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Tags aliens , UFO incidents , ufos

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Old 2nd January 2018, 11:05 PM   #281
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Let me put it in another way. I challenge, or perhaps I should say, I DARE UFO skeptics to do their own research from credible sources
We have. That's how we have been debunking your lies. That's why you can't answer any direct questions and supply citations or links.

Now start answering direct questions.
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Old 2nd January 2018, 11:11 PM   #282
skyeagle409
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Originally Posted by Matthew Ellard View Post
No you don't. You make up lies on the spot and get caught lying. We are going to systematically work through the lies you made in this thread.

3) When was Ian Ridpath debunked "numerous times"? Link us to one debunk.
Let's go here.

Quote:
Ian Ridpath

SUMMARY
Although the overall case is complex, the main aspects can be summarized as follows:
1. Security guards saw bright lights apparently descending into Rendlesham Forest around 3 a.m on 1980 December 26. A bright fireball burned up over southern England at the same time.
No fireball came down in the Rendlesham forest that night or any other night for that matter.

Quote:
2. The guards went out into the forest and saw a flashing light between the trees, which they followed until they realized it was coming from a lighthouse (Orford Ness).
How long has that lighthouse been in operation? What caught the attention of security at the East Gate in the first place? It couldn't have been the light from the lighthouse because lights from the lighthouse cannot be seen from the East Gate and I have provided photos of the lighthouse and even a map as to why it was impossible to see lights from the lighthouse from the East Gate, and confirmed to me personally by those who were there.

Quote:
3. After daybreak, indentations in the ground and marks on the trees were found in a clearing. Local police and a forester identified these as rabbit scrapings and cuts made by foresters.
The landing pods were equally spaced and 7 inches in diameter. Plaster was used and it was determined that radiation readings were higher at the landing site around the depressions vs. the surrounding area.


Quote:
4. Two nights later the deputy base commander, Lt Col Charles Halt, investigated the area. He took radiation readings, which were background levels. He also saw a flashing light in the direction of Orford Ness but was unable to identify it.

Two nights they and they continued to confuse a lighthouse as a UFO in the forest or UFOs in the sky? The fact that the Rendlesham incident occurred on multiple nights effectively rules out the lighthouse as responsible.

And, base personnel were well-aware of the location of the lighthouse and the lighthouse does not explain the lights in the sky or that object that was tracked overflying both bases before contact was lost over Rendlesham forest. Even wondered why light-alls were used with their lights pointing outward from the forest rather than toward the location where investigations were being conducted?

Quote:
5. Col Halt reported seeing starlike objects that twinkled and hovered for hours, like stars. The brightest of these, which at times appeared to send down beams of light, was in the direction of Sirius, the brightest star in the sky.

At its most basic, the case comes down to the misinterpretation of a series of nocturnal lights – a fireball,...

Ian seems to forget the maneuvering objects across the sky could not have been a fireball nor a lighthouse that couldn't be seen from the East Gate.


Quote:
... and some stars.

How long have stars been in the sky over the area before the Rendlesham incident broke in 1980? Is Ian trying to be funny?

Last edited by skyeagle409; 2nd January 2018 at 11:14 PM.
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Old 2nd January 2018, 11:30 PM   #283
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So when General/Admiral so and so of Wright Patterson or whichever facility/incident (take your pick), since the 1940s, supposedly said interplanetary this and extraterrestrial that, what's going on? Including the various other military, pilots, etc saying ET or visitors or however they put it.

Or did they not even say those things....
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Old 2nd January 2018, 11:59 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Let's go here.

No fireball came down in the Rendlesham forest that night or any other night for that matter.

How long has that lighthouse been in operation? What caught the attention of security at the East Gate in the first place? It couldn't have been the light from the lighthouse because lights from the lighthouse cannot be seen from the East Gate and I have provided photos of the lighthouse and even a map as to why it was impossible to see lights from the lighthouse from the East Gate, and confirmed to me personally by those who were there.

The landing pods were equally spaced and 7 inches in diameter. Plaster was used and it was determined that radiation readings were higher at the landing site around the depressions vs. the surrounding area.

Two nights they and they continued to confuse a lighthouse as a UFO in the forest or UFOs in the sky? The fact that the Rendlesham incident occurred on multiple nights effectively rules out the lighthouse as responsible.

