ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » General Skepticism and The Paranormal
 

Notices


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags hypnosis , past life regression , past lives , reincarnation

Reply
Old 7th October 2012, 01:48 AM   #1
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Reincarnation Anybody? Past lives or not?



Scientific Proof of Reincarnation

Dr. Ian Stevenson's Life Work
"Either he [Dr. Stevenson] is making a colossal mistake. Or he will be known as the Galileo of the 20th century." Dr Harold Lief in the Journal of Nervous and Mental Disease

About Dr. Ian Stevenson
Omni Magazine's Interview with Dr. Ian Stevenson
Sweet Swarnlata: An Example Case of Dr. Ian Stevenson's

Dr. Ian Stevenson Probably the best known, if not most respected, collection of scientific data that appears to provide scientific proof that reincarnation is real, is the life's work of Dr. Ian Stevenson. Instead of relying on hypnosis to verify that an individual has had a previous life, he instead chose to collect thousands of cases of children who spontaneously (without hypnosis) remember a past life. Dr. Ian Stevenson uses this approach because spontaneous past life memories in a child can be investigated using strict scientific protocols.

Read the full article:

http://reluctant-messenger.com/reincarnation-proof.htm


Hi everyone,

above is an interesting article on proof of reincarnation, I just would like to hear some opinions of the local Skeptics.

Who believes and who does not?


Thank you.

Last edited by josh3623; 7th October 2012 at 01:49 AM.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 02:19 AM   #2
SusanB-M1
Incurable Optimist
 
SusanB-M1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,167
Various well-known supposedly 'real' cases of reincarnation have been discussed - and dissected! - hereabouts during the years I've been here. It always turns out that there are facts that show there are other, perfectly natural explanations for these apparent cases. Where puzzling things come up, they should be first investigated as coincidences, etc.

when you consider that all children who talk about such things cannot do so until they are about two or three, by which time their brains have absorbed via their senses anabsolutely colossal amount of information then when they come out with words or sentences that adults interpret asobviously meaning this or that, well, off we go onanother 'verified' case of reincarnation!
__________________
I know that you believe that you understood what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
SusanB-M1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 02:35 AM   #3
PixyMisa
Persnickety Insect
 
PixyMisa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sunny Munuvia
Posts: 16,078
Susan said it well. The reports have been examined, and there is no evidence that really stands up; nothing that can be confirmed to have happened that lacks a reasonable explanation.

Also, reincarnation is impossible. If something is impossible, but you have solid evidence that it actually happens, then go for it; that's where scientific breakthroughs come from.

If something is impossible, and all you have is vague stories, then... Not so much.
__________________
Free blogs for skeptics... And everyone else. mee.nu
What, in the Holy Name of Gzortch, are you people doing?!?!!? - TGHO
PixyMisa is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 02:48 AM   #4
Last of the Fraggles
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,013
Whenever I see something titled 'Scientific Proof of X' then I can pretty much assume it's bunk. I doubt this is any different, particularly since your link seems to be a 15 year old interview.

Skimming some of it, his reasoning seems to be based on things like interests and aptitudes of young children and physical evidence (?) such as birthmarks or birth defects. Why would a past life leave any physical marks on a brand new body?

It sounds like someone looking for evidence where none exists, and making some leaps to try to connect things that are unconnected.
Last of the Fraggles is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 03:24 AM   #5
Stray Cat
Philosopher
 
Stray Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,805
Originally Posted by josh3623 View Post
[Dr. Stevenson] is making a colossal mistake.
This.
__________________
It's only my madness that stops me from going insane!
Stray Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 03:32 AM   #6
Naddig74
Has a Rucksack
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,641
Nope. One go each, no refunds. Next.
__________________
Those who live in glass houses should not drink their own urine. - Cuddles
Naddig74 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 04:07 AM   #7
pakeha
Penultimate Amazing
 
pakeha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,339
Hi, Josh.
Do you have any follow-up on that 15 year old interview?
pakeha is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 04:15 AM   #8
Mojo
Mostly harmless
 
Mojo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 25,641
Quote:
Reincarnation Anybody?

