The Papers of Stephen J. Crothers

Gord_in_Toronto said:
Mr Crothers and his "Theory" is deconstructed here:
http://dealingwithcreationisminastr...9/12/paper-illustrating-more-of-crothers.html
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See also the thread from March 2012 on mathematics of black hole denialism. In that thread, I began by tracing Crothers's original error back to an error made by a more competent mathematician, Leonard S Abrams. By post #14, I had moved on to some of Crothers's more recent errors. Soon, several of the forum's physicists were contributing.

(The forum still hasn't repaired its LaTeX feature, so you'll have to read the more technical equations as LaTeX. If there's enough interest in this, I could translate the gist of the thread into a set of web pages with more readable equations.)
 
jeffreyw said:
Mr. Crothers IMO is a badass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuH1SLTDs7o

Debunking black holes, big bang and other pseudoscience and woo. Good job Mr. Crothers!
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Mr. Crothers is a fool, an incompetent and a complete *******. Like so many other idiots who know no science, no math and still think their opinions (what they have is in no way a result of true study or real brainpower) will overturn actual science and they will be remembered and honored after they die and are found right. Just wish they could be around to see AT BEST themselves revealed as fools, knaves, morons.
 
Well, good!!! By the end we all appear to agree that Mr. C.is indeed a fool and a buffoon!!:D
 
Brian-M said:
So you're saying that he is a badass... because his reasoning is bad and he's a complete ass? :)
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Oh, and as a sidenote, in the old days my exact phrase was : "Why yes, yes he is an ass entire, an ass complete, indeed, an *******!"
 
Just noticed this thread, so: This is Stephen J. Crothers
Stephen J. Crothers (born 1957) is a handyman/gardener and part-time amateur scientist who claims that black holes do not exist, and are neither predicted by nor compatible with General Relativity.[2][3] His body of work consists primarily of vanity-published articles that he posts at his personal website;[4] thus steering clear of the peer-review process. He has also been a guest speaker at several informal conferences held by the Electric Universe crowd.[5][6]
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Reality Check said:
Just noticed this thread, so: This is Stephen J. Crothers
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So the thread has nothing to do with the actual papers of Mr. Crothers?

It's sad when you realise that in terms of credentials I am more qualified than Mr Crothers. And I know pretty much NOTHING about Black Holes beyond what I've read in popular science books and this forum.

We need a better class of crank.
 
W.D.Clinger said:
See also the thread from March 2012 on mathematics of black hole denialism. In that thread, I began by tracing Crothers's original error back to an error made by a more competent mathematician, Leonard S Abrams. I had moved on to some of Crothers' more recent errors. Soon, several of the forum's physicists were contributing.

(The forum still hasn't repaired its LaTeX feature, so you'll have to read the more technical equations as LaTeX. If there's enough interest in this, I could translate the gist of the thread into a set of web pages with more readable equations.)
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I can't speak for the other members of this forum, but personally I would be very interested in reading your analysis and critique of Stephen Crothers' work.
 
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Slings and Arrows said:
I can't speak for the other members of this forum, but personally I would be very interested in reading your analysis and critique of Stephen Crothers' work.
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Welcome to the forum, and thank you for your interest.

I'm in the middle of a major project right now, but I'll try to collect the essence of that thread, with readable equations, when I get a chance (sometime in March, I hope).
 
W.D.Clinger said:
Welcome to the forum, and thank you for your interest.

I'm in the middle of a major project right now, but I'll try to collect the essence of that thread, with readable equations, when I get a chance (sometime in March, I hope).
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Excellent! I’ll be watching for it. Your time and effort is greatly appreciated.
 
Stephen Crothers will be a speaker at this year’s Electric Universe conference (June 25-29, 2015):

In his presentation, Stephen Crothers shall reveal the sacred secrets of tensor calculus and its accoutrements in order to see through the mathematical smoke and mirrors of Einstein and his followers. Anybody with high-school knowledge of the calculus is more than well prepared to deal with these matters. Perhaps this is the most frightening truth cosmologists must face. After all, calculations themselves are mere mechanical operations that impart no knowledge of their purpose in relation to physics. Curiously, neither Einstein knew nor his followers know how to do their sums right. That they don’t add up is sufficient to render them a form of numerology, which, like sympathetic magic and phrenology, does not lead to knowledge.

