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#161 |
Embarrasingly illiterate
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,605
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record. Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000 |
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#162 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 19,267
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I can think of few things more terrifying than being trapped underwater in the dark.
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Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting. |
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#163 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pattaya, Thailand
Posts: 39,909
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I have no idea what you're saying - it's the double negative in the first full sentence. Or the final incomplete one? Perhaps you could re-phrase your post.
They widened a completely different point from the one mentioned in that cutaway map. They widened it, as they said at the time, so that the divers could pass through wearing their scuba tanks. They did have some early problems but they carried in all sorts of stuff past that point long ago. They have a marshaling area where the Evening Standard says they couldn't get through, so wherever they got that information, it's wrong. Personally, I think they just put the label in the wrong place. Look further up the route towards the boys. See the "Cave Under 16 Feet of Water"? That's the traverse we're discussing. *Is that the London Evening Standard? I tried to find the article to see their source, but can't locate it. Can you provide a link. They're right up there with the Daily Mail in terms of reliability. |
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Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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#164 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Directly under a deadly chemtrail
Posts: 21,188
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In Hollywood they use a rope in these situations, so that you just have to pull yourself along the line through the water and out to safety.
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What a fool believes, no wise man has the power to reason away. What seems to be, is always better than nothing. 2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break? |
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#165 |
Self Employed
Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 16,043
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Medical Assessment: Coach and boys not well enough to attempt escape.
CNN: https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/05/asia/...ntl/index.html
Quote:
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- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset - "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal - "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC |
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#166 |
Show me the monkey!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21,621
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I'm staying with my original speculation that the boys won't be diving out of the cave. I know that equipment donations are happening and some training is happening - but they won't dive out.
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Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot. |
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#167 |
King of the Pod People
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 25,659
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#168 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Great Northwet
Posts: 20,048
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The Teevee news this morning suggested they might chip away at the ceilings to enable them to wade out chin deep.
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Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant. |
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#169 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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An update from a reporter on the scene. Another kid from the team almost went with the others, but his Mom picked him up right after practice.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...?noredirect=on |
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#170 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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#171 |
Show me the monkey!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21,621
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Daily Mail reports that the boys have heard dogs barking, roosters crowing and child voices. They think the sounds are coming from some opening to the surface and people are looking for the opening. But this seems like it could be delusions or auditory hallucinations or just made up tales.
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Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot. |
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#172 |
Show me the monkey!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21,621
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There's also a report that some of the pumps were mistakenly pumping water into the cave instead of out. Not sure if confirmed.
Two boys and the coach have exhaustion due to malnutrition. CNN says the roundtrip to visit the boys takes 11 hours. The phone connection failed because the cable fell into the water. |
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Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot. |
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#173 |
Show me the monkey!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21,621
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I haven't read anything about what is deeper into that cave system. I read they are about 3 miles into a 7 mile long system. Could conditions be better further in? If waters rise dangerously could it be better further in?
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Bigfoot believers and Bigfoot skeptics are both plumb crazy. Each spends more than one minute per year thinking about Bigfoot. |
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#174 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,316
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Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu We are Groot - Groot |
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#175 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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#176 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,316
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Don't be silly. Its far to wet to start a bonfire. Perhaps some tear gas would work.
Ok, I don't really expect them to use anything like that, but it was a serious question about whether there is a reasonable way to trace air flow in a cave to see if there is an outlet to the outside. (I remember seeing a documentary where they used special dyes to trace water flow. I thought they may use the same methodology to trace air flow.) |
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Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu We are Groot - Groot |
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#177 |
Master Poster
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,896
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crescent's Pie-in-the-sky idea Number 1:
Lay a grid of microphones on the surface above where the kids are, say a few hundred meters on each side, one microphone every ten meters or so. Make very loud noises in the cave (give the kids hearing protection). Do it electronically, at specific wavelengths. See which mikes pic it up. Look for the right wavelengths as a way of filtering out ambient sounds. Focus search effort on the places where the mikes pick up the sound the loudest, to look for currently undiscovered openings. crescent's pie-in-the-sky idea #2: Ground penetrating radar, to pick up voids closer to the surface, with hope that those will lead further down to the kids. I have always seen ground penetrating radar done with sleds on skids. Is there an aerial equivalent? crescent's pie-in-the-sky idea #3: Heat the air in the cave. Use infrared imagery in the cool of the night to look for warm air coming out. Try to time it with weather forecasts to coincide with low-pressure systems. |
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#178 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 19,267
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Well, they started all this as an initiation rite. I'd say they're now all in their own very exclusive club.
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Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting. |
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#179 |
Embarrasingly illiterate
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,605
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__________________
I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record. Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000 |
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#180 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pattaya, Thailand
Posts: 39,909
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It is wide enough to pass through with gear on. Period. They widened it.
It is NOT wide enough for a Seal and a kid to do together. Stop reading gossip rags. Do you not understand that the map you posted is wrong? The "pinch point" they are pointing to is not there. It is in the deep-dive location. Divers have gone through with tanks on!!! End of story. They do not have to remove their scuba gear. I posted this before. I referred you to it. The source is Thailand. I trust it far more than the crap map you posted because IT AGREES WITH ALL THE COMMENTARY FROM THE PROFESSIONALS ON THE SCENE. https://www.bangkokpost.com/news/gen...y-out-for-boys |
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Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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#181 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pattaya, Thailand
Posts: 39,909
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Our concern here is that the PM and his dimwitted #2 now have the word from The King, who as we all know is appointed by the Buddha and can do no wrong.
