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Old 4th May 2019, 07:24 PM   #361
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Apparently Nazis now have McDonald's cups.
A force multiplier like no other.

Note the current trend now, though. We're not demanding answers from the white nationalist who threatened to knock a kid's teeth out for carrying a cup; we're calling out the people who threw milkshakes at Robinson (or laughed about it) for making that white nationalist have to be so defensive like that.
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:27 PM   #362
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Oh easy. See, Robinson is one of those white nationalists that doesn't directly call himself a Nazi in so many letters, so that people like theprestige will defend him as being unfairly labeled when other people use the word "nazi" while calling him out for his white nationalism. At any rate, he's currently campaigning for MEP (because remember, there's no sign these guys have any political aspirations, according to cullenz), and while campaigning of course he and his supporters try to put on this facade of being perfectly logical and reasonable, so as to make his white nationalist mantras sound like measured and intelligent discourse.

This particular guy is one of Robinson's supporters (you can deduce his intellectual depth by his I AM SOLDIER sign); but thanks to Robinson being milkshook twice this past week, his "soldiers" are so spooked that the mere sight of a young boy with a McDonald's cup in his hand instantly banishes the calm-and-reasonable act and brings out exactly what they are down inside - angry, vicious, the kind of people who at least profess that they wouldn't hesitate to preemptively knock a kid's teeth out for getting too close to their guy while carrying a beverage.
Dear god...you're doubling down...

I'll try this again: what we would call a 'normal' person would see a kid, who appears to be minding his own business, menaced by a pretty clearly violent man, and we might sat to ourselves 'hey, maybe this throwing food at nazi types isn't such a hot idea. Things could actually get pretty ugly, pretty quick'.

But no: you go all Bill and Ted and think it's epic and awesome to see a child threatened. Not even a nazi child, which might be arguable. A kid being credibly threatened by an unhinged adult is epic and awesome.

If you can't see how screwed up it is for you to be cheering this, there's really nothing more to say.
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:31 PM   #363
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Apparently Nazis now have McDonald's cups.
Inorite? Duuuuuuude, did you see the kid get threatened to have his teeth punched out by the nazi? Wasn't that just totally AWESOME?
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:31 PM   #364
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
credibly threatened
Maybe this is where our disagreement lies. So far, Robinson and his "boyz" have only swung on people who actually threw milkshakes at them.

How convenient that the guy professing a desire to hurt one kid though, is "clearly a violent man", a real threat that needs to be taken seriously...now that you can use it as a vector to criticize me. Meanwhile the same guy or someone else like-minded standing on a corner professing a desire to ethnically-cleanse the country of millions of non-whites is just a silly clown, and people treating them as a threat that needs to be actively fought are just overreacting and making "mountains out of molehills".
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:39 PM   #365
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I have watched the Robinson thing with interest, and haven't really bothered commenting.

The dude is scum.

How anyone can defend the football hooligan mass brawl starting thug is beyond my understanding.

The dudes history is ugly reading
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:51 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Maybe this is where our disagreement lies. So far, Robinson and his "boyz" have only swung on people who actually threw milkshakes at them.

How convenient that the guy professing a desire to hurt one kid though, is "clearly a violent man", a real threat that needs to be taken seriously...now that you can use it as a vector to criticize me. Meanwhile the same guy or someone else like-minded standing on a corner professing a desire to ethnically-cleanse the country of millions of non-whites is just a silly clown, and people treating them as a threat that needs to be actively fought are just overreacting and making "mountains out of molehills".
Dear god...you're tripling down...

First off, you are comically wrong again. Maybe tragically too, but comically for now. The NYC guy did not threaten anyone, just calmly debated, as civilly as could be expected. The 'soldier'...not so much. Massive swing and a miss for Checkmite.

Yet here you are posting about how violent the Robinson boyz are, and when presented with a vid of one, you suddenly opine that they are as docile as pussy cats. The humor is certainly lost on you, while raving about the awesome epicness of children being threatened.

Does your mouth get tired arguing out of both sides of it like that? Seems tiring.
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:57 PM   #367
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post

First off, you are comically wrong again. Maybe tragically too, but comically for now. The NYC guy did not threaten anyone, just calmly debated,
Jesus goddamn Christ. The iconography he's wearing professes an ideology whose defining feature is ethnic cleansing. I guess as long as he doesn't say the words out loud, we're not allowed to take that under consideration when dealing with him?

