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Tags New Zealand elections , New Zealand politics

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Old 21st August 2017, 02:42 PM   #121
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I see National is panicking and dipping onto the lolly jar to go after Labour's base with $18 Doctor visits for Community Card holders.
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Old 21st August 2017, 10:06 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
I see National is panicking and dipping onto the lolly jar to go after Labour's base with $18 Doctor visits for Community Card holders.
I don't think the low waged are Labour's base anymore given their recent ideas

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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 23rd August 2017, 04:10 AM   #123
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The Greens are now suddenly breaking their deal with Labour and are standing in Ohariu.

Lol

Bye bye O'Connor

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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 23rd August 2017, 04:41 AM   #124
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Well so far, I'm afraid that Labour's primary policy platform appears to be simplicity itself... just tax the living daylights out of everyone that forms the backbone of the country and the economy.

► Tax on water
► Tax on personal and business assets
► Tax on the value of any land you own
► Capital Gains Tax

What price them re-introducing death duties.

Time to start moving the remainder of my investments overseas I think.
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Last edited by smartcooky; 23rd August 2017 at 05:34 AM.
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Old 23rd August 2017, 01:07 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The Greens are now suddenly breaking their deal with Labour and are standing in Ohariu.

Lol

Bye bye O'Connor

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Be serious, mate. The Greenmunists couldn't stop Labour winning Ohariu if Rod Donald rose from the dead and stood for the electorate.
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Old 23rd August 2017, 01:09 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
I see National is panicking ...
No doubt about that.
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Old 23rd August 2017, 05:05 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Well so far, I'm afraid that Labour's primary policy platform appears to be simplicity itself... just tax the living daylights out of everyone that forms the backbone of the country and the economy.

► Tax on water
► Tax on personal and business assets
► Tax on the value of any land you own
► Capital Gains Tax

What price them re-introducing death duties.

Time to start moving the remainder of my investments overseas I think.
Plus

►Tax on carbon emmissions
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 23rd August 2017, 05:07 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Be serious, mate. The Greenmunists couldn't stop Labour winning Ohariu if Rod Donald rose from the dead and stood for the electorate.
Lol

Can I borrow and use that?
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 23rd August 2017, 05:13 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Plus

►Tax on carbon emmissions


Yup, their election motto should be "Lets Tax This"
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Old 25th August 2017, 08:31 PM   #130
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Meanwhile, on the election trail:

Jacinda drawing crowds.

National drawing criticism.
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Old 28th August 2017, 12:13 AM   #131
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Oh

► Tax the tourists now
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Old 29th August 2017, 01:44 PM   #132
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OK, I think I have found an issue I can hang my hat on.

There is so much I like and dislike in the policies of both main parties, that its hard to know who to vote for. However, I am somewhat incensed by Amy Adams' appalling attitude of sticking her middle finger up to the Supreme Court with regards to Teina Pora.

If any of the major parties comes out with a Policy statement to the effect that they are going to depoliticize the claims process surrounding wrongful convictions, and make the Supreme Court the sole-arbiter of same, they will get my vote.
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Old 29th August 2017, 02:14 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
OK, I think I have found an issue I can hang my hat on.

There is so much I like and dislike in the policies of both main parties, that its hard to know who to vote for. However, I am somewhat incensed by Amy Adams' appalling attitude of sticking her middle finger up to the Supreme Court with regards to Teina Pora.

If any of the major parties comes out with a Policy statement to the effect that they are going to depoliticize the claims process surrounding wrongful convictions, and make the Supreme Court the sole-arbiter of same, they will get my vote.
Are you referring to the refusal to add inflation at the time?

If so, there is a massive amount of historical revisionism going on, as to what actually happened
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 29th August 2017, 04:07 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Are you referring to the refusal to add inflation at the time?

