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Tags donald trump , Trump administration , Trump controversies

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Old 27th June 2018, 09:38 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
Here's Ocasio-Cortez's platform:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DgqWsjSWAAU7NiO.jpg:large

I guess the bit about supporting Trump was on page 2.
That is an awesome platform, and it begs the question: how do you pay for all that AND fund the world's largest military? Of course you can't do both, and the Democrats won't take on the military-industrial complex, so I guess you float more debt.

I would still vote for her. The GOP will bury us in debt too, and if we're going to go down, I would rather do it spending money on people who need it.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:00 AM   #42
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https://twitter.com/marcorubio/statu...27850629378048

Quote:
Many Republicans won’t criticize Trump even when they don’t agree with him b/c it means siding with a media that nevers cuts him a break,turns even little things he does into an act of evil,are also unfair to them & in the end will still attack you anyway
So it's the media's fault that Republicans won't speak out about Trump.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:01 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
That is an awesome platform, and it begs the question: how do you pay for all that AND fund the world's largest military? Of course you can't do both, and the Democrats won't take on the military-industrial complex, so I guess you float more debt.
I think we could probably afford both, but that would raise the dread specter of taxing like it was the 1950s again. The most downright unamerican and communist time in american history.

But we instead like the people who think putting brown kids in cages is really damn funny.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...018-story.html

"Attorney General Jeff Sessions cracked a joke about the administration’s immigration chaos, and was greeted with laughs at the idea of separated families.

Sessions spoke Tuesday to a crowd at the conservative-leaning Criminal Justice Legal Foundation, and accused critics of his “zero tolerance” immigration policy of hypocrisy."

Of course you can't say that it makes them bad people. Lots of good people like to torture kids for being a lesser race.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:14 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
I think we could probably afford both, but that would raise the dread specter of taxing like it was the 1950s again. The most downright unamerican and communist time in american history.

But we instead like the people who think putting brown kids in cages is really damn funny.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...018-story.html

"Attorney General Jeff Sessions cracked a joke about the administration’s immigration chaos, and was greeted with laughs at the idea of separated families.

Sessions spoke Tuesday to a crowd at the conservative-leaning Criminal Justice Legal Foundation, and accused critics of his “zero tolerance” immigration policy of hypocrisy."

Of course you can't say that it makes them bad people. Lots of good people like to torture kids for being a lesser race.
Yes, the Democrats will raise taxes on the rich, and it will help, but not enough to offset the cost of medicare-for-all, nevermind all the rest.

One argument you could make is that there will be an economic boon from decoupling business from health insurance and free college, and there probably would be. That's how the GOP justifies all its budget-busting tax cuts: we'll get more revenue from higher GDP.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:18 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Trump also tweets

"Harley-Davidson should stay 100% in America, with the people that got you your success. I’ve done so much for you, and then this. Other companies are coming back where they belong! We won’t forget, and neither will your customers or your now very HAPPY competitors!"
Yup, Trump certainly has done a lot for Harley Davidson.

Like pulling out of the TPP. There was a 74% tax on Harley Davidson motorcycles in Vietnam (a country where the motorcycles are some sort of status symbol.) The TPP would have eliminated that tax.

Nice to see Trump has their back, killing trade deals that would have helped their sales.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/03/01/trum...d-the-tpp.html
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:40 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
https://twitter.com/marcorubio/statu...27850629378048

So it's the media's fault that Republicans won't speak out about Trump.
”We would’ve criticized him too if it weren’t for you meddling media kids!”
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:53 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
I see it largely confined to the US. There may be some countries with a bit of "form" for that kind of thing who will elect a similar government but in the main IMO Europe will stick with boring old Social Democracy in one form or another.



I disagree - but maybe I'm being over-optimistic

Unless the "war" in question is waged economically rather than militarily in which case, President Trump has already had his Fort Sumpter moment IMO.
So only Americans can succumb to authoriatarisim;Euros are immune.
History says otherwise.
I suspect that underneath all your crodocile tears you are happy to see the USA collapse. But if you think the fall of Democracy in the US will not do severe damage to Democracy worldwide you are living in a dream world.
And yes, I suspect that you have had a dislike for the USA a long time before Trump came along.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:56 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
You can hardly slide a piece of paper between what she is fighting for and Trump is fighting for!
You have to be kidding.
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Old 27th June 2018, 10:59 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
So only Americans can succumb to authoriatarisim;Euros are immune.
History says otherwise.
Not my claim. What I am saying is that the recipe isn't there right now in most Western European countries IMO.


Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I suspect that underneath all your crodocile tears you are happy to see the USA collapse. But if you think the fall of Democracy in the US will not do severe damage to Democracy you are living in a dream world..
You suspect incorrectly, and in any case I wasn't forecasting a collapse of democracy, merely a return to the 1950s


Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
And yes, I suspect that you have had a dislike for the USA a long time before Trump came along.
Mindreader are you ?

I love the US, I'm half American, I married an American. I dislike the GOP and Trump in particular but I have no animus towards the US at all.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:09 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Quote:
You can hardly slide a piece of paper between what she is fighting for and Trump is fighting for!
You have to be kidding.
Yeah, I think he was.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:25 AM   #51
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Justice Kennedy resigns, IMHO this country might be headed for the worst domestic crisis we have seen since the Civil War.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:26 AM   #52
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Justice Kennedy just announced his retirement from the SCOTUS.

Another seat for Trump to fill

ETA Ninjad
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:35 AM   #53
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I notice my idea that armed resistence to a dictatorship might be necessary is not getting shot down as quickly as it would have been in the past.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:37 AM   #54
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First time I've said "Dear God!" in ages is when I just read the news. Good-bye, democracy. Now future autocrats can say democracy only leads to mob rule and denial of rights, so their benign rule is demonstrably better.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:42 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I notice my idea that armed resistence to a dictatorship might be necessary is not getting shot down as quickly as it would have been in the past.
Yea but it won't actually work though.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:45 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by Hlafordlaes View Post
First time I've said "Dear God!" in ages is when I just read the news. Good-bye, democracy. Now future autocrats can say democracy only leads to mob rule and denial of rights, so their benign rule is demonstrably better.
And are you going to do anything about it but rant?
You are good example of this "cool despair" that is playing into their hands.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:48 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Justice Kennedy resigns, IMHO this country might be headed for the worst domestic crisis we have seen since the Civil War.
If it got bad enough, I can see the military stepping in. They're the only respected institution left.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:50 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
If it got bad enough, I can see the military stepping in. They're the only respected institution left.
But they like the whole kids in cages thing, it was masterminded by Kelly after all.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:52 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
But they like the whole kids in cages thing, it was masterminded by Kelly after all.
In his civilian role, and everyone thinks it was Sessions and Trump who did it anyway. I doubt the military really wants anything to do with these kids.

I don't see the military taking any hits from the child separation policy.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:54 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
In his civilian role, and everyone thinks it was Sessions and Trump who did it anyway. I doubt the military really wants anything to do with these kids.

I don't see the military taking any hits from the child separation policy.
Well they are setting up the concentration camps so that is a bonus to them.

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/25/62314...ts-mattis-says

So they certainly are not exactly pushing back against this, they are happy to build and run Trumps concentration camps.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:56 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
In his civilian role, and everyone thinks it was Sessions and Trump who did it anyway. I doubt the military really wants anything to do with these kids.

I don't see the military taking any hits from the child separation policy.
A lot of people on the left just plain old hate the military..a hangover from the 1960's.
Another area where I break from left wing orthodoxy.
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Old 27th June 2018, 11:58 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Well they are setting up the concentration camps so that is a bonus to them.

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/25/62314...ts-mattis-says

So they certainly are not exactly pushing back against this, they are happy to build and run Trumps concentration camps.
Given that the refugees have to be detained, chances are the Military will run it better then a private contractor would.
Like it or not, it's a legal order, the Military has to follow it.
(Comparasions between the US Military and the Nazi Military coming in 3..2..1...)
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:00 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
A lot of people on the left just plain old hate the military..a hangover from the 1960's.
Another area where I break from left wing orthodoxy.
Yea nothing wrong with them torturing detainees after all totally legal as seen by the way they got away with it. That is the moral answer when dealing with Muslims after all.

But perpetuate the lies about the military caring about illegal orders in defiance of all evidence.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:01 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Given that the refugees have to be detained, chances are the Military will run it better then a private contractor would.
Like there is a serious difference. The military jumps on private contractors with in its own nature perfectly easily. They did it all the time in the prisons in Iraq why would they do anything different in the concentration camps in the US?
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:02 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Given that the refugees have to be detained, chances are the Military will run it better then a private contractor would.
No the military would run it as the military.

it's the last people you wan't guarding a civilian detention centre, they only know one way of dealing with dissent and disruption. It would only be a matter of months until the stories of beatings came out and then 'accidental' deaths.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:04 PM   #66
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I suppose ther Army could set up specialist 'deployment groups' to deal with the camps.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:05 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
A lot of people on the left just plain old hate the military..a hangover from the 1960's.
Another area where I break from left wing orthodoxy.
Same. While I've said that we don't need to spend as much as we do on it, this has more to do with my industry-side work than the idea that the military, itself, is some sort of inherent evil. In reality, a lot of people on the left remain deeply ignorant of the extraordinary humanitarian work the military often does in the face of disaster, in particular.