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Yet here you are posting about how violent the Robinson boyz are, and when presented with a vid of one, you suddenly opine that they are as docile as pussy cats. The humor is certainly lost on you, while raving about the awesome epicness of children being threatened.
I was raving about the awesomeness of a Robinson fan being scared of a milkshake.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:03 PM   #368
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Inorite? Duuuuuuude, did you see the kid get threatened to have his teeth punched out by the nazi? Wasn't that just totally AWESOME?
You need to get some rest. We're dealing with several sets of arguments at the same time. One camp says "You can't take them seriously, they're clowns" and when we riff on their oafish posturing, the other camp comes in with "OMG won't someone think of the children! He was threatening violence! How can you laugh at this?"

Which is it? Are you taking a hard line pacifist stance. All violence is bad? All threats of violence? I was a "peacenik" but never a pacifist. Meh? I think the nazi who threatened the kid was probably a great candidate for an egging at that point? You wanna reason with him?
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:06 PM   #369
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Jesus goddamn Christ. The iconography he's wearing professes an ideology whose defining feature is ethnic cleansing. I guess as long as he doesn't say the words out loud, we're not allowed to take that under consideration when dealing with him?
...quadrupling down...this is surreal...

No, there is no comparison between a guy wearing a trinket necklace and a guy actually threatening a child. One is strictly talk. The other is imminently and physically threatening a specific kid right in front of him. No. There is no comparison at all.


Quote:
I was raving about the awesomeness of a Robinson fan being scared of a milkshake.
He showed no sign of fear. He showed naked menace.

Seriously, dude. This would be a stellar time to say 'you know what? The epic thing was misguided. Got caught up in it and didn't see what the dumbest ************ in the world could see, an adult threatening a child WHICH IS NOT ******* EPIC AND AWESOME'.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:22 PM   #370
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
No, there is no comparison between a guy wearing a trinket necklace and a guy actually threatening a child.
Take that faux-indignation, examine it for a moment, and try to understand how genuinely threatened people like Darat feel, knowing that to them that trinket necklace literally expresses "Someday I fully intend to murder you and everyone ethnically similar to you."

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
He showed no sign of fear. He showed naked menace.
Of course he didn't show any sign of fear. Dangerous animals often bare their teeth and growl when they feel cornered and threatened. Thing is, we have the contextual knowledge to know what he felt so threatened by - a McDonald's cup; and the fact that a McDonald's cup can provoke a fight-or-flight response in someone who obviously considers himself a tough-guy is utterly hilarious.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:28 PM   #371
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
You need to get some rest. We're dealing with several sets of arguments at the same time. One camp says "You can't take them seriously, they're clowns" and when we riff on their oafish posturing, the other camp comes in with "OMG won't someone think of the children! He was threatening violence! How can you laugh at this?"

Which is it? Are you taking a hard line pacifist stance. All violence is bad? All threats of violence? I was a "peacenik" but never a pacifist. Meh? I think the nazi who threatened the kid was probably a great candidate for an egging at that point? You wanna reason with him?
Try to bear with me here:

The chump in the OP is seems to be a windbag, from his costume to his pseudo-intellectual BS on down.

Soldier boy in the latest vid seems to be serious. I would be on guard around him.

Do you see how these are two very different people, acting very differently? I do. So I treat them differently. If there are 'two camps' arguing here, I would say it is one camp painting everyone with the same brush, and the other acknowledging there are differences in how dangerous they appear.

My camp is fond of 'hey, howzabout we take initiating any level of violence off the table? Things can get bad fast'. And the other sez 'nah, you can just throw food and stuff at them all, that's fine'. Adults are saying this. Ones who claim to champion skepticism and rationality on one hand and think they're rogue cowboys on the other.

Foolmewunz: Do you think it's a good idea to cheer on a situation where an apparent loose cannon was getting ready to drop a kid? Something funny about that? Serious question. To me, it shows exactly why this is not a good idea to let yo alligator mouth getcha into things yo canary ass can't getcha out of.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:34 PM   #372
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Do you see how these are two very different people, acting very differently? I do. So I treat them differently.
Well they were treated differently, weren't they? The one you think of as the harmless "windbag" is the only one of the two that got egged. Maybe the people choosing that particular channel of mockery are more discerning of their targets than you want to give them credit for.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:38 PM   #373
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Take that faux-indignation, examine it for a moment, and try to understand how genuinely threatened people like Darat feel, knowing that to them that trinket necklace literally expresses "Someday I fully intend to murder you and everyone ethnically similar to you."