If so, there is a massive amount of historical revisionism going on, as to what actually happened
No there isn't. This really belongs in Trials and Errors, but Pora unjustly spent more than 20 years locked up for something he didn't do thanks to crooked cops who took a lot of shortcuts instead of doing a proper job of investigating the crime. They didn't have look much further to find Malcolm Rewa

Politicians ALWAYS drag their feet when it comes to compensation for wrongful convictions. They should not be anywhere near that kind of decision making. The question of compensation should be entirely down to the courts. Any party who announces this as a policy gets my vote this year.
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Old 29th August 2017, 05:46 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
No there isn't. This really belongs in Trials and Errors, but Pora unjustly spent more than 20 years locked up for something he didn't do thanks to crooked cops who took a lot of shortcuts instead of doing a proper job of investigating the crime. They didn't have look much further to find Malcolm Rewa

Politicians ALWAYS drag their feet when it comes to compensation for wrongful convictions. They should not be anywhere near that kind of decision making. The question of compensation should be entirely down to the courts. Any party who announces this as a policy gets my vote this year.
The government left it open for him to seek inflation, while still giving him the payout. It was basically just getting the courts to decide on a proper amount for precedent and not the govt guessing

They could have just said full and final

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...ion--amy-adams

Even Pora's team aknowledged this

Quote:
In a statement on Friday, Adams confirmed the Government would allow Pora to "immediately" receive the $2.5m, "while still reserving his right to challenge the decision not to apply inflation to non-pecuniary losses".


'FAIR AND REASONABLE APPROACH'

Ingrid Squire, a member of Pora's legal team, said they were "really pleased" with Adams' decision.

"From our position, it was a fair and reasonable approach, and we're delighted that the minister saw that as well."
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 29th August 2017, 06:03 PM   #136
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
The government left it open for him to seek inflation, while still giving him the payout. It was basically just getting the courts to decide on a proper amount for precedent and not the govt guessing

They could have just said full and final

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...ion--amy-adams

Even Pora's team aknowledged this
All possibly true - all totally irrelevant

I want the courts to deal with crime & punishment, and the consequences of crimes, NOT the government. I wish to see these aspects depoliticized... let the government get on with the job of running the country.
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Old 29th August 2017, 08:17 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
All possibly true - all totally irrelevant

I want the courts to deal with crime & punishment, and the consequences of crimes, NOT the government. I wish to see these aspects depoliticized... let the government get on with the job of running the country.
Fair point

Tend to agree actually
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 30th August 2017, 11:03 PM   #138
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Labour 43%
National 41%

Not definitive by any means, but the mood for change appears strong enough to depose Billy boy.

Debate to follow later tonight. I expect Jacinda to eat him up and spit him out. (not that I'll be watching - I have some paint drying I need to watch instead)
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Old 31st August 2017, 04:10 AM   #139
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Labour 43%
National 41%

Not definitive by any means, but the mood for change appears strong enough to depose Billy boy.

Debate to follow later tonight. I expect Jacinda to eat him up and spit him out. (not that I'll be watching - I have some paint drying I need to watch instead)
She handing him his arse on a silver platter!!
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Old 31st August 2017, 05:03 AM   #140
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??

I thought she was just empty and devoid of any substance.

Mind you. He was boring.

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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 31st August 2017, 06:34 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
??

I thought she was just empty and devoid of any substance.
Mate, you'd say that no matter what she said.

Consensus seems to be the real winner of it was Mike Hosking.

Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Mind you. He was boring.
Well, there's a surprise.

I'd love to know how Johnny Key feels about all this - looks like he got his timing completely wrong. He would have thought, "No way straight-up Bill can lose from here: no competition... game over."

Nup.
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Old 1st September 2017, 02:49 AM   #142
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I'm still disappointed that Jacinda appears to be all talk, rhetoiric and platitudes, but no numbers and no details. I want details.
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Old 1st September 2017, 11:50 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Mate, you'd say that no matter what she said.

Consensus seems to be the real winner of it was Mike Hosking.



Well, there's a surprise.

I'd love to know how Johnny Key feels about all this - looks like he got his timing completely wrong. He would have thought, "No way straight-up Bill can lose from here: no competition... game over."

Nup.
You have no idea what I would say if she actually gave some details, but I sense you won't get the chance to find out.

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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 2nd September 2017, 02:17 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
I'm still disappointed that Jacinda appears to be all talk, rhetoiric and platitudes, but no numbers and no details. I want details.
How surprising is that? She's been in the job for a whole month.

In any case, since when have any promises & details offered prior to an election actually resulted in change in the real world?

You seem to be operating under the misapprehension that politics involves telling the truth.
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Old 2nd September 2017, 02:31 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
How surprising is that? She's been in the job for a whole month.
So, she wasn't privy to the details when she was deputy? Really?

Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
In any case, since when have any promises & details offered prior to an election actually resulted in change in the real world?