Zaphod: "There’s a whole new life stretching out in front of you!"
Marvin: "Oh, not another one."
__________________
"You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield

"The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky
Mojo is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 06:48 AM   #9
Bikewer
Penultimate Amazing
 
Bikewer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: St. Louis, Mo.
Posts: 10,581
Although reincarnation is perhaps more attractive than the Abrahamic "you get one chance, and it's Heaven or Hell, bud." approach...
Both ideas still just airily assume the existence of some sort of "soul", some non-physical something that can carry information and consciousness. How this is supposed to work is never explained or modeled. Not the slightest hint as to how something "non-material" could possibly retain information, or maintain consciousness.
Bikewer is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 07:31 AM   #10
23_Tauri
Illuminator
 
23_Tauri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,947
Originally Posted by Bikewer View Post
Although reincarnation is perhaps more attractive than the Abrahamic "you get one chance, and it's Heaven or Hell, bud." approach...
Both ideas still just airily assume the existence of some sort of "soul", some non-physical something that can carry information and consciousness. How this is supposed to work is never explained or modeled. Not the slightest hint as to how something "non-material" could possibly retain information, or maintain consciousness.
And put like that, it sounds worryingly like homeopathy. There's nothing there, but nothing remembers all this really cool stuff!

Not wanting to libel Dr Stevenson, but reading this page, which contains a short summary of his studies, he sounds pretty bonkers to me. Take this, for example:

Quote:
In many cases presented by Dr. Stevenson there are also medical documents available as further proof, which are usually compiled after the death of the person. Dr. Stevenson adds that in the cases he researched and "solved" in which birthmarks and deformities were present, he didn't suppose there was any other apposite explanation than that of reincarnation. Only 30% - 60% of these deformities can be put down to birth defects which related to genetic factors, virus infections or chemical causes (like those found in children damaged by the drug Thalidomide or alcohol). Apart from these demonstrable causes, the medical profession has no other explanation for the other 40% to 70% of cases than that of mere chance. Stevenson has now succeeded in giving us an explanation of why a person is born with these deformities and why they appear precisely in that part of their body and not in another.
So what the good doctor seems to be suggesting is because modern medical science hasn't found an explanation for these birth-marks, then they must be the result of reincarnation.

Facepalm!
__________________
Little Miss Witchcraft, she's not made of straw.
23_Tauri is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 07:35 AM   #11
Lanzy
Muse
 
Lanzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 925
So, a soul just keeps on keeping on? Maybe proof for this thing called a soul first?
Lanzy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 07:40 AM   #12
23_Tauri
Illuminator
 
23_Tauri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,947
Originally Posted by Lanzy View Post
So, a soul just keeps on keeping on? Maybe proof for this thing called a soul first?
I imagine believers in this sort of thing indulge in circular thinking, Lanzy. e.g. "We know the soul exists because these children's memories are proof of reincarnation. We know that reincarnation could be possible because we have souls".

__________________
Little Miss Witchcraft, she's not made of straw.
23_Tauri is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 07:52 AM   #13
ellindsey
Thinker
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 228
Arguably, even if you have ironclad cases of children remembering previous lives, with details that they would have had no way of knowing that can be independently verified as correct, you still haven't proven reincarnation. All you have proven is that there exists some form of anomalous, possibly supernatural means of information transfer. It could just as easily be the case that the children have developed retrocognition - they're somehow psychically seeing the past and mistaking what they're seeing for their own memories. Or they're channeling the ghosts of the people who's memories they're reporting. Or possibly some other entity was in telepathic contact with the dead people, and is now in telepathic contact with the kids and transferring the memories to them. Once you allow one supernatural explanation, you have to also consider every other equally likely supernatural explanation.

To really, truly prove reincarnation, you have to first prove the existence of a soul. Not by coming up with examples of events which could be explained by a soul, but with some kind of ironclad physical detection method, similar to how we demonstrate the existence of neutrinos or gamma rays. Then, you need to prove that souls are unique, that individual souls exist that are distinguishable from each other in some way that you can unambiguously detect. You need to develop technology to identify an individual soul, similar to how we can use DNA matching to match a biological sample to a specific person. Once you have done all that, you can then take soul-ID readings on people who are about to die, and then after they've died take soul-ID readings on newborns, and look for matches. Then, and only then, you'll have proven that reincarnation happens.
ellindsey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 08:02 AM   #14
RobDegraves
Muse
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 787
In a past life I was the Amazing Randi.
RobDegraves is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 10:40 AM   #15
Mojo
Mostly harmless
 