Of course he didn't show any sign of fear. Dangerous animals often bare their teeth and growl when they feel cornered and threatened. Thing is, we have the contextual knowledge to know what he felt so threatened by - a McDonald's cup; and the fact that a McDonald's cup can provoke a fight-or-flight response in someone who obviously considers himself a tough-guy is utterly hilarious.
...quintupling down...I just can't...i don't...hm...

I can only interpret your current argument a few different ways:

1. You got carried away cheering on your team, such as it is, and are still mindlessly trying to score points
2. You know you made a mistake, but won't admit it
3. You genuinely are the most precious of princesses and genuinely do not understand that things can go very bad and it's not a flipping movie where people waltz away unscathed when starting street confrontations
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:44 PM   #374
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Well they were treated differently, weren't they? The one you think of as the harmless "windbag" is the only one of the two that got egged. Maybe the people choosing that particular channel of mockery are more discerning of their targets than you want to give them credit for.
Taking the time to snip out quotes says a lot about the poster.

The windbag did go after the egger, to refresh your evidently failing memory. When provoked, many will retaliate. My argument since my first posting here is that pro-eggers better think about what they are advocating.

But what is this new argument you are presenting, now? Only go after ones that don't seem fiesty? That's a bully's rationale, is it not? Awfully courageous of you to advocate only attacking the weak.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:45 PM   #375
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
...quintupling down...I just can't...i don't...hm...

I can only interpret your current argument a few different ways:

1. You got carried away cheering on your team, such as it is, and are still mindlessly trying to score points
2. You know you made a mistake, but won't admit it
3. You genuinely are the most precious of princesses and genuinely do not understand that things can go very bad and it's not a flipping movie where people waltz away unscathed when starting street confrontations
Yet again. They're harmless, toothless fools that nobody needs to worry about...except when it turns out they're not. So we mustn't ever laugh at them or make them angry, because we won't like them when they're angry. And if they get angry and do something, we're the horrible ones, because we made them do that by laughing at them.
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:53 PM   #376
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Taking the time to snip out quotes says a lot about the poster.

The windbag did go after the egger, to refresh your evidently failing memory. When provoked, many will retaliate.
Not so harmless after all, then?

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
My argument since my first posting here is that pro-eggers better think about what they are advocating.
If that is all, I'll do that, I promise.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
But what is this new argument you are presenting, now? Only go after ones that don't seem fiesty? That's a bully's rationale, is it not? Awfully courageous of you to advocate only attacking the weak.
Now you're unabashedly portraying self-identified Nazis as tragic victims who are being treated very unfairly, and the people who are willing to stand up to their ideology and propagandizing as bullies.
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:00 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Yet again. They're harmless, toothless fools that nobody needs to worry about...except when it turns out they're not. So we mustn't ever laugh at them or make them angry, because we won't like them when they're angry. And if they get angry and do something, we're the horrible ones, because we made them do that by laughing at them.
...never had to confront sextupiling down before...autocorrect doesn't even recognize the word...

As I have said...slowly and repeatedly...start a physical fight with someone...almost anyone...and they might fight back. You can actually bank on it. The OP blowhard showed no sign of doing anything but calmly debating- till he was assaulted. Which is what you are advocating.

As I keep saying, if you fancy yourself a devil-may-care livin'-by-his-own-rules renegade butch boy, have at it. Live your fantasy. I'm a dad, and taught my kids that talk is cheap and not to pick fights, even if your adversary is weaker. You should talk with them about adulting.
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:09 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Not so harmless after all, then?
The OP's talk was cheap, yes. Egg boy decided to ramp it up and changed the game. There was no physical altercation till eggy boy initiated it. And that is what you are advocating, initiating violence. Grats, yo.

Quote:
If that is all, I'll do that, I promise.
No you won't. One nazi boy fights back and you'll be shrieking about how violent those nazis are. You will never own your responsibility in it.