You seem to be operating under the misapprehension that politics involves telling the truth.
Well, they should at least make the effort
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Old 2nd September 2017, 08:00 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
So, she wasn't privy to the details when she was deputy? Really?
Not so much a case of not being privy to it, she might want to make some changes, and from what she's said, that appears to be the case.

Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Well, they should at least make the effort
Well, National's made their position clear on justice - human rights no longer count.

Quote:
Let me guess - the pigs will decide what constitutes a "serious criminal" gang and member, just like they decide who should come under the umbrella of searching bank records because terrorism and/or fraud.

Lucky cops in NZ are so trustworthy - never frame anyone, never abuse their powers, never commit sexual assault or harassment...
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Old 3rd September 2017, 12:18 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Not so much a case of not being privy to it, she might want to make some changes, and from what she's said, that appears to be the case.
If she knows what changes she wants to make why can't she say them?
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 3rd September 2017, 12:45 AM   #148
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Not so much a case of not being privy to it, she might want to make some changes, and from what she's said, that appears to be the case.



Well, National's made their position clear on justice - human rights no longer count.



Let me guess - the pigs will decide what constitutes a "serious criminal" gang and member, just like they decide who should come under the umbrella of searching bank records because terrorism and/or fraud.

Lucky cops in NZ are so trustworthy - never frame anyone, never abuse their powers, never commit sexual assault or harassment...

Holy heck, I thought Britain was going down a dangerous path of limiting citizens protection but least the PM isn't publicly saying that the government can choose what rights citizens have or don't have at their own convenience:

Quote:
Asked if the Government would be able to create a law like this in a country with a written constitution, the Prime Minister refused to address a "hypothetical," but did note that "it's good that we don't have a written constitution it's enabled the country to deal with all sorts of issues in a practical effective way."
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Old 3rd September 2017, 12:52 AM   #149
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
If she knows what changes she wants to make why can't she say them?
Knowing a change doesn't mean that you have had the time to work out the details. For instance, were I a party leader my party would be pushing for a Financial Transaction Tax on all Bank monetary transfers, however what I couldn't tell you beyond a basic estimate without Treasury and the banks doing some work on it, is how much that would bring in and as a result how much it would allow me to drop other Taxes such as GST, PAYE, and Company. What I could say is that I wanted to bring in the FTT and drop GST and PAYE and give an estimate on what they might achieve.
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Old 3rd September 2017, 01:04 AM   #150
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Knowing a change doesn't mean that you have had the time to work out the details. For instance, were I a party leader my party would be pushing for a Financial Transaction Tax on all Bank monetary transfers, however what I couldn't tell you beyond a basic estimate without Treasury and the banks doing some work on it, is how much that would bring in and as a result how much it would allow me to drop other Taxes such as GST, PAYE, and Company. What I could say is that I wanted to bring in the FTT and drop GST and PAYE and give an estimate on what they might achieve.
Aha, you are indeed a rare beast in this day and age PW; a student of the Bruce Beetham theory of economics.

Its a good idea (I always liked Social Credit as an alternative to the two traditional centrist parties). However, I think you would need to put a lower limit on the size of transactions attracting FTT; you wouldn't want to go chasing small Mom & Pop transactions as they transfer money from their savings to their cheque accounts to pay bills, or collection might end up costing more than the tax you collect!
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Old 3rd September 2017, 01:10 AM   #151
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Aha, you are indeed a rare beast in this day and age PW; a student of the Bruce Beetham theory of economics.

Its a good idea (I always liked Social Credit as an alternative to the two traditional centrist parties). However, I think you would need to put a lower limit on the size of transactions attracting FTT; you wouldn't want to go chasing small Mom & Pop transactions as they transfer money from their savings to their cheque accounts to pay bills, or collection might end up costing more than the tax you collect!
No, it's all done electronically these days, simply divert maybe 1c for tax for each $100 the bank transfers between accounts and it's done. Unless you are transferring hundreds of dollars you wouldn't notice, but it would catch a lot of the transfers that aren't being taxed now, like buying and selling currency and micro-trading. It'd also catch companies moving money out of the country and solve any issue with the whole buying overseas pays no GST thing.
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Old 3rd September 2017, 04:34 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
Knowing a change doesn't mean that you have had the time to work out the details. For instance, were I a party leader my party would be pushing for a Financial Transaction Tax on all Bank monetary transfers, however what I couldn't tell you beyond a basic estimate without Treasury and the banks doing some work on it, is how much that would bring in and as a result how much it would allow me to drop other Taxes such as GST, PAYE, and Company. What I could say is that I wanted to bring in the FTT and drop GST and PAYE and give an estimate on what they might achieve.
She isn't dropping any taxes