And, base personnel were well-aware of the location of the lighthouse and the lighthouse does not explain the lights in the sky or that object that was tracked overflying both bases before contact was lost over Rendlesham forest. Even wondered why light-alls were used with their lights pointing outward from the forest rather than toward the location where investigations were being conducted?

Ian seems to forget the maneuvering objects across the sky could not have been a fireball nor a lighthouse that couldn't be seen from the East Gate.

How long have stars been in the sky over the area before the Rendlesham incident broke in 1980? Is Ian trying to be funny?
None of this answers Matthew Ellard's question. This is just your bare, unsupported assertions, and sorry, but you are not a credible source for anything.

Where are the links to other debunking of Ian Ridpath? And this time, independent, verifiable and reliable sources please, not Flying Saucer nutcase websites!
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Last edited by smartcooky; 3rd January 2018 at 12:01 AM.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:14 AM   #285
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And as for Roswell, there is no doubt whatsoever that what came down on the Foster ranch was the remains of a Project Mogul balloon train. It fits the description (down to the smallest details) the flight path and the dates.

https://www.csicop.org/si/show/roswe..._project_mogul

Quote:
The September 1994 Air Force report indicates that the Brazel debris also made its way to Wright Field. During an Air Force interview of Mogul participant Colonel Albert C. Trakowski, he recalled a July 1947 telephone call from Colonel Marcellus Duffy, who was stationed at Wright Field and was intimately knowledgeable about both Project Mogul and military weather equipment. Duffy told Trakowski that a fellow from New Mexico came to Dayton, woke him up in the middle of the night, and showed him the debris. Colonel Duffy told the fellow, “It looks like some of the stuff you've been launching at Alamogordo.”

What is the bottom line on the Roswell Incident, NYU, and Project Mogul? In Moore’s words, “When the wind information is coupled with the similarities in the debris described by the eyewitnesses—the balsa sticks, the ‘tinfoil,’ the tape with pastel, pinkish-purple flowers, the smoky gray balloon rubber with a burnt odor, the eyelets, the tough paper, the four-inch-diameter aluminum pieces and the black box—to the materials used in our balloon flight trains, it appears to me that it would be difficult to exclude NYU Flight 4 as a likely source of the debris that W. W. Brazel found on the Foster ranch in 1947.”
Additionally, the argument that there was no balloon flight launched on June 4, 1947 simply does not stack up. Not only are there people who actually worked on the Project Mogul balloon trains and and remember the dates of their launches, there is a very good reason why there might be no official record of some launches.

Quote:
Moore, professor emeritus of physics at New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology in Socorro, was a graduate student working for NYU back in 1947. The Mogul project was so classified and compartmentalized that even Moore didn’t know the project’s name until Robert Todd informed him of it a couple of years ago. The unclassified purpose of the project was to develop constant-level balloons for meteorological purposes.
Quote:
While UFO proponents allege a lack of contemporary references to “Project Mogul Balloon Flights,” Moore says the project was so compartmentalized that such references simply may not exist. Any mention of these flights will instead be labelled as NYU constant-level balloon research.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:17 AM   #286
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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
So when General/Admiral so and so of Wright Patterson or whichever facility/incident (take your pick), since the 1940s, supposedly said interplanetary this and extraterrestrial that, what's going on? Including the various other military, pilots, etc saying ET or visitors or however they put it.

Or did they not even say those things....
Another alternative: They were mistaken.

How does being a general or admiral make them authorities on extraterrestrial whatever?

Appeals to ignorance are not sufficient,
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:24 AM   #287
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http://www.internationalskeptics.com...&postcount=285

Quote:
While UFO proponents allege a lack of contemporary references to “Project Mogul Balloon Flights,” Moore says the project was so compartmentalized that such references simply may not exist. Any mention of these flights will instead be labelled as NYU constant-level balloon research.
Indeed they were. I've seen some of the FOIA documents SkyEagle409 refers to ( believe I got them from him). They refer to NYU flights.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:53 AM   #288
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
...According to the video, tell us all who released the video in 2004? What did one of the pilots say?


NAVY PILOTS UFO


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RlbqOl_4NA

.
Circular argument.

This appears to be a YouTube copy of the BBC's copy of the same unprovenanced To The Stars etc. video that's been discussed ad nauseam. Its caption repeating the claim that it was "Released by the Department of Defense" is not in fact corroboration of that claim. Just a repeat of it.