Steve Crothers is a preeminent mathematician, counted among the most competent critics of modern cosmology (including both the General Theory of Relativity and popular theory of the Big Bang). He has also gained much attention for his systematic unraveling of standard Black Hole theory, showing that the mathematical model of a Black Hole follows neither from observation nor from any logical reasoning from Einstein’s General Theory of Relativity.

w_w_w.thunderbolts.info/wp/2015/01/31/eu2015-home-page/
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Price of admission: $345 per person.
 
Slings and Arrows said:
Stephen Crothers will be a speaker at this year’s Electric Universe conference (June 25-29, 2015):




Price of admission: $345 per person.
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sounds fair to me - I always go to my local handyman for advice on relativity and astrophysics.

Besides, *tensor* calculus!
 
I'm still getting my head around the existence of an Electric Universe conference.
 
Slings and Arrows said:
Stephen Crothers will be a speaker at this year’s Electric Universe conference (June 25-29, 2015):
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Wow - so many delusions in such a small quote :jaw-dropp!
Stephen J. Crothers is a obscure, ignored amateur mathematician.

No rational person thinks that Stephen J. Crothers has shown that black holes are not a consequence of GR. Undergraduate physics students learn about and derive the Schwarzschild solution every year and see that it has an event horizon (a defining feature of a black hole).
 
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Slings and Arrows said:
Fans of Stephen J. Crothers should be thrilled to hear that he will be a guest speaker at the upcoming “3rd Rational Physics Conference” (May 16-17, 2015), hosted by Bill "Comb-Over" Gaede:

http://www.rationalphysics.info/default.asp?dir=/0003170

Here is the riveting speech that Crothers delivered at last year’s conference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8FsfFs_nvM

Price of admission: 40 Pound Sterling[/QUOTE

I watched parts of the vid, thinking he'd use math I couldn't follow. Instead he was claiming the CMB is really caused by microwave emissions from water, cuz, you know, water absorbs microwaves in microwave ovens! He says the O-H stretch vibration is responsible. Last I knew that vibration absorbs in the infrared.
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ferd burfle said:
I watched parts of the vid, thinking he'd use math I couldn't follow. Instead he was claiming the CMB is really caused by microwave emissions from water, cuz, you know, water absorbs microwaves in microwave ovens! He says the O-H stretch vibration is responsible. Last I knew that vibration absorbs in the infrared.
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Yep, that’s his latest crusade. Stephen Crothers, along with his new found friend Pierre-Marie Robitaille, are convinced that the CMB is generated by the Earth’s oceans. Here is Professor Brian Koberlein’s assessment of the theory (including the customary belligerent comments from Crothers):

https://briankoberlein.com/2014/12/30/tilting-windmills/
 
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Crother's theory is so stupid, I can disprove using a method that should satisfy even a relativity/QM/GR/big-bang/dark-matter/fusion-powered-stars/global-warming/etc. denier.

Crothers says that COBE, WMAP, and Planck didn't see real photons coming from the sky? He says they just saw non-sky-related noise sources? Dude, they all saw the same thing. COBE saw some hot spots, then WMAP saw hot spots in the same sky directions, then Planck saw the same features in the same direction for a third time. That's not what noise does.

It's like looking at three clear photos of the Statue of Liberty and saying "I think this is Polaroid emulsion is just random noise. I think this 35mm slide may have been taken with the lens cap on. I think this JPG is decrypted wrong. We can't conclude that the Statue of Liberty exists and emits photons at all." Dude, three types of random noise couldn't have produced three copies of a view of the Statue of Liberty three times.

Go ahead and come up with a non-Big-Bang hypothesis for where these photons are coming from, go ahead and ignore/deny SR/GR/astro/atoms/QM/math/anything while saying so, but you have to be a special kind of delusionaut to pretend that they're not actual incoming photons, coming from far away, with the directions and quantities and frequencies claimed.