Quote:
Now you're unabashedly portraying self-identified Nazis as tragic victims who are being treated very unfairly, and the people who are willing to stand up to their ideology and propagandizing as bullies.
Wrong again. I'm pointing out your endless hypocrisy, and that's clean pool. I'm fine with consenting peers getting into a mutual fight, and have repeatedly supported antifa and nazis squaring off on every thread. What I an criticizing here is this SJW hypocrisy, where you pooh-pooh violence done by others while supporting it (unrealistically) when it's you doing it.
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:13 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
As I have said...slowly and repeatedly...start a physical fight with someone...almost anyone...and they might fight back. You can actually bank on it. The OP blowhard showed no sign of doing anything but calmly debating- till he was assaulted. Which is what you are advocating.
....and sometimes when you "calmly debate" to someone's face that they're a danger to children on account of being gay, or imply that they're violent rapists who don't belong in a white country, you might get egged (in the first case) or a milkshake thrown at you (in the second case). Those actions were not spontaneous; they were provoked.
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:29 PM   #380
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Note, by the way, that nobody did anything to the man who was threatening the boy with the McDonald's cup. He was not provoked into making his threat by anything that boy actually did. Nor by anything that ANYBODY had done to him personally, at any time.

Nobody had thrown eggs, drinks, or fists at these three either.

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About five hours before his companion allegedly fired a bullet toward several protesters, and a day before police charged him with attempted homicide, Colton Fears, in an interview with HuffPost, laid out the grievances that had brought him to town. “Basically, I’m just fed up with the fact that I’m cis-gendered, I’m a white male, and I lean right, towards the Republican side,” said Fears, 28, wearing a pin of the 3rd SS Panzer Division Totenkopf of the Waffen-SS. “And I get demonized if I don’t accept certain things.”
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:31 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
....and sometimes when you "calmly debate" to someone's face that they're a danger to children on account of being gay, or imply that they're violent rapists who don't belong in a white country, you might get egged (in the first case) or a milkshake thrown at you (in the second case). Those actions were not spontaneous; they were provoked.
...and here we are with the 'he maaaaaade me do it mommy. He staaaaarted it' argument.

Talk is cheap. The OP clown, whom you advocate throwing eggs at, is maybe not your best example of provoking a fight with words. I actually agree that you can get physical in response to some words. Sometimes with legal justification, and sometimes not.

But even if someone calls your race a bunch of puppy sodomizers, or whatever you please as the insult, you are not the good guy for turning it physical. It might feel great, like when you see a woman throw a glass of wine in her boorish date's face on tv, but in real life there might be retaliation. And you would bear some responsibility for literally starting it.

Serious question: what things (short of threatening imminent grave danger) can be said that you think justify assaulting the speaker?
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:36 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Note, by the way, that nobody did anything to the man who was threatening the boy with the McDonald's cup. He was not provoked into making his threat by anything that boy actually did. Nor by anything that ANYBODY had done to him personally, at any time.
I didn't see what the run-up was in the very short twitter clip. You have a longer version that shows what happened leading up to the punk threatening the kid, yes?

Quote:
Nobody had thrown eggs, drinks, or fists at these three either.
Yes, Checkmite. Some bitches are trouble right out of the gate, eggs or not. Everyone except you seems aware of that. This really surprises you?
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:49 PM   #383
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
...and here we are with the 'he maaaaaade me do it mommy. He staaaaarted it' argument.
This is exactly how you've been defending the reactions of the egged and milkshaked individuals, so what gives? "Egg boy decided to ramp it up and changed the game. There was no physical altercation till eggy boy initiated it." "The OP blowhard showed no sign of doing anything but calmly debating- till he was assaulted."

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Talk is cheap. The OP clown, whom you advocate throwing eggs at, is maybe not your best example of provoking a fight with words. I actually agree that you can get physical in response to some words. Sometimes with legal justification, and sometimes not.

But even if someone calls your race a bunch of puppy sodomizers, or whatever you please as the insult, you are not the good guy for turning it physical. It might feel great, like when you see a woman throw a glass of wine in her boorish date's face on tv, but in real life there might be retaliation. And you would bear some responsibility for literally starting it.
Then it sounds like you need to save your indignation for the guy who physically threatened that kid with the McDonald's cup that never actually touched him, and stop drafting whole pages of posts lecturing me over simply considering his attitude worthy of mockery and not being shy about saying so.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Serious question: what things (short of threatening imminent grave danger) can be said that you think justify assaulting the speaker?
For the purposes of this thread, let's stick to "espousing white nationalist propaganda". And I'm going to waste one last modicum of expectation of good faith out of you, and kindly remind you that you have already seen me specifically post that the only assault I'm willing to laugh at involves non-injurious eggings and splashed drinks.
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Old 4th May 2019, 09:52 PM   #384
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I didn't see what the run-up was in the very short twitter clip. You have a longer version that shows what happened leading up to the punk threatening the kid, yes?
Well this is just like the LWB videos now, isn't it? Sure the video doesn't look good for the guy making the irrational threats, but something might have happened before the video clip starts, and it will never be fair to judge him as long no video of that before-time exists.
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Old 4th May 2019, 10:17 PM   #385
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
This is exactly how you've been defending the reactions of the egged and milkshaked individuals, so what gives? "Egg boy decided to ramp it up and changed the game. There was no physical altercation till eggy boy initiated it." "The OP blowhard showed no sign of doing anything but calmly debating- till he was assaulted."
Yes. That's exactly how it works. Recall that the original egg boy's 69 year old 'victim' was not prosecuted because he had acted in self-defense and could not be prosecuted. Talk...is...cheap. Once you turn it into physical assault, no matter how petty, you just gave your victim a lot of license.

