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Old 1st January 2017, 05:39 PM   #361
BobTheCoward
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
This assumes that Trump is stupid. It's dangerous to underestimate the guy.
He is stupid. Bullies don't succeed because they are secretly smart.
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Old 1st January 2017, 06:16 PM   #362
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Mod Warning Will you all please try a great deal harder to play the ball [argument] and not the player [arguer]. Many thanks.
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Old 1st January 2017, 06:39 PM   #363
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Which Opera Talents?
Placido Domingo
Vittorio Grigolo
Jose Carreras
Sumi Lo
Kathrine Jenkins
Sarah Brightman
Andrea Bocelli

Some would claim that the last two are crossover singers, but only if you ignore their past.

ETA: I forgot Joaquin Luceni, I didn't see that one.

Last edited by Marcus; 1st January 2017 at 07:00 PM.
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Old 1st January 2017, 06:39 PM   #364
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I don't agree about her being average, but you're right, I shouldn't have called her an opera singer, she's a classical/ classical crossover singer. She went straight to individual performances , she doesn't participate in operas. Her duets with prominent opera talents are quite magical though.
I don't see any magic. Just mediocrity.
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Old 1st January 2017, 06:46 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
He is stupid. Bullies don't succeed because they are secretly smart.
He's not secretly smart, he's an intelligent bully. Much more dangerous than a stupid bully. Don't mistake his habit of speaking without thinking first as stupidity.
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Old 1st January 2017, 08:26 PM   #366
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Post

Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
I never disagreed with the idea that THERE IS NO BOYCOTT.
THEN YOU NEVER HAD ANY REASON TO OBJECT TO MY POST.

Quote:
Essentially, you proudly disproved a straw man, offered in the form of musings, by a single person.
It's not a straw man if someone actually offered it up. And the fact that it was offered up by only one person isn't relevant. I was responding to that one person.

Quote:
Your point was that the boycott wasn't working. There is no boycott.
Which means.... (wait for it)... it's not working!

This is about as simple a concept as one could state, and yet you still can't grasp it.

Quote:
Further, the proof that it isn't working was a right-wing spin on Jackie's PR people commenting how well her album sales were doing.
The relevant part is that her sales are going up. Why they are going up is actually quite secondary to that point.

Quote:
"Why are you doing that?"
"It's to keep the tigers away, man."
"There are no tigers in New York City."
"See, it's working."
The irony here is that the actual parallel is thinking that snapping your fingers (calling for a boycott on this forum) will summon a tiger (produce a boycott). I'm the one saying there's no tigers.
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Old 1st January 2017, 08:43 PM   #367
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Jackie Evancho Political Views

Jackie’s been vocal about her support for transgender people as her sister is transgender. In 2015 she posted a cover to Ed Sheeran’s All of the Stars, dedicated to her. Additionally, the singer has also participated as a spokesperson for Humane Society for a few years, showing her inclination to political activism.


http://www.celebritybeliefs.com/jackie-evancho/


She's also a theist ( Catholic) and has sung for the Pope, but hey, no one is perfect.
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Old 1st January 2017, 09:10 PM   #368
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
He's not secretly smart, he's an intelligent bully. Much more dangerous than a stupid bully. Don't mistake his habit of speaking without thinking first as stupidity.
I don't think he would score highly on any assessment of intelligence.
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Old 1st January 2017, 09:12 PM   #369
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
I don't think he would score highly on any assessment of intelligence.
But he would Tweet about it: That test was a loser test, worst test, losing money bigtime, total losers!
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Old 1st January 2017, 10:28 PM   #370
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The interesting thing to me about this whole difficulty in finding acts is that it shows a deep dislike or distrust of Donald Trump by some entertainers, and perhaps a fear that their audience will retaliate against them if they appear with the President of the United States, if that President happens to be someone that they loathe. Or perhaps it isn't the audience as such, but perhaps the entertainment industry. Stars are not made by pure talent, after all. Negative press and shunning by insiders could derail a career.