(ETA: I'm sure Crothers and Robitaille will be happy to tell me I'm an idiot, that seems to be their schtick. They seem to prefer to blather about the detectability-or-not of the CMB monopole and dipole, rather than about the higher-L perturbations, but I can't detect any sense in that either.)
 
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ben m said:
I'm sure Crothers and Robitaille will be happy to tell me I'm an idiot, that seems to be their schtick.
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If Crothers were to respond to your criticism, this is what he would most likely say.
(Note: these are actual quotes, only the name has been altered):

“Once again the disingenuous Mr. Ben M is shooting off his inept mouth. Ben M, you are a liar, a scoundrel, a fraudster, and a hypocrite.

“You have rightly earnt yourself a bloody nose, and if not for the distance between us I might well have visited you to deliver the causative blow, not because of your incompetent technical argument, but because your behaviour has been that of an a**hole. It seems that you are doomed to live and die a conceited sh**head.”
 
Slings and Arrows said:
If Crothers were to respond to your criticism, this is what he would most likely say.
(Note: these are actual quotes, only the name has been altered):

“Once again the disingenuous Mr. Ben M is shooting off his inept mouth. Ben M, you are a liar, a scoundrel, a fraudster, and a hypocrite.

“You have rightly earnt yourself a bloody nose, and if not for the distance between us I might well have visited you to deliver the causative blow, not because of your incompetent technical argument, but because your behaviour has been that of an a**hole. It seems that you are doomed to live and die a conceited sh**head.”
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I was hoping for some amusing Australianisms. "You've got kangaroos loose in the top paddock, you dumb barra. You've drongo from Woomera to Woolloomooloo with a sheep dip for billy-boil."
 
Slings and Arrows said:
If Crothers were to respond to your criticism, this is what he would most likely say.
(Note: these are actual quotes, only the name has been altered):

“Once again the disingenuous Mr. Ben M is shooting off his inept mouth. Ben M, you are a liar, a scoundrel, a fraudster, and a hypocrite.

“You have rightly earnt yourself a bloody nose, and if not for the distance between us I might well have visited you to deliver the causative blow, not because of your incompetent technical argument, but because your behaviour has been that of an a**hole. It seems that you are doomed to live and die a conceited sh**head.”
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IIRC, that was aimed at Roy Kerr?

Back in the day, (2008-2009) when I first "discovered" crackpot physics, I spent quite some time "debating" SC (noblackholes on YT) and B. Gaede on YouTube. They are simply "crazy" for lack of a better word. Gaede has since disabled comments on his videos and is having a hard time reaching even +2K views. These guys are just run of the mill of morons.

BG told me 7 years ago that mankind was doomed in a matter of (a few) months. I'm still waiting. :D

I gave up after about a year when I realized there was no progress to be made with these types. A lesson I appreciate.
 
Hercules Rockefeller said:
IIRC, that was aimed at Roy Kerr?
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No, it wasn’t Roy Kerr. The above comment was addressed to mathematician Malcolm MacCallum.

This is the email that Crothers sent to Roy Kerr:

If you are such a great mathematician as is routinely claimed by the relativists, then it should not be difficult for you to rigorously refute my claims… Only then can you shoot off your arrogant mouth, and think of yourself as a legend in your own lunchtime, and tell me that my work is "rubbish". I therefore challenge you to prove my geometry invalid. My prediction is that you will not take up the challenge as that is the only safe bet for you so that your own reputation and those of the relativists can be saved from humiliation.
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Stephen Crothers and Pierre-Marie Robitaille will be guest speakers at the upcoming Electric Universe conference (June 25-29, 2015).