There does not appear to be any evidence of that video being released by the Department of Defense beyond the say-so of the UFO chasers using it for publicity while seeking funding. Do you claim otherwise?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 05:04 AM   #289
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Quote:
"... 1. Security guards saw bright lights apparently descending into Rendlesham Forest around 3 a.m on 1980 December 26. A bright fireball burned up over southern England at the same time."
No fireball came down in the Rendlesham forest that night or any other night for that matter.
I detect a mismatch between these competing claims. Can you spot it?

Also, I am curious to know how you can be so certain that no fireball came down in the forest that night or any other. Is it because the people who officially track such things have handed you their incontrovertible evidence and it only shows flying saucers and no fireballs? If only you could show us, but sadly we must do our own research.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 05:43 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
No, I mean that CNN had it's own message board, and one of the sections was about Roswell and the AF's 1994 reports.

You post like some guy there who called himself Aubry. That was you, wasn't it? Aubrey faxed me some FOIA documents, and I scanned and posted them on my web site so everyone could see them.

Was that you?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 07:27 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
We ignore it because it's the same garbage that's already been debunked over and over and over again, as you would know if you had been following these threads as long as some of us oldtimers.

How many times does the same nonsense need to be debunked before it becomes OK to just ignore it, Bubba?
As frustrating as it is, each new generation necessarily requires to be told. Then there are those that won't ever take "NO" FOR an answer.

Last edited by Steve001; 3rd January 2018 at 07:31 AM.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 08:25 AM   #292
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Quote:
by Bubba View Post
So when General/Admiral so and so of Wright Patterson or whichever facility/incident (take your pick), since the 1940s, supposedly said interplanetary this and extraterrestrial that, what's going on? Including the various other military, pilots, etc saying ET or visitors or however they put it.

Or did they not even say those things....


Quote:

Posted by John Jones
....How does being a general or admiral make them authorities on extraterrestrial whatever?...

Being high up on the info chain could make a difference depending on what is classified in the info chain, but aside from that who then (and how) would make them (or anyone) an authority in your view? What criteria would qualify them?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 09:01 AM   #293
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Nobody is an authority on extra terrestrial spacecraft, Bubba, because nobody has ever had even a single example of an extra terrestrial spacecraft to study.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:18 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
Being high up on the info chain could make a difference depending on what is classified in the info chain, but aside from that who then (and how) would make them (or anyone) an authority in your view? What criteria would qualify them?
Nobody.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:22 AM   #295
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Not only have I served in Vietnam, at Hill AFB, UT, Travis AFB, CA. and TDY in Thailand, Davis-Monthan AFB, AZ., Andrews AFB, the Philippines, Guam, Japan, Okinawa, Mare Island Naval Shipyard, CA., Corpus Christ Army Depot, but I have been invited by the VA in the past to speak before its groups in San Francisco CA. and Oakland, CA. Even the Air Force has me covered and once again you can find me on the Internet.

http://www.af.mil/News/Article-Displ...skegee-airmen/
How so? The Lt col. in the pic died in 2014, so that's not you and none of the other names mentioned in the article come back to anything related to UFO's.

How about explaining how that article about the Tuskegee Airman has anything to do with you.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:47 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
So when General/Admiral so and so of Wright Patterson or whichever facility/incident (take your pick), since the 1940s, supposedly said interplanetary this and extraterrestrial that, what's going on? Including the various other military, pilots, etc saying ET or visitors or however they put it.

Or did they not even say those things....
Mistaken identification, confirmation bias, etc.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 11:49 AM   #297
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Originally Posted by Steve001 View Post
As frustrating as it is, each new generation necessarily requires to be told. Then there are those that won't ever take "NO" FOR an answer.
Yep, I was interested in fringe, pseudo science and UFO in the late 60's but I grew up! I did see two UFO's one remains mysterious (to me) the other many years later I resolved when I saw the same thing - it was birds circling above a well lite outdoor festival.

I stopped debating UFO fanatics in the late 90's it just became a game of endless repetition, intellectual whack a mole.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 12:00 PM   #298
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Skyeagle what was your MOS and rank in the Air Force?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 02:21 PM   #299
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One of the things I find fascinating about people who think UFO's are Alien Spacecraft of some kind is the similarity between the "evidence" for it and for the European Witchcraze.

For example:

1), In both cases much was made of the fact that many / most of the witnesses to it were sane, rational people not given to hallucinations, hysteria etc.

