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Old 30th January 2013, 12:57 PM   #1
sir drinks-a-lot
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Ban long kitchen knives?

There is a movement in Britain to ban long kitchen knives to prevent stabbings:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4581871.stm

What do you think? Do you agree with the ban, or do you not care about all of the children?

Should they all go? Wusthoff, Henckels, Shun, etc?

What about fondue forks? Martini picks?
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:00 PM   #2
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I call bs on the claim "by chefs" that long knives aren't necessary in the kitchen. Ever try cutting a watermelon with a short knife? Also chopping piles of things is easiest with a long knife.

And heck, I can't even really cook and I thought of those two immediately.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:02 PM   #3
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well, they obviously have to do something about the problem. Anything's better than nothing!
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:03 PM   #4
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Long kitchen knives have other functions besides murder.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:03 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I call bs on the claim "by chefs" that long knives aren't necessary in the kitchen. Ever try cutting a watermelon with a short knife? Also chopping piles of things is easiest with a long knife.

And heck, I can't even really cook and I thought of those two immediately.
I'm an amateur chef, and I can't imagine chopping Napa cabbage with a 3" paring knife.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:06 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I call bs on the claim "by chefs" that long knives aren't necessary in the kitchen. Ever try cutting a watermelon with a short knife? Also chopping piles of things is easiest with a long knife.
Not defending anything, but the article was not calling for removing long knives, but for removing the pointed tip on them.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:07 PM   #7
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I liked the bit about the introduction of forks was as a C19th attempt to stop people from stabbing each other in restaurants.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:07 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I call bs on the claim "by chefs" that long knives aren't necessary in the kitchen. Ever try cutting a watermelon with a short knife? Also chopping piles of things is easiest with a long knife.

And heck, I can't even really cook and I thought of those two immediately.
It's not long knives that they want banned, but rather long pointed knives. Rounding or squaring the end of the knife would be a way of helping to prevent stabbing injuries. The chef's comments were on the usefulness of using a long knife where you needed to use the point. They noted that for most point work you use a short knife.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:08 PM   #9
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And after they take away all the long knives, they'll go after the short ones. Then the pointy scissors and pencils. Then anything hard or weighty.

If they just had guns, they wouldn't have all these stabbings.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:09 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
There is a movement in Britain to ban long kitchen knives to prevent stabbings:.........
Is? Is? Really?

That article was written in 2005.

That's getting pretty close to straw man territory for my money.

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Old 30th January 2013, 01:10 PM   #11
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Are they giving size limit they would like to implement? I didn't see one in the article so I really have no idea what size knives would be banned.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:11 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Nessie View Post
I liked the bit about the introduction of forks was as a C19th attempt to stop people from stabbing each other in restaurants.
It was later further modified to prevent forkings with the introduction of the spork.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:11 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Is? Is? Really?

That article was written in 2005.

That's getting pretty close to straw man territory for my money.

Mike
So they solved their problem without banning knife-tips??
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:17 PM   #14
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Frankly, the problem isn't solved because it is insoluble. However, it would seem to be under reasonable control. Gang stuff is proving hard to break up, I understand, and that is where the bulk of the trouble is.

But let's not feed this silly bit of mischief making. There is no "movement to ban long kitchen knives in Britain". End of story.

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Old 30th January 2013, 01:20 PM   #15
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Start by banning knives with black plastic handles.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:21 PM   #16
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Can't read the actual paper unless you join the BMJ. Oh well. I will say for now that kitchen knives should not be banned - gut reaction. I would like to know more about the 10 chefs that said long knives aren't needed.