Stephen Crothers – “General Relativity: A case study in numerology”

Pierre-Marie Robitaille – “Kirchhoff’s Claims”

Jeffrey Wolynski – unfortunately, his request to speak at this year’s prestigious event was denied; there are now accusations of censorship...

https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2015/01/31/eu2015-speakers/
 
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ferd burfle said:
Slings and Arrows said:
Fans of Stephen J. Crothers should be thrilled to hear that he will be a guest speaker at the upcoming “3rd Rational Physics Conference” (May 16-17, 2015), hosted by Bill "Comb-Over" Gaede:

http://www.rationalphysics.info/default.asp?dir=/0003170

Here is the riveting speech that Crothers delivered at last year’s conference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8FsfFs_nvM

Price of admission: 40 Pound Sterling[/QUOTE

I watched parts of the vid, thinking he'd use math I couldn't follow. Instead he was claiming the CMB is really caused by microwave emissions from water, cuz, you know, water absorbs microwaves in microwave ovens! He says the O-H stretch vibration is responsible. Last I knew that vibration absorbs in the infrared.
Click to expand...

The stretch mode absorbs infrared radiation only in the rest frame of the water molecule. However, the CBM is shifted to the microwave region by the expansion of the universe.

Do I have to explain everything :cool:
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ben m said:
Crother's theory is so stupid, I can disprove using a method that should satisfy even a relativity/QM/GR/big-bang/dark-matter/fusion-powered-stars/global-warming/etc. denier.
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Crother's theory (borrowed wholesale and blindly from Robitaille) becomes even ignorant when we note that the orbits of COBE, WMAP and Planck were different. So they would have got different maps from any microwaves emitted from Earth's oceans.
COBE was in a 900 km altitude circular Sun-synchronous orbit.
WMAP was placed at the L2 Lagrangian point (1.5 million kilometers from Earth) specifically to minimize contamination.
Planck was also placed at the L2 Lagrangian point n a different orbit.
 
Reality Check said:
Crother's theory (borrowed wholesale and blindly from Robitaille) becomes even ignorant when we note that the orbits of COBE, WMAP and Planck were different. So they would have got different maps from any microwaves emitted from Earth's oceans.
COBE was in a 900 km altitude circular Sun-synchronous orbit.
WMAP was placed at the L2 Lagrangian point (1.5 million kilometers from Earth) specifically to minimize contamination.
Planck was also placed at the L2 Lagrangian point n a different orbit.
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When Crothers isn’t busy mindlessly parroting Pierre-Marie Robitaille, he’s hard at work mindlessly parroting Leonard S. Abrams -- See the "mathematics of black hole denialism" by W. D. Clinger .

Crothers’ entire stand-up comedy routine is just material he has lifted from others.
 
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W.D.Clinger said:
Welcome to the forum, and thank you for your interest.

I'm in the middle of a major project right now, but I'll try to collect the essence of that thread, with readable equations, when I get a chance (sometime in March, I hope).
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This is just a friendly reminder. I am still eagerly looking forward to reading your analysis of Stephen Crothers’ work, with readable LaTeX enabled equations.

I realize that you are busy doing real science, and are hard pressed to waste time on Stephen Crothers’ misguided nonsense. But if you can ever find a free moment, I am certain there are many of us who would thoroughly enjoy reading your deconstruction of Stephen Crothers’ mathematics.

Many thanks!
 
Nobel prize winner Dr. Gerard ‘t Hooft (May 8, 2015):

Dear Koberlein,

I’m quite amused to see the arrows Mr. Crothers now aims at your direction. For some time I was one of his targets, when he was spouting nonsense about black holes and big bang theory. Then he started to report about this Robitaille person. Robitaille had criticized CMB observations, and since Crothers wanted to argue away the CMB for his own purposes, he became an admirer of Robitaille.

For my amusement, I looked at this youtube video where Robitaille lectures about Kirchhoff’s law. It is not difficult to spot the point where his argument goes astray. He doesn’t understand the most basic laws of thermodynamics, and that, if you have a cavity with the same temperature T everywhere, then the radiation intensity inside the cavity will be in equilibrium with that, or, the radiation curve will show the unique black-body distribution corresponding to that temperature, regardless of the material the walls of the cavity are made of. That’s how you derive Kirchhoff’s law, but of course you know that. Robitaille and Crothers don’t. Amazingly, they manage to get followers, but don’t worry, fringe scientists never succeed in making a dent in real science.

G. 't Hooft

https://briankoberlein.com/2014/12/30/tilting-windmills/
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Apropos of nothing in particular but, for its population, Australia does throw up its share of leading crackpot peddlers, it seems to me.
 
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