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Tags donald trump , Trump administration , Trump controversies

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Old 20th October 2017, 12:20 AM   #2001
Bob001
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Trump learned from the master:
Quote:
It should be mentioned that Vanity Fair reported in 1990 that Trump’s first wife, Ivana, “told her lawyer Michael Kennedy that from time to time her husband reads a book of Hitler’s collected speeches, ‘My New Order,’ which he keeps in a cabinet by his bed.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/19/o...the-lying.html
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Old 20th October 2017, 01:36 AM   #2002
The Great Zaganza
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Good to know that he can read, at least.
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Old 20th October 2017, 04:02 AM   #2003
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BBC: 'Obama and Bush decry deep US divisions without naming Trump'

Quote:
Former Presidents Barack Obama and George W Bush have voiced concern about the current political climate in the US, in comments seen as a veiled rebuke of Donald Trump's leadership.
Link
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Old 20th October 2017, 04:08 AM   #2004
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
BBC: 'Obama and Bush decry deep US divisions without naming Trump'



Link
The trouble is that GOP supporters will look at their veiled criticism and agree that yes, the Democrats are indeed divisive
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Old 20th October 2017, 04:14 AM   #2005
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
BBC: 'Obama and Bush decry deep US divisions without naming Trump'



Link
Is Trump the cause, or a symptom?
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Old 20th October 2017, 04:19 AM   #2006
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So it looks like US put Chad on the travel ban. Chad pulled troops from fight in Niger. U.S. now has casualties due to ignorance of its leader.
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Old 20th October 2017, 04:19 AM   #2007
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
CINO.

You were a conservative. The ideology has moved well to the right from you.

Failing to check any one of the appropriate boxes removes you from the class.

I suspect you likely fail on other critical touchpoints as well.

How do you feel about teaching evolution in school science classes ... without offering ""alternatives" as equally valid?

Same-sex marriage?
I am a fiscal conservative. On social (and even fiscal) matters I go with evidence-based.
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Old 20th October 2017, 05:38 AM   #2008
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
BBC: 'Obama and Bush decry deep US divisions without naming Trump'



Link
After fundraising for race baiting Ed Gillespie Bush the Lesser said this? Someone just wanted to able to come out in public without getting raked over the coals for his abysmal Presidency.
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Old 20th October 2017, 05:53 AM   #2009
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Originally Posted by Minoosh View Post
Whoa there - are you being breedist?
Nope - it is just superior descriptivity that draws the eye and the mind to more heavy concentration on the thought expressed. I.e. it is selective advertising!!!!
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Old 20th October 2017, 05:55 AM   #2010
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Is Trump the cause, or a symptom?
Trump is the primary infection agent.
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Old 20th October 2017, 05:59 AM   #2011
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More President Trump twitter nonsense:

Originally Posted by 45
Just out report: "United Kingdom crime rises 13% annually amid spread of Radical Islamic terror." Not good, we must keep America safe!
tbh Mr President, I don't think ISIS is responsible for breaking and entering and drunk and disorderly
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:02 AM   #2012
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
More President Trump twitter nonsense:



tbh Mr President, I don't think ISIS is responsible for breaking and entering and drunk and disorderly
The special relationship has taken a number of blows from his incompetence and lying.

Quote:
Donald Trump was today accused of peddling 'fake news' and stirring up hate after he*wrongly linked the rise in crime in England and Wales to 'Radical Islamic terror'.

The US president sent a tweet referring to figures out yesterday showing crime increased by 13 per cent last year and warning*'We must keep American safe'.*

But British MPs tore into Mr Trump for talking 'nonsense' and said he is 'spreading fear and xenophobia' by wrongly blaming the rise on terrorism.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:05 AM   #2013
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This may be a minor point, but he makes the classic mistake. Probably just repeating what many people have reported it as, but still, it pays to check these things.