Mojo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 25,641
Originally Posted by josh3623 View Post
Dr. Ian Stevenson Probably the best known, if not most respected, collection of scientific data that appears to provide scientific proof that reincarnation is real, is the life's work of Dr. Ian Stevenson. Instead of relying on hypnosis to verify that an individual has had a previous life, he instead chose to collect thousands of cases of children who spontaneously (without hypnosis) remember a past life. Dr. Ian Stevenson uses this approach because spontaneous past life memories in a child can be investigated using strict scientific protocols.

He was a big favourite of Interesting Ian's. Probably still is.
__________________
"You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield

"The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky
Mojo is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 10:56 AM   #16
dlorde
Philosopher
 
dlorde's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 6,308
In The Skeptic's Dictionary biography of Stevenson, it gives a good critique of his work and its pitfalls. Tellingly, it also says:
Quote:
... he resented being described by journalists as trying to prove reincarnation. He believed that he had produced a body of evidence for reincarnation that must be taken seriously. But he admitted that "the evidence is not flawless and it certainly does not compel such a belief. Even the best of it is open to alternative interpretations, and one can only censure those who say there is no evidence whatever."
__________________
Simple probability tells us that we should expect coincidences, and simple psychology tells us that we'll remember the ones we notice...

Last edited by dlorde; 7th October 2012 at 10:57 AM.
dlorde is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 11:40 AM   #17
Weak Kitten
Graduate Poster
 
Weak Kitten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,910
Has anyone ever addressed why remembering past lives is so utterly useless? I mean, no one ever remembers a past life and then suddenly gains the ability to speak a foreign language. Or at least gain some trade skills like shoe making or carpentry. Heck, just getting to skip the whole potty training and learning to walk phase would be seriously useful!
__________________
A quick reminder to all participants that although incomprehensibility is not against the Membership Agreement, incivility is. Please try and remember this, and keep your exchanges polite and respectful. -arthwollipot
Weak Kitten is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 12:17 PM   #18
tsig
a carbon based life-form
 
tsig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 33,986
Originally Posted by josh3623 View Post


Scientific Proof of Reincarnation

Dr. Ian Stevenson's Life Work
"Either he [Dr. Stevenson] is making a colossal mistake. Or he will be known as the Galileo of the 20th century." Dr Harold Lief in the Journal of Nervous and Mental Disease

About Dr. Ian Stevenson
Omni Magazine's Interview with Dr. Ian Stevenson
Sweet Swarnlata: An Example Case of Dr. Ian Stevenson's

Dr. Ian Stevenson Probably the best known, if not most respected, collection of scientific data that appears to provide scientific proof that reincarnation is real, is the life's work of Dr. Ian Stevenson. Instead of relying on hypnosis to verify that an individual has had a previous life, he instead chose to collect thousands of cases of children who spontaneously (without hypnosis) remember a past life. Dr. Ian Stevenson uses this approach because spontaneous past life memories in a child can be investigated using strict scientific protocols.

Read the full article:

http://reluctant-messenger.com/reincarnation-proof.htm


Hi everyone,

above is an interesting article on proof of reincarnation, I just would like to hear some opinions of the local Skeptics.

Who believes and who does not?


Thank you.
From the link:

Quote:
"We are the Created God remembering we are God." Lucifer wants to stop the progression of our souls so that we will not become God beings. This is the reason for the Rebellion of Lucifer. Lucifer became our Eternal enemy by trying to stop our reincarnations from achieving God Consciousness.
Did someone say scientific?
tsig is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 12:19 PM   #19
tsig
a carbon based life-form
 
tsig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 33,986
Originally Posted by pakeha View Post
Hi, Josh.
Do you have any follow-up on that 15 year old interview?
Maybe the good doc has died and been reincarnated and is now a 3 year old girl wrestling with bad memories.
tsig is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 12:26 PM   #20
Captain_Swoop
Philosopher
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,394
Where do all the new souls come from?
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 12:28 PM   #21
Robrob
Philosopher
 
Robrob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 5,508
Originally Posted by Weak Kitten View Post
Has anyone ever addressed why remembering past lives is so utterly useless? I mean, no one ever remembers a past life and then suddenly gains the ability to speak a foreign language. Or at least gain some trade skills like shoe making or carpentry. Heck, just getting to skip the whole potty training and learning to walk phase would be seriously useful!
^This.