ETA: I made a mistake above. I meant to say that they remain willfully ignorant, not just deeply so.

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Old 27th June 2018, 12:06 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
I suppose ther Army could set up specialist 'deployment groups' to deal with the camps.
Please they are not going to bother, they are going to contract it out and just have it on their land. Safely outside of the jurisdiction of the states.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:07 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Given that the refugees have to be detained, chances are the Military will run it better then a private contractor would.
Like it or not, it's a legal order, the Military has to follow it.
(Comparasions between the US Military and the Nazi Military coming in 3..2..1...)


How soon we forget.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:08 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
I suppose ther Army could set up specialist 'deployment groups' to deal with the camps.
For me It's OUR Army, and I served for four years in it.
And you don't know crap about how the US Army operates.
US army will use the experience they have running humanitarian operatings worldwide in running these camps.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:10 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Cheap shot.
Welcome to my "Another lefty who just plain hates the military" list.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:11 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Same. While I've said that we don't need to spend as much as we do on it, this has more to do with my industry-side work than the idea that the military, itself, is some sort of inherent evil. In reality, a lot of people on the left remain deeply ignorant of the extraordinary humanitarian work the military often does in the face of disaster, in particular.
It must be a very small element, because I haven't heard a hint of anything anti-military coming from any elected Democrats. I can't remember the last time anyone on the Left even complained about military spending. That omnibus bill was celebrated as a victory by Pelosi and Schumer and that only happened because the military wanted more money.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:13 PM   #73
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"In Tuesday’s New York Times, Mounk shared some the startling results of his research into feelings toward democracy, including that 1 in 6 Americans now say that military rule would be a “good” or “very good” thing. In 1995, that number was 1 in 16.

Young people, in particular, seem increasingly open to alternatives to democracy, with only 19 percent of millennial Americans saying a military rule would be illegitimate. These trends are also taking hold in Europe, where 36 percent of millennials says a military takeover would be illegitimate, versus 53 percent of older Europeans.
"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/harvard...military-rule/
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:21 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
"In Tuesday’s New York Times, Mounk shared some the startling results of his research into feelings toward democracy, including that 1 in 6 Americans now say that military rule would be a “good” or “very good” thing. In 1995, that number was 1 in 16.

Young people, in particular, seem increasingly open to alternatives to democracy, with only 19 percent of millennial Americans saying a military rule would be illegitimate. These trends are also taking hold in Europe, where 36 percent of millennials says a military takeover would be illegitimate, versus 53 percent of older Europeans.
"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/harvard...military-rule/
Well this will make dudalb happy.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:23 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Cheap shot.
Welcome to my "Another lefty who just plain hates the military" list.
And if they actually cared about it and didn't join the CIA in covering up as much as possible by destroying documents they might have earned some credit. But you can't put soldiers in prison for just following orders, unless pictures of them doing so get out and enrage the public then they can be scapegoated. But certainly no officers would ever be held accountable, that would be right out.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:25 PM   #76
dudalb
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Well this will make dudalb happy.
Everybody who supports a strong military is in favor of a Miltray Dictatorship.


I got news for you:The Sixties have been over for a long time.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:29 PM   #77
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... All those right-wing, fascist milennials.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:30 PM   #78
ponderingturtle
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Everybody who supports a strong military is in favor of a Miltray Dictatorship.
Hey you are in with the cool kids. See the ratings of how many people consider a military take over legitimate.

We had the military running torture programs in the past and as long as the followed proper security protocall with regards to photos they were fine from a legal stand point. Now they are setting up concentration camps. When will they have to be held accountable? I get it torture is not a problem and totally allowed by the UCMJ after all. That is why it wasn't a big deal and they were not actually illegal orders.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:35 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
For me It's OUR Army, and I served for four years in it.
And you don't know crap about how the US Army operates.
US army will use the experience they have running humanitarian operatings worldwide in running these camps.
Of course they will. There is no difference between delivering humanitarian aid and guarding a concentration camp full of foreign detainees.
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Old 27th June 2018, 12:36 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Cheap shot.
Welcome to my "Another lefty who just plain hates the military" list.
Why was it a 'cheap shot'?

It was your army that did it.
The British Army did similar things against civilian detainees.
It's what happens when you have the army guarding hostile civilians.

History is against you.
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