The King has said "get them out as quickly as possible". Thai doesn't have a whole lot of nuance, but they could weasel if they say "well, waiting two weeks until they are healthy is "as soon as possible, your majesty". But they will take it, I fear, as marching orders. On the human foibles front, the arguments have started as to whether they're "boys will be boys" or "irresponsible hooligans", with a couple of conspiracy weirdos offering up that they are under the spell of an evil shaman who cursed the coach because of a dispute over rice acreage with his grandparents. (Hey, we're as crazy as American conspiradroids!) On the positive side, a bunch of local farmers are complaining because while the politicians are posturing, the army enlisted local volunteers and dammed up a couple of streams that feed the underground chambers. The water is actually going down. That water is flooding the farmers' land. The rice farms love it. Others? Not so much. The amount of rainfall was not as bad as the doomsayers had warned about. The pumping is working, but not terribly rapidly and there's always the threat of more rain. |
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Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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#182 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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Apparently a SEAL diver helping with the efforts ran out of air and died. Not a good sign for the kids.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/li...-decision-live |
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#183 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pattaya, Thailand
Posts: 39,909
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Our concern here is that the PM and his dimwitted #2 now have the word from The King, who as we all know is appointed by the Buddha and can do no wrong.
The King has said "get them out as quickly as possible". Thai doesn't have a whole lot of nuance, but they could weasel if they say "well, waiting two weeks until they are healthy is "as soon as possible, your majesty". But they will take it, I fear, as marching orders. On the human foibles front, the arguments have started as to whether they're "boys will be boys" or "irresponsible hooligans", with a couple of conspiracy weirdos offering up that they are under the spell of an evil shaman who cursed the coach because of a dispute over rice acreage with his grandparents. (Hey, we're as crazy as American conspiradroids!) On the positive side, a bunch of local farmers are complaining because while the politicians are posturing, the army enlisted local volunteers and dammed up a couple of streams that feed the underground chambers. The water is actually going down. That water is flooding the farmers' land. The rice farms love it. Others? Not so much. The amount of rainfall was not as bad as the doomsayers had warned about. The pumping is working, but not terribly rapidly and there's always the threat of more rain. Aaaaaand..... while I was typing this..... news is out that a Seal died from lack of oxygen, but not clear which section of the caves he was in. |
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Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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#184 |
Grammar Resistance Leader
TLA Dictator Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Pattaya, Thailand
Posts: 39,909
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__________________
Ha! Foolmewunz has just been added to the list of people who aren't complete idiots. Hokulele It's not that liberals have become less tolerant. It's that conservatives have become more intolerable. |
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#185 |
Embarrasingly illiterate
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,605
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__________________
I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record. Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000 |
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#186 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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Latest NY Times report:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/04/w...e-updates.html |
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#187 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South Africa
Posts: 3,485
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I've done some scuba, including swimming through a coral arch in near perfect visibility and even with the arch being wide enough for 4 or 5 divers at a time, that rather tame experience was enough to have my respiration rate climb massively, depleting my supply early.
These kids are going to need rebreathers, because I certainly wouldn't want to have to change cylinders at depth with 0 vis. That would REALLY suck. |
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#188 |
Nitpicking dilettante
Deputy Admin Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Berkshire, mostly
Posts: 41,753
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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#189 |
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waiting for the pod bay door to open.
Posts: 39,644
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Five or so hour dive one way. Killer.
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Continually pushing the boundaries of mediocrity. Everything is possible, but not everything is probable. For if a man pretend to me that God hath spoken to him supernaturally, and immediately, and I make doubt of it, I cannot easily perceive what argument he can produce to oblige me to believe it. Hobbes |
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#190 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South Africa
Posts: 3,485
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SpaceX and The Boring Company (aka Musk Industries) representatives are flying to Thailand to offer aid.
Musk has been tweeting about various potential rescue plans and appears now to be offering his engineers to assist. https://www.teslarati.com/spacex-bor...mpression=true |
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#191 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,777
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"The cure for everything is salt water - tears, sweat or the sea." Isak Dinesen |
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#192 |
Master Poster
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,631
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'A knave; a rascal; an eater of broken meats; a base, proud, shallow, beggardly, three-suited, hundred-pound, filthy, worsted-stocking knave; a lily-livered, action-taking knave, a whoreson, glass-gazing, superservicable, finical rogue;... the son and heir of a mongral bitch: one whom I will beat into clamorous whining, if thou deniest the least syllable of thy addition."' -The Bard |
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#193 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 18,488
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#194 |
Nitpicking dilettante
Deputy Admin Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Berkshire, mostly
Posts: 41,753
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The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Ezekiel 23:20 |
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#195 |
Illuminator
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,902
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Looks like he was a volunteer (retired military diver). I get the feeling that everything is a bit disorganized. Perhaps the Thai military should step in and enforce stricter protocols and procedures wrt. who's doing what and where and making sure participants/divers have past some sort of inspection before entering the cave.
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#196 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,350
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Latest report is that authorities think they're running out of time.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/06/w...ue-divers.html |
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#197 |
King of the Pod People
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 25,659
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#198 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 8,631
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If would-be rescuers can pinpoint a route, mitigate risks and work quickly, a drilling-down seems like a plausible alternative vs. all of the risks associated with escorting out non-divers who are also non-swimmers.
It's messed up either way. I would not want to be the adult who put these children at such risk. I'm sure the coach is telling himself the same thing, but really, someone should have known better, and it's NOT the teen-tween-age boys. |
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#199 |
Featherless biped
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Aporia
Posts: 20,046
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'The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool.' - Richard Feynman |
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#200 |
Muse
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Disneyland
Posts: 971
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Elon tweeted an update on what they are building.
Quote:
Will Thailand military wait for this? Maybe they have diverted/plugged the rain water enough now that it buys them more time? |
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