Trump et al.: UK crime up 13%

Actual report: 13% increase in police-recorded offences across England and Wales

Last time I checked, Police Scotland recorded crime rates were down about 3%.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:09 AM   #2014
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
After fundraising for race baiting Ed Gillespie Bush the Lesser said this? Someone just wanted to able to come out in public without getting raked over the coals for his abysmal Presidency.
Can no one ever just say, “credit where credit is due”?

Listen to Bush’s speech and try to visualize your reaction to his words were they spoken by anyone else.

This is where extreme partisanship rears it’s ugly head - if Bush doesn’t speak up he’d be criticized for that. If he does speak up, virtually no credit regardless of what he says.

I still say credit where credit is due.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:12 AM   #2015
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Can no one ever just say, “credit where credit is due”?

Listen to Bush’s speech and try to visualize your reaction to his words were they spoken by anyone else.

This is where extreme partisanship rears it’s ugly head - if Bush doesn’t speak up he’d be criticized for that. If he does speak up, virtually no credit regardless of what he says.

I still say credit where credit is due.
Very true.
On the other hand, would the extreme partisanship we face today even exist without Bush's unnecessary wars and unbridled deregulation policies?

He usually sounded reasonable.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:19 AM   #2016
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Can no one ever just say, “credit where credit is due”?

Listen to Bush’s speech and try to visualize your reaction to his words were they spoken by anyone else.

This is where extreme partisanship rears it’s ugly head - if Bush doesn’t speak up he’d be criticized for that. If he does speak up, virtually no credit regardless of what he says.

I still say credit where credit is due.
It was hypocrisy. He's literally decrying Trump's divisive race baiting while helping a divisive race baiter. Bush the lesser said the right things but he clearly doesn't believe it based on his actions. Empty platitudes from hypocrites get exactly the credit they deserve.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:27 AM   #2017
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
This may be a minor point, but he makes the classic mistake. Probably just repeating what many people have reported it as, but still, it pays to check these things.

Trump et al.: UK crime up 13%

Actual report: 13% increase in police-recorded offences across England and Wales

Last time I checked, Police Scotland recorded crime rates were down about 3%.
There is also the effect that public awareness campaigns elevate both the number of reports and the number of recorded crimes.

I can put a concrete example of such things. Some while ago, a housemate (may he burn in hell) ripped my CC to the tune of slightly over 3K. Now, I don't usually have much interaction with the law (only as a witness/victim before you ask) but this was different/new. I was sent a very nice letter giving me an incident number and the investigating cop's name and number. Never happened before. What is interesting is that this recently returned to the news as said former housemate rented out said former house to three Nigerian Blokes. This only came to light when the actual owner went to sell the property.

The point is that I had to hand all of the references to the actual data to hand so that the two cases could be tied together, and as it turns out, the guy has a bucket of similar pending investigations. This kind of campaign for transparency easily spikes the figures. There are plenty more such examples. E.g. The Christmas drink driving campaigns are soon to be upon us. This will result in a spike in recorded crime (yes, it is a crime).

Incidentally, on the back of the letter was a swathe of suggested support agencies, because being a victim of crime can and does have serious effects on the victim. Not required, in my case. I would have preferred a list of assassins. Or possibly torturers.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:30 AM   #2018
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Is Trump the cause, or a symptom?
Both.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:34 AM   #2019
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Originally Posted by Spindrift View Post
It was more than 140 characters.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:38 AM   #2020
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Originally Posted by Pterodactyl View Post
Very true.
On the other hand, would the extreme partisanship we face today even exist without Bush's unnecessary wars and unbridled deregulation policies?

He usually sounded reasonable.
Yes.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:45 AM   #2021
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Because they have no more personality than any other garbage being thrown out onto the trash heap of history.
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Old 20th October 2017, 06:47 AM   #2022
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
I am a fiscal conservative. On social (and even fiscal) matters I go with evidence-based.

Yeah. Like I said.

That one phrase alone would disqualify you for admittance to today's conservatives.

