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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:53 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
This is quite relevant. Few religions, who follow such nature's rules can behave like what you mentioned above. No social binding.

Nope, still nonsense. Everyone has to follow "nature's rules". You cannot opt out of them.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:01 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
May one follow gross nature's rules other basic or may One believe in rationals being comparatively gross, other truth being basic.
I'm sorry, what?
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:33 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
Kumaritis is an infectious disease.
It's loopus.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:52 AM   #84
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thanks for the heads up - I'm getting now while I can still put two thoughts together . . . assuming dolphins are natural.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:52 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Nope, still nonsense. Everyone has to follow "nature's rules". You cannot opt out of them.
Yes therefore such entity follow these may not follow social rules or civility.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:54 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
Kumaritis is an infectious disease.
Category error.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 09:58 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Yes therefore such entity follow these may not follow social rules or civility.
I'm pretty sure that, say, sea slugs, would follow their own genetically-determined "rules", and that these wouldn't include civility. Have you ever seen a wild animal, Kumar?
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:01 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
I'm sorry, what?
Variation can be there ín attitude and practices among followers of different religions which were introduced in different time and in different environment.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:05 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
I'm pretty sure that, say, sea slugs, would follow their own genetically-determined "rules", and that these wouldn't include civility. Have you ever seen a wild animal, Kumar?
They only follow nature's basic rules. We are bit different. Social rules and civility may only belong to humans.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:08 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
They only follow nature's basic rules. We are bit different. Social rules and civility may only belong to humans.
Yeah, different things. Apples and pears.

We follow natures rules, as does everything in the universe, but we add layers of our own rules on top.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:22 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Variation can be there ín attitude and practices among followers of different religions which were introduced in different time and in different environment.
What does that have to do with what I said?
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:23 AM   #92
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Comparing Islam with Christianity . The teachings of Jesus are inspiring and merciful, but the rantings of Muhammad are full of cruelty and warmongering.
Here are some quotes from Muhammad in the Quran. As can be seen they are full of violence and fighting.

5.33. The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;

8.12 Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am withyou: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

9.5 But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans
wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in
every stratagem (of war);

33.61 They shall have a curse on them: whenever they are found, they shall be
seized and slain (without mercy).

47.4 Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them):

Contrast the above with the teachings of Jesus, below.

Matthew chapter 5

38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
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Old 23rd October 2017, 10:27 AM   #93
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I have read some of the Upanishads and I find them very spiritual and inspired. I also believe in the Hindu concept of reincarnation and karma, but spiritualism teaches we do not come back as animals. Nor do I believe in the many Gods of the Hindus.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 02:30 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Comparing Islam with Christianity . The teachings of Jesus are inspiring and merciful, but the rantings of Muhammad are full of cruelty and warmongering.
Here are some quotes from Muhammad in the Quran. As can be seen they are full of violence and fighting.

5.33. The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;

8.12 Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am withyou: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."

9.5 But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans
wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in
every stratagem (of war);

33.61 They shall have a curse on them: whenever they are found, they shall be
seized and slain (without mercy).

47.4 Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them):

Contrast the above with the teachings of Jesus, below.

Matthew chapter 5

38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

Oh yes and as in Luke 14:26

Quote:
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brothers, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
Glad I could help with that.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 05:56 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Yeah, different things. Apples and pears.

We follow natures rules, as does everything in the universe, but we add layers of our own rules on top.
Which nature rules? Basic or current? A wild fruit will be different from modífied and grown fruít in gardens.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 06:13 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Which nature rules? Basic or current? A wild fruit will be different from modífied and grown fruít in gardens.

Yes the really wild fruits are generally inedible.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 07:41 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Category error.
Crateator gerror.

That's Latin, Kumar. Actual Latin!

Don't believe me? Go look it up!

Okay, maybe it's Serbian. Or Cheyenne. Look, I can't do ALL your homework.

My head hurts again. Happens in these threads.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:10 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
What does that have to do with what I said?
What did you meant by your following post:-

"It's also unfortunate that the top two spots are the biggest troublemakers of the lot"
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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:12 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Nope, still nonsense. Everyone has to follow "nature's rules". You cannot opt out of them.
Are people living in big cities following basic nature's rules?
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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:18 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Are people living in big cities following basic nature's rules?
You might want to explain how posting on the internet is following "basic natures rules"

Norm
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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:19 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Comparing Islam with Christianity . The teachings of Jesus are inspiring and merciful, but the rantings of Muhammad are full of cruelty and warmongering.
Here are some quotes from Muhammad in the Quran. As can be seen they are full of violence and fighting.

;
If so, why one can't be that who follow basic nature's rules but other current nature's rules? Time, environment and option difference at the time of their introduction can make them different.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 08:28 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I have read some of the Upanishads and I find them very spiritual and inspired. I also believe in the Hindu concept of reincarnation and karma, but spiritualism teaches we do not come back as animals. Nor do I believe in the many Gods of the Hindus.
That is meant to adjust need of the changed time. Hinduism does not support it that we can not come back as secondary animals. Althought there can be many forms of forces, energy and matter but we need to think about validity of either basic/prime ones, intermediate ones or gross/latest ones. In my view, latest by maintaining basic/prime ones should only be valid or rational. Neither only basic ones, not intermediate ones and nor only latest ones.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:26 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Are people living in big cities following basic nature's rules?

Yes, because it is impossible not to. If you step off a high cliff, you will fall and die; if you step off a high building, you will fall and die. The rules are the same.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:32 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Which nature rules? Basic or current?