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Old 3rd September 2017, 03:14 PM   #153
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
She isn't dropping any taxes
If you want to participate in a conversation, at least say something mildly relevant to the point at hand.
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Old 3rd September 2017, 03:57 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
If you want to participate in a conversation, at least say something mildly relevant to the point at hand.
Apologies. Your whole post seemed to be based on the assumption the hazey, detailless taxes will be balanced with tax cuts elsewhere

She said there aren't any

If you are just going by her wanting changes to the taxes she has been promoting since Little became leader, why can't she just say a general idea of the changes she want's to make?

This is ignoring the fact there has been about 2 or 3 tax working groups in the last few years and they have all said a CGT for everything. Including the family home, she has promised to not tax.
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Old 3rd September 2017, 08:47 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by Carnivore View Post
Holy heck, I thought Britain was going down a dangerous path of limiting citizens protection but least the PM isn't publicly saying that the government can choose what rights citizens have or don't have at their own convenience:
Human rights are only for National Party voters. Even Muldoon didn't go this far, though.
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Old 12th September 2017, 05:45 PM   #156
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Thought this was quite funny

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
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Last edited by cullennz; 12th September 2017 at 05:48 PM.
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Old 12th September 2017, 06:34 PM   #157
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Capital Gains Tax is just legalized inheritance theft by another name.

What disturbs me most about Labour in regards to this proposed tax is the way they studiously avoid ruling out CGT on the family home. They say stuff like "we have no plans to include the family home" and "the family home is not in our thinking" but we all know that these are just political weasel-worded gobbledegook for keeping their options open. Jacinda and her running mate refuse to be pinned down to an absolute answer to this question wheh asked directly, and when that happens, I become very suspicious of their motives!
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Old 12th September 2017, 10:42 PM   #158
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Thought this was quite funny

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
I guess your choice is between "tax and spend" or "borrow and spend". They will never cut spending.*

* I assume that your pollies are unique and don't promise to simultaneously cut taxes, increase spending and reduce government debt.
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Old 12th September 2017, 11:20 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
* I assume that your pollies are unique and don't promise to simultaneously cut taxes, increase spending and reduce government debt.
Funnily enough, that's just about exactly what National is promising.
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Old 13th September 2017, 04:49 PM   #160
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Ardern does a complete flip flop on all Labours taxes 9 days before the election

Quote:
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/electi...irst-term.html

Labour won't implement any tax changes until after the 2020 election, finance spokesman Grant Robertson has announced.

"To avoid any doubt, no one will be affected by any tax changes arising from the outcomes of the Working Group until 2021," Mr Robertson said at Parliament on Thursday morning

"There will be no new taxes or levies introduced in our first term of Government beyond those we have already announced."

The party has faced weeks of attacks from National regarding its tax plans.

"We have heard the call for New Zealanders' voices to be heard. We will involve the public at every stage of the working group, as well as Cabinet and Parliament's consideration of any changes that arise from it," said Mr Robertson.

"We know it is important to get this right, so we will balance the need for certainty and urgency by ensuring that any potential changes will not come into effect until the 2021 tax year. This gives multiple opportunities for public input, and a general election before any new tax would come into effect."

The move also comes after the latest Newshub-Reid Research poll showed Labour falling and the Greens below the 5 percent threshold.

Among the taxes Mr Robertson has ruled out changing are GST, corporate rates and income tax.

"What we will do is reverse National's proposed tax cuts and use the billions of dollars to make 70 percent of families with children better off and invest more in health, education, housing and other public services.

"Our policy also cracks down on those who are exploiting weaknesses in the tax system by speculating in the housing market. Labour will end the practice of negative gearing, and extend the current bright line test that taxes the capital gain on the sale of a property other than the family home to five years."

National has also promised no new taxes in the next three years, instead offering an income tax cut.

Labour leader Jacinda Ardern had previously promised to implement changes before the 2020 election.
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