In case of the Witchcraze those who doubted the phenomena pointed out that much of the evidence came from people who were either crazed or tortured. But the Witchhunters said many / most of the people involved were perfectly sane and many were not even arrested but sought out the Witchhunters and calmly and rationally confessed to being Witches.

And these rational calm, uncoerced, people rationally and calmly talked about taking part in the Black Mass, the pact with Satan, flying through the air to the Witches Sabbat, sex with Satan, etc. How cried the Witchhunters could the skeptics reject such calm, rational evidence produced, by fine upstanding people like Lawyers, prosperous Merchants, Priests etc?

2) Firther the Witchhunters like modern UFO enthusiasts say if these accounts are the result of hysteria, fantasy etc., how come they are so similar to each other? How could accounts converge and seemlt support each other if it was all BS?

Thus the Witchhunters would refer to accounts in which two people who didn't know each other would describe seemly the same Witches Sabbat. How could this be if it was fantasy / nonsense?

3) Physical evidence Both UFO and the WitchHunters asserted that if properly interpreted there was physical evidence for their phenomena. In both cases broken branches, patches of ground that became "inexplicably" bare etc., were evidence of Witchcraft or UFOs as Alien craft.

4) And in both cases if you failed to accept the interpretation of the "evidence etc., like UFOs are spacecraft proponents, the Witchhunters asserted that showed you were closeminded and not open to possibilities that were clerarly indicated. ASo you has a skeptic needed to open your mind and not "dogmatically: reject the notion that Witches flew to the Sabbat where they celebrated a Black Mass, had sex with Satan, sacrificed babies bred for sacrifice, (All trace of being pregnant magically erased by Satan, and the Witches conjurted spells to summon even more demons bring on storms and plague etc. If you didn't accept that has a possibility that indicated you were claseminded and dogmatic and nort willing to look at the evidence.

5) Both UFO proponents of them being Alien spacecraft and the Witchhunters would concede that many of th cases were the result of hysteria, delusion, misperception etc., but there was always that unexplained residue that could not be explained in those ways so of course it must mean thast some of the UFOs are Alien Spacecraft and to the Witchhunters that Witches were absoloutely real, along with the pact with Satan etc.

Of course it turned out that the whole European Witchcraze was indeed a collective mass delusion. The whole Witches Sabbat fantasy was just that a fantasy. I suspect the UFO has Alien spacecraft is a similar fantasy.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:19 PM   #300
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PC Brian Cresswell : (Inspected the rabbit scrapings) "There were three marks in the area which did not follow a set pattern. The impression made by these marks were of no depth and could have been made by an animal.”
https://drdavidclarke.co.uk/secret-f...ecret-files-4/

"Forester Vince Thurkettle – who lived in the forest at the time of the incident – also visited the landing site about six weeks later after hearing rumours about a UFO landing. He too was left unimpressed by what he saw. Thurkettle said the three depressions found by the USAF airmen in the clearing resembled holes produced by burrowing animals."
https://drdavidclarke.co.uk/secret-f...ecret-files-4/

"As for the radiation detected at the “landing site” three independent scientific experts, including the makers of the Geiger counter, have since stated there was nothing unusual in the levels recorded by Halt’s team in the forest. They were simply background levels that would be expected in a pine forest."


Here are two lies.
Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
The landing pods were equally spaced and 7 inches in diameter. Plaster was used and it was determined that radiation readings were higher at the landing site around the depressions vs. the surrounding area.
You are directly lying again. Name the person who took subsequent radiation levels and found them higher than the normal background radiation. You simply lied.

For entertainment purposes, here is a photo of the three rabbit scrapings in discussion. Skyeagle will now explain why the grass isn't even bent in his magical 7 inch diameter landing marks.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg landing marks.jpg (141.7 KB, 12 views)
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:24 PM   #301
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Where are the links to other debunking of Ian Ridpath?
Thank you. I asked Skyeagle this direct question, so he made up two new unrelated stories on the spot instead.

If this is the best UFO researcher, he's harming the pro-UFO cause more than promoting it.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 03:35 PM   #302
John Jones
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Originally Posted by Matthew Ellard View Post
PC Brian Cresswell : (Inspected the rabbit scrapings) "There were three marks in the area which did not follow a set pattern. The impression made by these marks were of no depth and could have been made by an animal.”
https://drdavidclarke.co.uk/secret-f...ecret-files-4/

"Forester Vince Thurkettle – who lived in the forest at the time of the incident – also visited the landing site about six weeks later after hearing rumours about a UFO landing. He too was left unimpressed by what he saw. Thurkettle said the three depressions found by the USAF airmen in the clearing resembled holes produced by burrowing animals."
https://drdavidclarke.co.uk/secret-f...ecret-files-4/

"As for the radiation detected at the “landing site” three independent scientific experts, including the makers of the Geiger counter, have since stated there was nothing unusual in the levels recorded by Halt’s team in the forest. They were simply background levels that would be expected in a pine forest."