They don't change, no matter how much you would like them to. We follow the same "nature's rules" as wild animals follow. "Nature's rules" are "nature's rules". They all apply, all of the time, to everything.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:44 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
They don't change, no matter how much you would like them to. We follow the same "nature's rules" as wild animals follow. "Nature's rules" are "nature's rules". They all apply, all of the time, to everything.
Depending on prevailent conditions these can chànge. Live and let líve can beçome might is right. Survival can become survívàl of fittest and vice versa. Things do bécome obsolete. Probàbly you are telling that bàsic nature rules remain but we use different rules at in different conditions. ??
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:46 PM   #106
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Oh, Kumar, those aren't rules. Those are vague platitudes
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:50 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Are people living in big cities following basic nature's rules?
Depends what you're referring to. The laws of nature don't change, as others have pointed out, but we certainly interfere with nature - that's what civilisation was invented for, after all.

You could say it's a rule of nature that all women who survive into adulthood have a baby a year from puberty onwards, watch all but two or three of them die, and die themselves in childbirth before they're 30. By using birth control to limit the number of babies we give birth to, and then treating them if they get sick rather than just watching them die, we are choosing not to follow that rule.

Civilisation was invented to improve on nature.
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Old 23rd October 2017, 11:56 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Probàbly you are telling that bàsic nature rules remain but we use different rules at in different conditions. ??

Yes, and those rules that can be different are rules that we have made up.
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:13 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Depends what you're referring to. The laws of nature don't change, as others have pointed out, but we certainly interfere with nature - that's what civilisation was invented for, after all.

You could say it's a rule of nature that all women who survive into adulthood have a baby a year from puberty onwards, watch all but two or three of them die, and die themselves in childbirth before they're 30. By using birth control to limit the number of babies we give birth to, and then treating them if they get sick rather than just watching them die, we are choosing not to follow that rule.

Civilisation was invented to improve on nature.
I think, essence of your post is somewhat, nature or nature's basic rules never changes but we only change which only caused this confusion of basic vs current. Ok? If so, who made us to change?
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:16 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Yes, and those rules that can be different are rules that we have made up.
Who hypnotize us to opt such change?

i think, we also get changes in our genotype?
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:19 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
I think, essence of your post is somewhat, nature or nature's basic rules never changes but we only change which only caused this confusion of basic vs current. Ok?
We can choose not to live our lives according to nature's rules, if that's what you mean. Other animals aren't lucky enough to have that choice.

Quote:
If so, who made us to change?
Nothing made us change. We choose to improve on nature because nature is horrible.

We improve on nature every time we give insulin to a diabetic. Even something like homeopathy is an attempt to improve on nature, although in that case an unsuccessful one.
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:22 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
Yes, because it is impossible not to. If you step off a high cliff, you will fall and die; if you step off a high building, you will fall and die. The rules are the same.
But yesterday or origionally if we would had climbed to that height, probably we would had not reached at top and fall but now it can happen by using lift.
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:48 AM   #113
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How does a lift change the laws of anything, Kumar?

Hint: If you get the answer wrong, it will show that you don't understand the word "law".
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:50 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
I think, essence of your post is somewhat, nature or nature's basic rules never changes but we only change which only caused this confusion of basic vs current. Ok? If so, who made us to change?
You're the only one confused by that. You made up the idea of "current", and since there is no such thing (in the sense you meant it), you have confused yourself. Stop making stuff up, and be confused far less often.
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:52 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
Which nature rules? Basic or current? ....
There is only one set of unchanging rules. I don't know why this needs explaining to you so often.
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Old 24th October 2017, 12:58 AM   #116
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I feel this made story is also needed here
for better understanding:

Four friends gone to a big car showroom to buy a suitable car for them. Smart salesman explained about safety, risks, strength, stability and latest features of different cars. Now the reactions:

Ist: It is risky to travel by a car. I shall manage by walking anyway. Not bought.

2nd: I shall buy a strong and safe car may be with less features. Bought car with heavy metal but lesser speed n features.

3rd: I shall buy a car with latest features even of thin metal. I want better speed. Bought accordingly.

4th: I shall prefer car, reasonably strong, stable with reasonable features. Bought accordingly.

Now the outcome: all traveled thrice say about 100 kms ist on a sunny cool clear day, 2nd in some emergency situation and 3rd on a cloudy rainy day.

Can you logically assume the outcomes from these 3 travels? Pls tell. Good luck.
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Old 24th October 2017, 01:03 AM   #117
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Do you want to tell us why this isn't a deliberate derail, an offense here under Rule 11? I can't see any link whatever to the subject of the thread.
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Old 24th October 2017, 01:18 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Do you want to tell us why this isn't a deliberate derail, an offense here under Rule 11? I can't see any link whatever to the subject of the thread.
It is relevant to topic subject in a&f but just in example form.
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Old 24th October 2017, 01:21 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
You're the only one confused by that. You made up the idea of "current", and since there is no such thing (in the sense you meant it), you have confused yourself. Stop making stuff up, and be confused far less often.
I do see changes in nature. We are not same as we would had when become originally. Otherwise "evolutionary and other inherent changes will become odd terms.
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Old 24th October 2017, 01:21 AM   #120
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Originally Posted by Kumar View Post
It is relevant to topic subject in a&f but just in example form.
I asked how it was relevant, not if you thought it relevant. Explain what buying cars has to do with comparing religions.
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Last edited by MikeG; 24th October 2017 at 01:23 AM.
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