Not to mention the whole reversed scientific process of "moving from an conclusion (souls) to the theory (reincarnation)."

Pretend some child actually spoke a foreign language or knew specific facts unknowable other than to an observer - e.g. "there are 62 silver pennies and a single gold farthing buried behind the fireplace, etc..." Why would this make us leap to the conclusion of reincarnation? Wouldn't other forms of (equally imaginary) woo make just as much/more sense? ESP, spirit channeling, divine guidance, etc...? Interesting this is the first (and only) place they leap.

Last edited by Robrob; 7th October 2012 at 12:29 PM.
Robrob is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 12:50 PM   #22
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by pakeha View Post
Hi, Josh.
Do you have any follow-up on that 15 year old interview?
here are some cool youtube links:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF3KqGpxXvo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZTtU...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbWME...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoSrz...eature=related
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 01:08 PM   #23
23_Tauri
Illuminator
 
23_Tauri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,947
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Where do all the new souls come from?
That place on the corner where you can get spare keys cut at the same time.

__________________
Little Miss Witchcraft, she's not made of straw.
23_Tauri is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th October 2012, 03:10 PM   #24
Stray Cat
Philosopher
 
Stray Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,805
Originally Posted by josh3623 View Post

So the answer is "no" then.
__________________
It's only my madness that stops me from going insane!
Stray Cat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 04:17 AM   #25
catsmate1
Penultimate Amazing
 
catsmate1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 11,567
Originally Posted by pakeha View Post
Hi, Josh.
Do you have any follow-up on that 15 year old interview?
Well not from Stephenson, unless he was right, he died five years ago.
__________________
As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.
catsmate1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 04:35 AM   #26
pakeha
Penultimate Amazing
 
pakeha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,339


You win, catsmate1.
Anyway, I meant by that ill-considered post was to ask if there's more current literature on the subject than that 15 year old interview.

Those youtube videos were intriguing, josh!
But at the end of the day, where do they lead us?
pakeha is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 04:52 AM   #27
Eddie Dane
Philosopher
 
Eddie Dane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,038
I remember I was once known as Vlad the Impaler.

But you know, who can continue a career in porn after the age of forty?
Eddie Dane is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 04:56 AM   #28
Last of the Fraggles
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,013
Originally Posted by josh3623 View Post
Is that it?

Seriously, you post something presumably looking for discussion, people respond and your only follow-up is to dump so more youtube links without engaging with any of the people who responded to the OP?
Last of the Fraggles is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 05:01 AM   #29
LarianLeQuella
Elf Wino
 
LarianLeQuella's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,008
Cool

Originally Posted by Weak Kitten View Post
Has anyone ever addressed why remembering past lives is so utterly useless? I mean, no one ever remembers a past life and then suddenly gains the ability to speak a foreign language. Or at least gain some trade skills like shoe making or carpentry. Heck, just getting to skip the whole potty training and learning to walk phase would be seriously useful!
This.

And another thing that has always amused me. Very few people ever claim to have been the pissboy, janitor, or pig farmer. Instead they were a general, king, queen, or some other notable figure. It seems only interesting people get reincarneted...
LarianLeQuella is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 05:50 AM   #30
Naddig74
Has a Rucksack
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,641
Originally Posted by LarianLeQuella View Post
This.

And another thing that has always amused me. Very few people ever claim to have been the pissboy, janitor, or pig farmer. Instead they were a general, king, queen, or some other notable figure. It seems only interesting people get reincarneted...
This. Where are all the chinese peasants?
__________________
Those who live in glass houses should not drink their own urine. - Cuddles
Naddig74 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 12:46 PM   #31
xtifr
Graduate Poster
 
xtifr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,290
Originally Posted by ellindsey View Post
Arguably, even if you have ironclad cases of children remembering previous lives, with details that they would have had no way of knowing that can be independently verified as correct, you still haven't proven reincarnation. All you have proven is that there exists some form of anomalous, possibly supernatural means of information transfer.
This. It's like the people who believe that "intelligent design" leads to Christianity, when, in fact, it does no such thing, and could just as easily be used as evidence of Hinduism or some African tribal religion, or even something we've never imagined. (Assuming it actually had evidence, which, of course, it doesn't.)