That latter part, the fear of retaliation, is something that disturbs me. To be honest, although I loathe Trump, people should not be afraid to entertain for the President. There's something worrisome about that to me.

The really interesting thing will be to see how easy it will be to get acts to perform at the inauguration in 2020. If that inauguration is a second Trump inauguration, will performers give up their reluctance to perform? If it's someone other than Trump, will they rush to join in a happy day celebration of getting him out?

This is all so speculative. We really don't know what The Donald will do in office. When casting my vote, I certainly wasn't willing to take the chance, but since I got overruled by the Electoral College, I have no choice but to sit back and see what this guy actually does once he is sworn in. Meanwhile, I don't think anyone ought to hold it against an entertainer if they choose to perform at the party. We have to put up with Trump. We might as well have some good tunes to make it a little easier to stomach.
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Old 1st January 2017, 10:45 PM   #371
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In the case of famous musical stars, one of the luxuries of being vastly successful in that industry is having the power to choose which gigs you want to do and which you don't. If I were a bajillionaire singer I probably wouldn't work at all, but if I did feel like performing it would only be for people or causes I really liked.

I don't know what kind of work everyone else does, but my work has to literally pay me to be there, and if I had so much money I didn't have to go in I wouldn't...unless someone I really, really liked wanted me to come in to do whatever it is I do for a living for a short time, as a favor. So from that perspective, it may not be that all these stars actually loathe Trump, or are afraid of career suicide by singing for him; it may just be that they don't like him enough to exert any special effort on his behalf. "Meh, if it were a more fantastic president, maybe, but I really don't feel like being in DC in January, and he's no John Quincy Adams."
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Old 2nd January 2017, 01:10 AM   #372
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
He's not secretly smart, he's an intelligent bully. Much more dangerous than a stupid bully. Don't mistake his habit of speaking without thinking first as stupidity.
I think an argument could be made that Trump is sort of like Forrest Gump... someone of questionable intelligence who just happens to find success due in large part to pure luck.

For example:

- Trump's wealth is due in large part to his family (he inherited millions, had his father bail him out of financial problems, etc.)

- His success in the primaries was due in large part to the fact that the Republican field was extremely fractured, and was filled with candidates that had significant problems of their own (Jeb Bush's being related to GW Bush, Ted Cruz being unlikable, etc.) If the republicans had started with a smaller field of candidates, he might not have won the primaries.

- His success against Clinton was due in large part by long-term anti-Hillary rhetoric laid down by Republicans going back years before Trump announced his candidacy (not to mention Russian hacking and Comrey's assistance).
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Old 2nd January 2017, 01:15 AM   #373
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
THEN YOU NEVER HAD ANY REASON TO OBJECT TO MY POST.



It's not a straw man if someone actually offered it up. And the fact that it was offered up by only one person isn't relevant. I was responding to that one person.



Which means.... (wait for it)... it's not working!

This is about as simple a concept as one could state, and yet you still can't grasp it.



The relevant part is that her sales are going up. Why they are going up is actually quite secondary to that point.



The irony here is that the actual parallel is thinking that snapping your fingers (calling for a boycott on this forum) will summon a tiger (produce a boycott). I'm the one saying there's no tigers.
Last post wins?

You still went to a slimey source and have not validated the data in any way. Congratulations! Two internet points for dodging the issue over multiple days.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 01:29 AM   #374
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
The interesting thing to me about this whole difficulty in finding acts is that it shows a deep dislike or distrust of Donald Trump by some entertainers, and perhaps a fear that their audience will retaliate against them if they appear with the President of the United States, if that President happens to be someone that they loathe. Or perhaps it isn't the audience as such, but perhaps the entertainment industry. Stars are not made by pure talent, after all. Negative press and shunning by insiders could derail a career.