And don't even think about trying to run for office on a GOP ticket.
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:08 AM   #2023
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
This may be a minor point, but he makes the classic mistake. Probably just repeating what many people have reported it as, but still, it pays to check these things.

Trump et al.: UK crime up 13%

Actual report: 13% increase in police-recorded offences across England and Wales

Last time I checked, Police Scotland recorded crime rates were down about 3%.
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:10 AM   #2024
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:27 AM   #2025
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
It was hypocrisy. He's literally decrying Trump's divisive race baiting while helping a divisive race baiter. Bush the lesser said the right things but he clearly doesn't believe it based on his actions. Empty platitudes from hypocrites get exactly the credit they deserve.
From that, can I take it that there’s literally nothing he could ever say that you would give him credit for?
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:38 AM   #2026
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
More President Trump twitter nonsense:


tbh Mr President, I don't think ISIS is responsible for breaking and entering and drunk and disorderly
Yes it is!

Because people getting sick and tired of ISIS, so they get drunk and have nothing else left to do but braking and entering and spreading chaos.

See, it's so easy to spin.
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:53 AM   #2027
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Can no one ever just say, “credit where credit is due”?

Listen to Bush’s speech and try to visualize your reaction to his words were they spoken by anyone else.

This is where extreme partisanship rears it’s ugly head - if Bush doesn’t speak up he’d be criticized for that. If he does speak up, virtually no credit regardless of what he says.

I still say credit where credit is due.
I can and will. Kudos to George W. At this juncture, every little bit helps, and it soothes me to think the Bushes may -- may -- see their part in this sad history. But I'll take the speech; boy, will I.
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Old 20th October 2017, 07:56 AM   #2028
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
BBC: 'Obama and Bush decry deep US divisions without naming Trump'



Link
Mildly interesting to see Bush criticize Trump in this way. I don't really have a sense of how much influence Bush has with Republican voters these days when compared to Trump. I perceive Trump's vision as the dominant one within the party right now. We know he holds grudges and I wonder how that will manifest here.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:20 AM   #2029
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Originally Posted by Hlafordlaes View Post
I can and will. Kudos to George W. At this juncture, every little bit helps, and it soothes me to think the Bushes may -- may -- see their part in this sad history. But I'll take the speech; boy, will I.
Ditto
Originally Posted by Civet View Post
Mildly interesting to see Bush criticize Trump in this way. I don't really have a sense of how much influence Bush has with Republican voters these days when compared to Trump. I perceive Trump's vision as the dominant one within the party right now. We know he holds grudges and I wonder how that will manifest here.
Bush has been critical of Trump since his nomination.

He was a bad president, but still within the normal bounds. Trump is way outside these.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:25 AM   #2030
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
I'm a conservative. I accept that AGW exists, and is a threat to the Earth. Part of why I oppose Trump.
I believe the technical term for you in modern conservative circles would be "#Beta #Cuck #RINO."

Welcome to the modern Democratic party. Don't worry, it's only slightly to the left of Reagan's GOP, and even then largely on social issues.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:31 AM   #2031
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
Is Trump the cause, or a symptom?
Symptom IMO. The scary part is the underlying problem is capable of creating worse things than Trump.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:36 AM   #2032
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Symptom IMO. The scary part is the underlying problem is capable of creating worse things than Trump.
Good point. It looks like Trump is shaping up to be the Dietrich Eckart of whatever comes next. Comparing Trump to Hither is paying him a compliment that his place in history will not reflect.

It's ironic really, that he's setting in motion events that are likely to result in the death or exile of one of his kids and her husband. I wonder if he'll live long enough to see it. He is getting up there in years.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:38 AM   #2033
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Quote:
Can no one ever just say, “credit where credit is due”?

Listen to Bush’s speech and try to visualize your reaction to his words were they spoken by anyone else.
It was hypocrisy. He's literally decrying Trump's divisive race baiting while helping a divisive race baiter. Bush the lesser said the right things but he clearly doesn't believe it based on his actions. Empty platitudes from hypocrites get exactly the credit they deserve.
I'm not trying to say Bush was a good president (there are many things to criticize him on... economics, foreign policy, etc.)