And yet again, I am arguing that this is a dicey game to play. Not nearly the yuk em up game you treat it as.

Quote:
Then it sounds like you need to save your indignation for the guy who physically threatened that kid with the McDonald's cup that never actually touched him, and stop drafting whole pages of posts lecturing me over simply considering his attitude worthy of mockery and not being shy about saying so.
You forgot to read the posts. I was the first (and I think only) to condemn that weasel. You were busy portraying it as totally awesome, dude. I think that it is totally bad ******* news for an adult to be threatening a kid. Because there are scum like that running loose, I condemn your innocent advocating of picking physical fights with them.

Quote:
For the purposes of this thread, let's stick to "espousing white nationalist propaganda". And I'm going to waste one last modicum of expectation of good faith out of you, and kindly remind you that you have already seen me specifically post that the only assault I'm willing to laugh at involves non-injurious eggings and splashed drinks.
Right. You try to qualify assault as 'non-injurious', and you think that covers you. But it doesn't, because you can't necessariy control whether or not you injure the target. Recall home boy walking with his daughter. You know, the one with your theorized vehicular turbo boost launcher.

I get that you have argued yourself into a corner that I doubt you even believe in the arguments you are posing. I am ending up arguing along lines i had no intention of fighting, too. So I propose a truce:

Can we agree that it is not a good idea to advocate starting a physical confrontation with strangers, via foodstuffs or otherwise?

Can we further agree that (notwithstanding the above) it is tremendously satisfying to see nazis humiliated via eggs and milkshakes, and laughable in hindsight, so long as people are not actually injured while doing so?

Can we lastly agree that we are both mostly fighting to win here and not presenting our most thoughtfully considered opinions?
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Old 4th May 2019, 10:38 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I'm beginning to wonder why so many people are walking around while coincidentally carrying eggs.

Is it a US thing where everyone walks around with eggs in their pockets?

Just in case they see a wannabe Nazi?

Eggs are the newest health fad, you know. They're no longer all cholesterol and clogged up arteries. They're good for you! Gotta have eggs!
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Old 4th May 2019, 10:41 PM   #387
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Well this is just like the LWB videos now, isn't it? Sure the video doesn't look good for the guy making the irrational threats, but something might have happened before the video clip starts, and it will never be fair to judge him as long no video of that before-time exists.
No. You made the claim, and I quote, that 'nobody did anything to the man who was threatening the boy with the McDonald's cup'. This claim is untrue. We have absolutely no idea what happened prior to the threatening. So your claim is false.

And I'll take this latest bob and weave as 'no, actually I have no idea at all what happened, but it sure sounded good'.
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:07 PM   #388
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Yes. That's exactly how it works. Recall that the original egg boy's 69 year old 'victim' was not prosecuted because he had acted in self-defense and could not be prosecuted.
...but neither was the original egg boy himself. From this fact it would seem that how it works isn't quite as straightforward as you characterize it.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You forgot to read the posts. I was the first (and I think only) to condemn that weasel. You were busy portraying it as totally awesome, dude.
I was busy mocking him. You think my use of the word "epic" was praise or approval of his actions?!?