That latter part, the fear of retaliation, is something that disturbs me. To be honest, although I loathe Trump, people should not be afraid to entertain for the President. There's something worrisome about that to me.
Do you have any evidence that that is indeed happening (i.e. that entertainers aren't interested in performing because of the fear of insider backlash? After all, we've seen some entertainers with some pretty distasteful events in their history (Mel Gibson's anti-jewish remarks, Eminem's anti-gay remarks), yet these performers have continued to work in the industry, and "insiders" continue to associate with them. I can't imagine performing for Trump would be seen as any less detrimental.

Remember, we're not talking about some up-and-comer, who would be easy to discard before they hit it big... Supposedly they want A-list performers for the Inauguration. Hard to imagine any musical acts being shunned by the industry for performing for Trump if they are regularly putting out gold records. "I know your last record went multi-platinum, but because you performed for Trump I am going to give up millions of dollars producing your records because I don't like the president-elect" just doesn't sound like it would happen.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 01:30 AM   #375
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
Placido Domingo
Vittorio Grigolo
Jose Carreras
Sumi Lo
Kathrine Jenkins
Sarah Brightman
Andrea Bocelli

Some would claim that the last two are crossover singers, but only if you ignore their past.

ETA: I forgot Joaquin Luceni, I didn't see that one.
Katherine Jenkins AFAIK has never actually performed a whole opera professionally. She may belt out the occasional aria (pretty badly IMO) but I think it a gross exaggeration to call her an opera singer.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 06:20 AM   #376
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
You still went to a slimey source
Oh noes!
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Old 2nd January 2017, 11:05 AM   #377
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
The interesting thing to me about this whole difficulty in finding acts is that it shows a deep dislike or distrust of Donald Trump by some entertainers, and perhaps a fear that their audience will retaliate against them if they appear with the President of the United States,<snip>

Considering how near to evenly divided the country was in its support for Trump it seems like they ought to be just about as worried about retaliation for refusing to appear with him. Conservative backlash is probably more vituperative than liberals'.

(Remember what happened to the Dixie Chicks, just for saying they thought Bush was an embarrassment to Texas for his prosecution of the Iraq war.)

Damned if they do ...etc."

I don't see why it is particularly farfetched to think that they simply don't want their art to be seen as support for Trump.

Hard to blame them for that.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 03:29 PM   #378
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You guys seem to not be aware that the ONLY thing Miss Evancho is singing at the inauguration is the national anthem. That's it. She's not performing any of her own music or providing anything other than a short appearance. And she has in the past performed for President Obama as well. If anyone could be said to be completely neutral in this, it's her; she's singing the national anthem at an inauguration and that's all she's doing. She's not doing it simply because Trump is becoming the President. Any recent increase in sales of her music aside, she's filling a small niche role in the inauguration that, quite frankly, could easily be filled by any competent singer. Perhaps not as well, I will grant you, but you don't need to be a big name to sing the national anthem.

The issue at hand here is that Trump is finding it virtually impossible to find anyone to perform THEIR music at his inauguration. Miss Evancho, in reality, can't really be said to be "performing" in the sense that is meant in the OP, and practically every other big name artist that people might actually KNOW about have turned Trump down because they do not want to be associated with him. Miss Evancho should not be affected at all, since her role is, as I've said, a small niche role at best, so her being there likely will not affect her at all. I wonder if the same will be able to be said for Kid Rock, who is at least a relatively well-known artist right now, even if he is somewhat of a has-been anyway. I'd be more impressed if people were making HIS albums fly off the shelves rather than Miss Evancho's.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 03:56 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
You guys seem to not be aware that the ONLY thing Miss Evancho is singing at the inauguration is the national anthem. That's it. ....
Good point.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 03:57 PM   #380
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Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
I wonder if the same will be able to be said for Kid Rock, who is at least a relatively well-known artist right now, even if he is somewhat of a has-been anyway. I'd be more impressed if people were making HIS albums fly off the shelves rather than Miss Evancho's.
It would be proof of poltergeists if Kid Rock's albums fly off any shelves in 2017.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 04:20 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
It would be proof of poltergeists if Kid Rock's albums fly off any shelves in 2017.

Do stores even stock albums any more? I haven't bought any music, other than downloads, in ages.