ETA: I did not mean all kitchen knives. I type to fast sometimes. I meant the long pointy ones referred to in the article.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:24 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
Can't read the actual paper unless you join the BMJ. Oh well. I will say for now that kitchen knives should not be banned - gut reaction. I would like to know more about the 10 chefs that said long knives aren't needed.
I'm truely disappointed. For a bunch of skeptics, few seem to have actually read the article, or the other posts. This was never about banning long knives, it was about banning the pointy tip on the end.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:25 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
Can't read the actual paper unless you join the BMJ. Oh well. I will say for now that kitchen knives should not be banned - gut reaction. I would like to know more about the 10 chefs that said long knives aren't needed.
They don't like long knives. Variously sized ingredients in the food they prepare, they recommend very highly.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:27 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
I'm truely disappointed. For a bunch of skeptics, few seem to have actually read the article, or the other posts. This was never about banning long knives, it was about banning the pointy tip on the end.
No. It's is about banning long pointy knives. The short pointy ones would be allowed but they do not list what would be the allowable length with a pointy end.

ETA: I looked back at my post and saw I was inaccurate in my description of the issue. I have ETA'ed that post as well to clarify what I intended to convey.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:30 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
It was later further modified to prevent forkings with the introduction of the spork.
I firmly believe those who came up with the idea should just fork off.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:30 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Hercules Rockefeller View Post
Start by banning knives with black plastic handles.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:38 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by BowlOfRed View Post
Not defending anything, but the article was not calling for removing long knives, but for removing the pointed tip on them.
I think that would still present difficulty with a watermelon. You'd have to position the blade like a guillotine and push downward. I can't see that as being particularly safe.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:45 PM   #23
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Re: Ban long kitchen knives?

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I think that would still present difficulty with a watermelon. You'd have to position the blade like a guillotine and push downward. I can't see that as being particularly safe.
I haven't had problems with it. But I have pretty big kitchen knives and only buy relatively small watermellon.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:50 PM   #24
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I'm doing you the credit of assuming that, like all civilized persons, you cut your watermelon into a whale shape.
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:58 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
I'm truely disappointed. For a bunch of skeptics, few seem to have actually read the article, or the other posts. This was never about banning long knives, it was about banning the pointy tip on the end.
First they came for my pointy tip, and I said nothing...
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:00 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by patchbunny View Post
First they came for my pointy tip, and I said nothing...
That's why they circumcise babies and not adults.
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:06 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
Are they giving size limit they would like to implement? I didn't see one in the article so I really have no idea what size knives would be banned.
The law already exists in Scotland, so wee pen knives are OK

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1995/39/section/49

"Subject to subsection (3) below, this section applies to any article which has a blade or is sharply pointed.
(3)This section does not apply to a folding pocket knife if the cutting edge of its blade does not exceed three inches (7.62 centimetres)."
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:11 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by patchbunny View Post
First they came for my pointy tip, and I said nothing...
Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
That's why they circumcise babies and not adults.
Brain... so filled... with jokes...
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:47 PM   #29
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Murder with knives, swords, machetes and the like are not at all uncommon here in Canada. Perhaps a ban is long overdue.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/video/man-k...192100904.html

We could use President Obama's rationale that "if it just saves one life" then it is worth a try.

Though first we need to create a media buzz by fabricating a fear of 'assault knives', the concept that nobody 'needs' a slashing, stabbing, throat-cutting killing device and vilify those 'knife-nuts'!

I think that this is doable...
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:48 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Is? Is? Really?

That article was written in 2005.

That's getting pretty close to straw man territory for my money.

Mike
And I think I recall that we had a thread about it at the time. In which it was variously pointed out that there isn't a general 'movement' trying to get them banned.
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:55 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by IDB87 View Post
Long kitchen knives have other functions besides murder.
That argument has been used justifiably with respect to other dangerous tools also but with little success. No private individual really needs a knife anyway.