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Right. You try to qualify assault as 'non-injurious', and you think that covers you.
No, I don't "try to". I do. Directly, simply, and unequivocally. You can very easily egg someone in a way that bears no more chance for injury than walking silently past them (you can always trip unexpectedly and knock them over, causing them to break a bone for instance). Just because it is possible for people to do it in a negligent manner and cause injury, doesn't mean we can never permit it when done safely. We can license people and say we expect them to drive automobiles - an inherently risky activity - in a safe manner, and aren't hypocrites for charging them with any number of crimes up to and including homicide if they do so in a reckless manner that causes injury or worse.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I get that you have argued yourself into a corner that I doubt you even believe in the arguments you are posing. I am ending up arguing along lines i had no intention of fighting, too. So I propose a truce:

Can we agree that it is not a good idea to advocate starting a physical confrontation with strangers, via foodstuffs or otherwise?
No. At most I will agree it's inherently risky and one should strongly consider whether they're willing to take that risk before doing so.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Can we further agree that (notwithstanding the above) it is tremendously satisfying to see nazis humiliated via eggs and milkshakes, and laughable in hindsight, so long as people are not actually injured while doing so?
Yes, this has been my attitude from the very beginning.

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Can we lastly agree that we are both mostly fighting to win here and not presenting our most thoughtfully considered opinions?
Yes; unfortunately this describes me in most debates I have here.
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:12 PM   #389
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
No. You made the claim, and I quote, that 'nobody did anything to the man who was threatening the boy with the McDonald's cup'. This claim is untrue. We have absolutely no idea what happened prior to the threatening. So your claim is false.
Fine: based on the information we have, there is no evidence to suggest or reason to suspect that anybody did anything to the man who was threatening the boy with the McDonald's cup.
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:41 PM   #390
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
<respectful snip for closure>

No. At most I will agree it's inherently risky and one should strongly consider whether they're willing to take that risk before doing so.
Ok, slight rewording: can we agree that it is generally a bad idea to advocate assault, but that there are rare times when one might feel morally justified in willingly breaking the law, with the acceptance of legal and retaliatory consequences?
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:49 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Ok, slight rewording: can we agree that it is generally a bad idea to advocate assault, but that there are rare times when one might feel morally justified in willingly breaking the law, with the acceptance of legal and retaliatory consequences?
I find that acceptable, yes.
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:00 AM   #392
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This whole thing has turned into a very silly discussion: Are Nazis so bad that their opponents are justified when they resort to the atrocity of egging them?!

Well, on the one hand Nazis and other fascists are actually bad, but on the other hand eggs don't really stop them from being so, so instead of focussing on our differences, it might be a good idea to take a look at the things that democrats and Nazis have in common, the things that unite them, so to speak. I mean, what makes so many democrats turn to fascism when democracy disappoints them?
A couple of quotations from my friends at Ruthless Criticism:

Quote:
… democracy is therefore a praise-worthy political system because it is not fascism. And turned around: Fascism is despicable because it is simply not democratic. In this way one learns nothing about either fascism or democracy. Thus goes that remarkable praise of democracy that gets by completely without argument.
Why democrats fail at the criticism of fascism! ...and can only forbid it

Quote:
Such nationalists become disappointed in democracy out of their fundamental approval for the aims of the democratic state if, or because, they are of the opinion that the clique of leading politicians across all parties are betraying the highest aims of the nation. From the diagnosis of betrayal, they draw the conclusion that their nation state, which is called to greatness, is at a minimum being ruined, if not doomed to destruction, by the incumbent rulers.
Their diagnosis of betrayal attaches itself to the following points:
—They discover elements alien to the nation, which undermine national unity and thereby weaken the productive force of the nations people. At one time, those elements primarily included Bolsheviks/Communists and Jews or Jew-ridden Bolshevism (Hitler), which, although surely non-German, had nestled into the German national body; today it is primarily foreigners.
—They complain that the state is too submissive to capital, which does not place its capacities at the service of the nation, i.e., does not calculate in the national interest but rather increases its profits according to private calculations: whenever, with whomever, and wherever.
—And they regard it as a particularly despicable form of betrayal of the fatherland that their homeland surrenders its highest purpose, namely, national sovereignty, by entering into alliances with competitors or former enemies (EU, NATO ) instead of asserting its sovereignty globally as its most important and purely national mission.
Six theses on democracy and fascism and one conclusion