Here are two lies.


You are directly lying again. Name the person who took subsequent radiation levels and found them higher than the normal background radiation. You simply lied.

For entertainment purposes, here is a photo of the three rabbit scrapings in discussion. Skyeagle will now explain why the grass isn't even bent in his magical 7 inch diameter landing marks.
Prediction: He will come back with a post about a different UFO case.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:06 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Yep, I was interested in fringe, pseudo science and UFO in the late 60's but I grew up! I did see two UFO's one remains mysterious (to me) the other many years later I resolved when I saw the same thing - it was birds circling above a well lite outdoor festival.

I stopped debating UFO fanatics in the late 90's it just became a game of endless repetition, intellectual whack a mole.
Spot the disconnect?
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:20 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by Pacal View Post
One of the things I find fascinating about people who think UFO's are Alien Spacecraft of some kind is the similarity between the "evidence" for it and for the European Witchcraze.

For example:

1), In both cases much was made of the fact that many / most of the witnesses to it were sane, rational people not given to hallucinations, hysteria etc.

In case of the Witchcraze those who doubted the phenomena pointed out that much of the evidence came from people who were either crazed or tortured. But the Witchhunters said many / most of the people involved were perfectly sane and many were not even arrested but sought out the Witchhunters and calmly and rationally confessed to being Witches.

And these rational calm, uncoerced, people rationally and calmly talked about taking part in the Black Mass, the pact with Satan, flying through the air to the Witches Sabbat, sex with Satan, etc. How cried the Witchhunters could the skeptics reject such calm, rational evidence produced, by fine upstanding people like Lawyers, prosperous Merchants, Priests etc?

2) Firther the Witchhunters like modern UFO enthusiasts say if these accounts are the result of hysteria, fantasy etc., how come they are so similar to each other? How could accounts converge and seemlt support each other if it was all BS?

Thus the Witchhunters would refer to accounts in which two people who didn't know each other would describe seemly the same Witches Sabbat. How could this be if it was fantasy / nonsense?

3) Physical evidence Both UFO and the WitchHunters asserted that if properly interpreted there was physical evidence for their phenomena. In both cases broken branches, patches of ground that became "inexplicably" bare etc., were evidence of Witchcraft or UFOs as Alien craft.

4) And in both cases if you failed to accept the interpretation of the "evidence etc., like UFOs are spacecraft proponents, the Witchhunters asserted that showed you were closeminded and not open to possibilities that were clerarly indicated. ASo you has a skeptic needed to open your mind and not "dogmatically: reject the notion that Witches flew to the Sabbat where they celebrated a Black Mass, had sex with Satan, sacrificed babies bred for sacrifice, (All trace of being pregnant magically erased by Satan, and the Witches conjurted spells to summon even more demons bring on storms and plague etc. If you didn't accept that has a possibility that indicated you were claseminded and dogmatic and nort willing to look at the evidence.

5) Both UFO proponents of them being Alien spacecraft and the Witchhunters would concede that many of th cases were the result of hysteria, delusion, misperception etc., but there was always that unexplained residue that could not be explained in those ways so of course it must mean thast some of the UFOs are Alien Spacecraft and to the Witchhunters that Witches were absoloutely real, along with the pact with Satan etc.

Of course it turned out that the whole European Witchcraze was indeed a collective mass delusion. The whole Witches Sabbat fantasy was just that a fantasy. I suspect the UFO has Alien spacecraft is a similar fantasy.
Yes a more modern version of this were a percentage of the Muslim people I worked with for decades who would report encounters with Djinn, who while invisible could become visible if need be or would take over other people. These were in some cases western educated professionals.

Not unlike Christians reporting demons, the devil and angels talking to them.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:21 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Spot the disconnect?
Yes, chuckle - however some of those folks were rational people but their beliefs got the better of them.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:23 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
Prediction: He will come back with a post about a different UFO case.
Isn't that the standard MO - quantity versus quality. Kinda like the 'giants' conspiracy. Tons of reports when all they need is one good bone or tooth.