Eat soup...
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Old 30th January 2013, 02:56 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Polaris View Post
I'm an amateur chef, and I can't imagine chopping Napa cabbage with a 3" paring knife.
Goddammit Nappa!
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:04 PM   #33
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You'll be pleased to know that Australian knife nuts foamed at the mouth over sensible bans to dangerous knives:

Quote:
Dear fellow cold steel enthusiasts, On the 19th of January i received a letter from Australian customs to inform me that my item was seized. An XL vaquero and an XL voyager. Many of you Australians are familiar with customs seizing "flick knives" (any knife opened by a wrist flick). The way to deal with this issue is to ask the knife store to tighten the pivot, this is what i requested. However this was not the reason that my knife was seized. My 2 knives were seized because they were "single handed opening knives". And they are. But to class that as a prohibited item is complete and utter ********. A single handed opening knife would be any knife with a thumb stud. This means that the following knives are prohibited to be imported into Australia and will be seized- Counter point series, hold out series, tuff light series, rajah series, espada series, voyagers/vaqueros, AK47, recon 1, Spartan, American lawman/mini, pocket bushman, ti lite, thumb stud mackinak hunter and the thumb stud lone star hunter. These new import laws came into action on the 14 December 2011 as per the ministers election commitment. I have never felt so cheated and so disgusted by my countries government. What happened to our freedom? What happened to our justice? Please Americans and other nations, fight for your knife rights before you turn into Australia.
http://coldsteelforums.com/A-sad-day...s-m168335.aspx

Meanwhile, the rest of the nation yawned and went about their business.
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:08 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
You'll be pleased to know that Australian knife nuts foamed at the mouth over sensible bans to dangerous knives:



http://coldsteelforums.com/A-sad-day...s-m168335.aspx

Meanwhile, the rest of the nation yawned and went about their business.
Sounds like a solution in search of a problem. But people not giving a rat's ass about other people's rights and property until it's their turn is nothing new.
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:13 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
There is a movement in Britain to ban long kitchen knives to prevent stabbings:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4581871.stm

What do you think? Do you agree with the ban, or do you not care about all of the children?

Should they all go? Wusthoff, Henckels, Shun, etc?

What about fondue forks? Martini picks?
There is no such movement, please note the date on the article you linked to.
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:20 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Rat View Post
And I think I recall that we had a thread about it at the time. In which it was variously pointed out that there isn't a general 'movement' trying to get them banned.
Here it is being brought up in January 2011 : http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=196759 and from 2006: http://www.internationalskeptics.com...ad.php?t=57694
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:46 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I call bs on the claim "by chefs" that long knives aren't necessary in the kitchen. Ever try cutting a watermelon with a short knife? Also chopping piles of things is easiest with a long knife.

And heck, I can't even really cook and I thought of those two immediately.
I'm an amateur cook, but I can cut a watermelon with a short knife. It isn't as clean or easy as it is with a long knife but it is possible.
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Old 30th January 2013, 04:02 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
I'm an amateur cook, but I can cut a watermelon with a short knife. It isn't as clean or easy as it is with a long knife but it is possible.
And you could probably cut it with a unbent paperclip if you absolutely had to.
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Old 30th January 2013, 05:01 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
And you could probably cut it with a unbent paperclip if you absolutely had to.
Probably, but there's no practical reason to do it like that and no situation in which I'd have a watermelon but no knife (even if it is just the knife I normally carry off of school property).
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Last edited by Mudcat; 30th January 2013 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 30th January 2013, 05:06 PM   #40
Bikewer
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I imagine my 8" Henckles carving knife would be a pretty efficient weapon... It's straight, so it'd be a dagger rather than a slasher, but still...
A surprising number of criminals use kitchen knives because they are readily accessible or can be picked up for next to nothing at any thrift store. Also stolen steak-house knives and ratty old "hunting" knives...
In fact, in my 40+ years as a police officer, I've never seen anything like a quality "tactical" knife in the hands of a bad guy.
Why would they pop 150 or 200 bucks for a top-grade knife only to toss it down a storm drain if that pesky squad car stops?
The weapons of homicide include a very wide variety of tools and implements....Lug wrenches are popular, as are hatchets, hammers, pieces of pipe, screwdrivers... You name it, it's probably been used to kill somebody.
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