If they did still stock those, I would imagine that 2017 would see a California earthquake strong enough so that while they may not exactly fly off a shelf, they could slide off rapidly.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 04:31 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Hokulele View Post
Do stores even stock albums any more? I haven't bought any music, other than downloads, in ages.

If they did still stock those, I would imagine that 2017 would see a California earthquake strong enough so that while they may not exactly fly off a shelf, they could slide off rapidly.
But if physical albums do exist somewhere, would anybody make them for Kid Rock? And if so, would anybody stock them? I asked Siri where I could get a Kid Rock album and she asked if I wanted to search Amazon for time machines.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 04:33 PM   #383
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
But if physical albums do exist somewhere, would anybody make them for Kid Rock? And if so, would anybody stock them? I asked Siri where I could get a Kid Rock album and she asked if I wanted to search Amazon for time machines.

Yeah, well, I heard that Siri voted for Clinton.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 05:26 PM   #384
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Katherine Jenkins AFAIK has never actually performed a whole opera professionally. She may belt out the occasional aria (pretty badly IMO) but I think it a gross exaggeration to call her an opera singer.
Okay, after looking it up (I'm not claiming to be an expert) I have to agree that she is only a classical singer.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 05:29 PM   #385
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Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
You guys seem to not be aware that the ONLY thing Miss Evancho is singing at the inauguration is the national anthem. That's it. She's not performing any of her own music or providing anything other than a short appearance. And she has in the past performed for President Obama as well. If anyone could be said to be completely neutral in this, it's her; she's singing the national anthem at an inauguration and that's all she's doing. She's not doing it simply because Trump is becoming the President. Any recent increase in sales of her music aside, she's filling a small niche role in the inauguration that, quite frankly, could easily be filled by any competent singer. Perhaps not as well, I will grant you, but you don't need to be a big name to sing the national anthem.

The issue at hand here is that Trump is finding it virtually impossible to find anyone to perform THEIR music at his inauguration. Miss Evancho, in reality, can't really be said to be "performing" in the sense that is meant in the OP, and practically every other big name artist that people might actually KNOW about have turned Trump down because they do not want to be associated with him. Miss Evancho should not be affected at all, since her role is, as I've said, a small niche role at best, so her being there likely will not affect her at all. I wonder if the same will be able to be said for Kid Rock, who is at least a relatively well-known artist right now, even if he is somewhat of a has-been anyway. I'd be more impressed if people were making HIS albums fly off the shelves rather than Miss Evancho's.
I wasn't aware of that, but it's a pity, as I would much rather listen to Jackie sing than Trump talk.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 05:40 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by Sabrina View Post
You guys seem to not be aware that the ONLY thing Miss Evancho is singing at the inauguration is the national anthem. That's it. She's not performing any of her own music or providing anything other than a short appearance.
what an odd comment... I don't believe anyone has suggested that she is doing anything other than singing the National Anthem, which is indeed the most prestigious spot of all on that day
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Old 2nd January 2017, 05:44 PM   #387
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If she punks Trump and starts belting out the Russian anthem, I will buy all of her albums. And future ones as well.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 06:31 PM   #388
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
If she punks Trump and starts belting out the Russian anthem, I will buy all of her albums. And future ones as well.
Funny that you should mention this, as it appears that the Inauguration Committee has just asked former "X-Factor" contestant Rebecca Ferguson to perform at the event. She said that she would agree to this on one condition:

Quote:
"... she would only appear if she could perform Strange Fruit, the song popularized by Billie Holiday in 1939 about black lynchings."
Somehow, I think she may have disqualified herself from the running...
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Old 2nd January 2017, 06:40 PM   #389
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Originally Posted by carlvs View Post
Funny that you should mention this, as it appears that the Inauguration Committee has just asked former "X-Factor" contestant Rebecca Ferguson to perform at the event. She said that she would agree to this on one condition:

Somehow, I think she may have disqualified herself from the running...
Yes indeed, the inauguration is absolutely no time to bring up the shameful history of the Solid Demcrat South during the height of the lynchings.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 08:36 PM   #390
marplots
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Yes indeed, the inauguration is absolutely no time to bring up the shameful history of the Solid Demcrat South during the height of the lynchings.
Sounds like it would fit right in for the "KKK tribute" portion of the inauguration ceremony.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 08:51 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I wasn't aware of that, but it's a pity, as I would much rather listen to Jackie sing than Trump talk.
I'd rather listen to Gilbert Gottfried sing than Trump talk.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 09:17 PM   #392
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
If she punks Trump and starts belting out the Russian anthem, I will buy all of her albums. And future ones as well.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 10:47 PM   #393
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Considering how near to evenly divided the country was in its support for Trump it seems like they ought to be just about as worried about retaliation for refusing to appear with him. Conservative backlash is probably more vituperative than liberals'.

(Remember what happened to the Dixie Chicks, just for saying they thought Bush was an embarrassment to Texas for his prosecution of the Iraq war.)
It may be true that Conservative backlash would be more significant than Liberal backlash.

But in this case, there is a significant difference... there are multiple ways that an artist can claim plausible deniability if they don't perform for Trump... anything from "I wasn't invited", to "I'm on tour or working on my new album and can't spare the time". Or just say "I'll consider it" and just never bring it up again. Anything like that would probably prevent any sort of significant backlash against a performer.

In other words, there is a difference in doing something that criticizes a politician (i.e. the Dixie Chicks criticizing Bush) and NOT doing something that benefits him. As long as they don't say "I didn't play for Trump because I think he's got the intelligence and look of as Orangutan" they should be safe.
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Old 2nd January 2017, 10:51 PM   #394
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
If she punks Trump and starts belting out the Russian anthem, I will buy all of her albums. And future ones as well.
I wonder if any performers had seriously thought of offering to perform, and then doing some sort of protest during the festivities... perhaps wear a T-shirt with a picture of Trump and Putin making out, or wear a jacket with the Trump University logo on it.

But then with all the 2nd amendment lunatics supporting Trump, they might be putting themselves at risk.
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Old 3rd January 2017, 07:37 AM   #395
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
It would be proof of poltergeists if Kid Rock's albums fly off any shelves in 2017.

Why, yes, yes it would indeed!!!
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Old 3rd January 2017, 07:41 AM   #396
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I wonder if any performers had seriously thought of offering to perform, and then doing some sort of protest during the festivities... perhaps wear a T-shirt with a picture of Trump and Putin making out, or wear a jacket with the Trump University logo on it.

But then with all the 2nd amendment lunatics supporting Trump, they might be putting themselves at risk.
As penciled by the (unfortunately dead) Tom of Finland!!!! Whose work, I have reason to suspect, Putin loves.
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Old 3rd January 2017, 07:53 AM   #397
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
But if physical albums do exist somewhere, would anybody make them for Kid Rock? And if so, would anybody stock them? I asked Siri where I could get a Kid Rock album and she asked if I wanted to search Amazon for time machines.
Siri lied to you: https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_s...=3UU91YDODC3ZA

So you know she cares!!!!~
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Old 3rd January 2017, 08:31 AM   #398
marplots
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I wonder if any performers had seriously thought of offering to perform, and then doing some sort of protest during the festivities... perhaps wear a T-shirt with a picture of Trump and Putin making out, or wear a jacket with the Trump University logo on it.

But then with all the 2nd amendment lunatics supporting Trump, they might be putting themselves at risk.
Sounds like a job for Pussy Riot.
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Old 3rd January 2017, 09:24 AM   #399
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Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
If she punks Trump and starts belting out the Russian anthem, I will buy all of her albums. And future ones as well.
Agreed - and I already have two anyway (CDs though) as one of the people who worked with her had been a student of my wife in video production (which, of course included audio mixing/production)twenty some odd years ago......
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Old 3rd January 2017, 09:58 AM   #400
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I hear that Mariah Carey is available...
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