I use to tell such folks; stop posting the same reports and rumours over and over again and fund excavations and re-investigation of existing collections.....
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:25 PM   #307
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Ye gods I'm getting sucked back into UFOlogy............aaaaaaaaaaahhhhh.

Running for the door......................
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:30 PM   #308
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Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Ye gods I'm getting sucked back into UFOlogy............aaaaaaaaaaahhhhh.

Running for the door......................

Nowadays, I'm a UFOlogyologist
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Old 3rd January 2018, 04:44 PM   #309
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The contents of this thread resembles the other reason I walked away from UFO stuff.

There is an inability to focus on a single topic with the UFO crowd, and it ALWAYS works against them.

The issue at hand is the 2004 UFO-US Navy incident off of San Diego, CA.

The facts are these:

The F-18's were alerted by the USS Princeton, an Aegis, Ticonderoga Class cruiser. This means the F-18's and their home ship, the USS Nimitz, didn't see the radar contacts, or disregarded them.

The F-18's made visual contact, but could not close on the target, nor could they identify it.

That's it, that's all she wrote.

None of this has anything to do with Roswell, Brentwaters, Minot AFB, or any of the big-names in UFO mythology. Dragging these cases into the discussion clouds a simple issue: What did the F-18's actually see, did the Princeton make copy of their radar data (is that even possible)?

Nobody in the Navy is saying little green men here, just that they got a blip on their radar, and the jets chased something for a short time.

Me? I'm going with atmospheric phenomenon. The area of the Pacific is where the Alaskan Current gives way to the warmer currents coming up from the equator, and while I am no way qualified to speak to the science I am pretty sure it had something to do with that.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 07:11 PM   #310
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
Me? I'm going with atmospheric phenomenon. The area of the Pacific is where the Alaskan Current gives way to the warmer currents coming up from the equator, and while I am no way qualified to speak to the science I am pretty sure it had something to do with that.
It is well known that temperature inversions and propagation ducts can cause all sorts of anomalies in primary radar including incorrect target ranges and the appearance of targets travelling at high or near impossible speeds.

Incorrect range is usually caused by temperature inversion. This happens when heat radiates from the ground on clear nights, and is especially prevalent on cold winter nights. The ground temperature drops while the upper levels of the atmosphere remain comparatively warm. This is the reverse of the normal temperature gradient (under normal conditions, air temperature usually decreases with height). The result of this is that the radar beam is ducted along the ground extending the normal range of the radar, causing distant targets to appear closer in the PPI because the beam return from the target falls in the following pulse repetition period.

Extremely high speed targets sometimes happen due to wave interactions at the edges of the duct. Its difficult to describe how this happens, but the nearest analogy I can give is this. If you have ever stood on a steepish beach watching small waves break, sometimes the waves will be coming in almost, but not quite parallel to the beach front. Even though the waves are coming in very slowly, the break can run along the beach so fast that if you were chasing it, it would be impossible to keep up. Its these breaks in the waves that run between the boundary layers of the air that get detected by the radar, and it is not unusual for them to appear to be travelling at thousands of kilometres per hour.

These are all well-known, well-understood phenomena known as Anomalous Propagation, but you will never get Flying Saucer nutcases to accept this... too much science for their pea-brains.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 08:07 PM   #311
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post

(Snip)

Me? I'm going with atmospheric phenomenon. The area of the Pacific is where the Alaskan Current gives way to the warmer currents coming up from the equator, and while I am no way qualified to speak to the science I am pretty sure it had something to do with that.
I'll say, um, witches. Yeah, that's the ticket. Witches on broomsticks. Turbo broomticks!

Prove it's not.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 09:18 PM   #312
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Originally Posted by Bubba View Post
So when General/Admiral so and so of Wright Patterson or whichever facility/incident (take your pick), since the 1940s, supposedly said interplanetary this and extraterrestrial that, what's going on? Including the various other military, pilots, etc saying ET or visitors or however they put it.
Or did they not even say those things....

There have been admirals, generals, intelligence officials, military and commercial pilots, air traffic controllers, scientist, astronomers, engineers, etc, around the world saying that the objects are those of extraterrestrials. It was clear that the Roswell incident had nothing to do with balloons because the military would not have released this news story over a weather balloon or even a simple unclassified research balloon known as Project Mogul.

https://i.huffpost.com/gen/676970/th...-large300.jpg?