But, I'm trying to think of anything specifically he might have done personally that would have contributed to any sort of racial conflict. Not saying that it didn't happen, just that I can't think of anything he did. (And I can think of a few positive things he did during his presidency... visiting a mosque shortly after 9/11, supporting a bill that would help give citizenship to illegal immigrants, etc.)

There were republicans who were using racially-based techniques (gerrymandering, etc.), but that was at the lower level.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:39 AM   #2034
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Comparing Trump to Hither is paying him a compliment that his place in history will not reflect.

I think it was someone here who commented that Hitler had consistent policies and beliefs, while Trump mirrors the attitudes of whoever he spoke to most recently.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:46 AM   #2035
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Symptom IMO. The scary part is the underlying problem is capable of creating worse things than Trump.
Damn right. Trumps one saving grace is that he is so damn incometent that he is having little success in implementing his agenda. A competent right wing demagogue could have done a lot more damage.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:50 AM   #2036
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
It was hypocrisy. He's literally decrying Trump's divisive race baiting while helping a divisive race baiter. Bush the lesser said the right things but he clearly doesn't believe it based on his actions. Empty platitudes from hypocrites get exactly the credit they deserve.
Hypocrisy would require he recognises the similarities, but IMO he probably does not. Bush has always been well meaning but simplistic. He tends to want to address the symptom not the problem. I don’t find it at all unusual that he would want to address the symptoms of Trumps racist diversionist rhetoric while not recognising that it’s fundamentally the same thing someone else he supports is doing.
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Old 20th October 2017, 08:52 AM   #2037
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Hypocrisy would require he recognises the similarities, but IMO he probably does not. Bush has always been well meaning but simplistic. He tends to want to address the symptom not the problem. I don’t find it at all unusual that he would want to address the symptoms of Trumps racist diversionist rhetoric while not recognising that it’s fundamentally the same thing someone else he supports is doing.
He won't recognize the similarities because he will focus on the difference. And it's true, he's not as racist as Trump. However, that is a matter of degree, not of kind. That Trump is way overboard does not make a less blatant racist any more acceptable.
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Old 20th October 2017, 09:00 AM   #2038
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
He won't recognize the similarities because he will focus on the difference. And it's true, he's not as racist as Trump. However, that is a matter of degree, not of kind. That Trump is way overboard does not make a less blatant racist any more acceptable.
Not even if given the choice only between the two?
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Old 20th October 2017, 09:07 AM   #2039
Skeptic Ginger
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Their hypocrisy knows no bounds. Trump talked lied about his inauguration crowd in front of the CIA memorial wall.

If anyone disrespects women it's Trump.

Kelly said Wilson shouldn't have listened to the call. Either he knew and lied or didn't know the reason Wilson heard the call was because she was in the car with Johnson on the way to receive the body.

Kelly never addressed Wilson's biggest complaint, Trump didn't appear to know either the Sgt's or his wife's name and referred to the fallen soldier as "your guy".

And Kelly never addressed Trump's lie about what was said in the call, which apparently Trump doubled down on in a Tweet since the press conference.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 20th October 2017 at 09:09 AM.
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Old 20th October 2017, 09:15 AM   #2040
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Adding to my previous reply:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Yeah well, maybe you might consider how it sounded to women. Not to mention Kelly called Trump "brave". ...
Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
I took it more as emphasizing the current disrespect shown by the likes of Harvey Weinstein - and curiously his own boss.
"Curiously"? As in curious Kelly doesn't seem bothered by Trump's behavior?

And you do know the difference between then and now is not that women weren't sexually harassed and abused, it's that they didn't talk about it, weren't believed or no one cared to stop the abusers, right?

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 20th October 2017 at 09:19 AM.
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