of scientific publishing? Perhaps the only standard they know are publications like "Skeptic" magazine. ![]()
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“Much of the 9/11 story has not been told to the public" - Steven Badger, attorney for insurance litigators affected by the WTC disaster. |
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#38 |
Graduate Poster
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,461
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You should let the ASCE know. Apparently you know their own journal and practices better than they do. I guess we will just have to take your word for it.
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Did you say NIST makes no distinction? Yes. Did I show them making that distinction? Yes. Keep up with the back-flips. |
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#39 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 5,398
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And yet, you provide no evidence for that claim.
Let me guess; you think that's the same as "all manuscripts are peer reviewed". Saying "all manuscripts need to have enough public sources to be reproducible or fact-checked" is not the same as "all manuscripts are peer reviewed". The document GMS linked clearly says exactly what he says it does. You, meanwhile, continue to not provide evidence. Almost as if you didn't have any. Strange.
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Also on the page he linked; I'm not sure why you're asking for evidence from an organization that disagrees with you. |
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#40 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,899
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To which edition of the JEM are you referring? The discussion was published in 4/10, this new paper passed the peer review process (according to Jones )and will be published in 10/12. It was either peer reviewed or it wasn't. Jones is either right or wrong. We might wait a few weeks and find out.
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Aren't you in the academic community? Do you really think such attacks on the man's mental health is a responsible, persuasive argument? |
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(RedIbis, on the other hand, exists to me only in quoted form). - Gravy (Mark Roberts) |
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