During the Roswell incident of the first week of July 1947, saucers were also overflying the Muroc AFB area in California in July 8, 1947 and documentation also available on the Muroc AFB case and it was clear the saucers over Muroc AFB had nothing to do with balloons or aircraft. Muroc AFB is now known as Edwards AFB.

Muroc AFB UFOs

http://www.nuforc.org/Muroc.html

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Old 3rd January 2018, 09:27 PM   #313
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Originally Posted by BStrong View Post
Mistaken identification, confirmation bias, etc.

Not the case at all. Wright-Patterson AFB, is where the Roswell debris was taken and Senator Barry Goldwater wanted to take a look but got chewed out by General Curtis LeMay who warned Senator Goldwater never to ask again.


Barry Goldwater & The Secret UFO Room @ Wright-Patterson AFB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtJo6vKnY54
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Old 3rd January 2018, 09:57 PM   #314
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Originally Posted by fibbermcgee View Post
Skyeagle what was your MOS and rank in the Air Force?
53470, E-6.

I served 4 years (1967-71) and got out and went to work for the U.S. Navy as a civil servant where I worked on submarines in California for 18 months whereas, I received my appointment as an Air Reserve Technician (ART) at Travis AFB. I was not only an airframe technician, but I also flew as a DCC assistant (1983-84) on the C-5A transport as well. My aircraft, on one mission in the Pacific, was involved in flying recovery gear from Subic Bay, Philippines to Yokota AB, Japan in support for the recovery of Korean Flt 007, which was shot down by the Soviets. We were flying a typical 'Round Robin' mission in the Pacific and were at Clark airbase, Philippines for crew rest when we got word to fly down to Subic Bay.

As an Air Reserve technician (ART) at Travis, my civilian and military positions were combined and after my retirements, I became employed with defense contractors at Travis AFB, and at the Corpus Christi Army Depot (CCAD) where I was involved in the overhauling and modifying of the Army's helicopters and went into permanent retirement two months after bin Laden was killed.

I find it interesting that Travis AFB ( Fairfield-Suisun Army Air Base) is mentioned on multiple occasions in Project Blue Book.

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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:00 PM   #315
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
Prediction: He will come back with a post about a different UFO case.
.....and that's exactly what he did.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:06 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by Hans View Post
Ye gods I'm getting sucked back into UFOlogy............aaaaaaaaaaahhhhh.

Running for the door......................

Don't go yet because it has been determined that the objects the Navy pilots saw were not weather balloons.


Not of this Earth

http://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/12...r-sot-ebof.cnn

Last edited by skyeagle409; 3rd January 2018 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:13 PM   #317
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
Don't go yet because it has been determined that the objects the Navy pilots saw were not weather balloons.
1) No one claimed anyone saw weather balloons.

2) You are very upset because you just found out the original fake Nimitz tic tac UFO video was on You tube in 2007 and Elizondo's new company made a new fake version that Tom Delonge showed at that company's launch in October 2016.

Tsk tsk tsk.......try harder next time.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:17 PM   #318
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I like how these aliens clearly have very weird agenda. For decades all the did was they get spotted time to time, while doing what ? Scouting ? But it's not like they scouted the planet 50 years ago and invaded it soon after. No .. they are still just scouting. They also didn't leave, and the also didn't learn from being spotted.
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:17 PM   #319
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by skyeagle409 View Post
The landing pods were equally spaced and 7 inches in diameter.
You're just a source of entertainment now.

7 inch diameter circles?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg landing marks 2.jpg (26.8 KB, 4 views)
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Old 3rd January 2018, 10:20 PM   #320
skyeagle409
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post

The issue at hand is the 2004 UFO-US Navy incident off of San Diego, CA.

The facts are these:

The F-18's were alerted by the USS Princeton, an Aegis, Ticonderoga Class cruiser. This means the F-18's and their home ship, the USS Nimitz, didn't see the radar contacts, or disregarded them.

The F-18's made visual contact, but could not close on the target, nor could they identify it.

Thank you! And, it is time to get this back on track.

It is clear the objects the Navy pilots encountered were not balloons nor aircraft and the objects exhibited extreme maneuvers far beyond anything known to mankind, which simply means that if the objects that exhibited such advanced maneuvers are not those of mankind, then they came from somewhere else.

Last edited by skyeagle409; 3rd January 2018 at 10:21 PM.
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