Originally Posted by LarianLeQuella View Post
And another thing that has always amused me. Very few people ever claim to have been the pissboy, janitor, or pig farmer. Instead they were a general, king, queen, or some other notable figure. It seems only interesting people get reincarneted...
This part is actually better explained by some "anomolous, possibly supernatural means of information transfer". Simple cross-time telepathy, for example, would explain almost everything that's offered as evidence of reincarnation, and answers the question of why so many people remember "being" Cleopatra.

It's sad, isn't it, that skeptics can come up with better magical explanations of magical events than people who actually believe in those events. Of course, it makes sense. Critical thinking is something that can be applied even to the most preposterous of hypotheses.
__________________
"Those who learn from history are doomed to watch others repeat it."
-- Anonymous Slashdot poster
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore."
-- James Nicoll
xtifr is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th October 2012, 03:06 PM   #32
Halfcentaur
Philosopher
 
Halfcentaur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 6,645
I used to lie as a child about this sort of thing all the time. People act like a 6 year can't be interested in world history.
Halfcentaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 03:43 PM   #33
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by pakeha View Post


You win, catsmate1.
Anyway, I meant by that ill-considered post was to ask if there's more current literature on the subject than that 15 year old interview.

Those youtube videos were intriguing, josh!
But at the end of the day, where do they lead us?
I am not precisely sure.
They are interesting, but they certainly don't qualify as proof.

I thought they were entertaining at least.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 03:46 PM   #34
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by Last of the Fraggles View Post
Is that it?

Seriously, you post something presumably looking for discussion, people respond and your only follow-up is to dump so more youtube links without engaging with any of the people who responded to the OP?
Actually I offered those links, because another member requested some other material.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 03:56 PM   #35
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by pakeha View Post


You win, catsmate1.
Anyway, I meant by that ill-considered post was to ask if there's more current literature on the subject than that 15 year old interview.
Well its hard to get current when the guy died several years ago, last time I checked, there were many dead scientists whose works are well regarded even though they have not been recently updated.

here is some more detailed material, perhaps you will find it more interesting.

http://near-death.com/experiences/reincarnation01.html
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 04:02 PM   #36
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
I find the whole thing with the birthmarks to be very interesting.
While not specifically proof, here we have something which most certainly can be regarded as circumstantial evidence.

from a scientific perspective, these anomalies are notable and could feasibly be grounds for the formation of some kind of hypothesis.

http://www.sinor.ru/~che/birthmarks.htm
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 04:05 PM   #37
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Here is a fairly lengthy preview of one of his books, his methodology is exhaustive and given the massive amount of data he has compiled, I would say that his findings are worthy of noting.


http://books.google.co.ke/books?id=J...page&q&f=false

Last edited by josh3623; 10th October 2012 at 04:28 PM.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 04:18 PM   #38
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by SusanB-M1 View Post
Various well-known supposedly 'real' cases of reincarnation have been discussed - and dissected! - hereabouts during the years I've been here. It always turns out that there are facts that show there are other, perfectly natural explanations for these apparent cases. Where puzzling things come up, they should be first investigated as coincidences, etc.

when you consider that all children who talk about such things cannot do so until they are about two or three, by which time their brains have absorbed via their senses anabsolutely colossal amount of information then when they come out with words or sentences that adults interpret asobviously meaning this or that, well, off we go onanother 'verified' case of reincarnation!
That is all well and good, however it does not explain the birthmarks.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 04:20 PM   #39
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Where do all the new souls come from?
That is the $64,000 question...
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th October 2012, 04:26 PM   #40
josh3623
Thinker
 
josh3623's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by Halfcentaur View Post
I used to lie as a child about this sort of thing all the time. People act like a 6 year can't be interested in world history.
Did your lies create scar like birthmarks on your body which corresponded anatomically with fatal wounds of the deceased individuals whom you were lying about?

Last edited by josh3623; 10th October 2012 at 04:27 PM.
josh3623 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » General Skepticism and The Paranormal

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:00 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2014, TribeTech AB. All Rights Reserved.
This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.