Quote:
Anti-immigrant resentment belongs to the political culture of the country, serving in the democratic competition as an effective means for getting the electorate’s attention. Democratic politicians want to protect their clients from “immigrants abusing our social programs,” want “American jobs for American workers,” see foreigners “buying up America,” campaign against “anchor babies,” demand “English only,” call for “secure borders to protect against an immigrant invasion” and call on the police to detain people suspected of being foreigners.
(…)
The radical right wing activist shares the sullen nationalist sentiments of grumbling members of the people, but he considers them inconsistent, because they see the danger to the people and nation as much as he does, but do nothing about it. He renounces patriotic obedience and trust in the state’s governing of the national cause in the sense of the people – and acts on it. He wants to “End Apathy,” as Wade Michael Page’s band name put it.
So he kills a bunch of Sikhs.
The Sikh temple massacre in Wisconsin: Why patriotism can lead to mass murder from higher motives

Quote:
For this democracy makes an unbeatable offer to the governed. It allows, and an institutionalized opposition even emphatically summons, the people to be angry in the name of all the understood necessities of effective governing and in the interests of an actively enforced justice, not only against foreign nations which only cause problems, against foreigners who do not belong here, and against domestic interest groups who fail in their duties to the common good, but also and especially against their own government, which obviously fails on all these fronts. Dissatisfaction is positively incited in order to steer them into an aggressively affirmative and militantly conformist criticism of an insufficient exercise of political power, that is, one that lags behind its own criteria for success.
On the upswing of the political culture in times of economic downturn
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:05 AM   #393
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
This whole thing has turned into a very silly discussion: Are Nazis so bad that their opponents are justified when they resort to the atrocity of egging them?!

Well, on the one hand Nazis and other fascists are actually bad, but on the other hand eggs don't really stop them from being so, so instead of focussing on our differences, it might be a good idea to take a look at the things that democrats and Nazis have in common, the things that unite them, so to speak. I mean, what makes so many democrats turn to fascism when democracy disappoints them?
A couple of quotations from my friends at Ruthless Criticism:
That is all very well put together, but I thought the point was is it ok to throw things at people's heads.

And is this a form of violence.

If no to first and yes to second , then deal with the being called a violent idiot
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:16 AM   #394
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Try to bear with me here:

The chump in the OP is seems to be a windbag, from his costume to his pseudo-intellectual BS on down.
Seems to be? I'm supposed to base my safety or that of my family or neighbors by how something "seems"? He's espousing serious nasty-assed doctrine. Ever been attacked by cretinous redneck morons just because you disagreed with them politically? The audience he's looking for is just those people.

Quote:
Soldier boy in the latest vid seems to be serious. I would be on guard around him.
We'll have to agree to disagree. Him Am Soldier falls into the AHNC category of blowhard. (all hat no cattle) Since "seems' seems to be the working criteria, the loud threatening types seem to me to be less than actually dangerous.

Quote:
Do you see how these are two very different people, acting very differently? I do. So I treat them differently. If there are 'two camps' arguing here, I would say it is one camp painting everyone with the same brush, and the other acknowledging there are differences in how dangerous they appear.
Reading is not your strong suit. The two camps I'm referring to are the ones you're shifting back-and-forth between. They're clowns and my feelings about them don't matter, I need to reason with them like Martin Luther Farkin' Gandhi? Oh, but this one is verbally threatening someone so he's not a clown but a desperado and shame on you folks for laughing at him although I just finished telling you that you need to laugh at nazis.

Like I said.... Which one is it?

Quote:
My camp is fond of 'hey, howzabout we take initiating any level of violence off the table? Things can get bad fast'. And the other sez 'nah, you can just throw food and stuff at them all, that's fine'. Adults are saying this. Ones who claim to champion skepticism and rationality on one hand and think they're rogue cowboys on the other.
Ooooh, the No True Skeptic argument. That worked so well for TBD, I'm surprised more haven't taken it up!

I do not personally go nazi hunting, but I can see how numerous people feel that someone espousing a murderous genocidal program* could be worthy of an egging or milkshaking. I don't know where you (or Varwoche) grew up but both were common all over the USA and still are. They are more emotionally violent than physically violent.

*And make no mistake, the soft-spoken intellectualizers are espousing that values of the Third Reich, not some Fascist Utopiastan. They're supporting and defending the bona fide card-carrying history-confirmed Nazis. And not just from WWII Germany. They're also real fond of the genocidal factions in the Bosnia/Serbia/Croatia Big Dance. Hey, they may not be lightning bolt wearing nazis, but any port in a storm! We need heroes to look up to and anyone who wants to wipe out an entire people is okay by us!

Quote:
Foolmewunz: Do you think it's a good idea to cheer on a situation where an apparent loose cannon was getting ready to drop a kid? Something funny about that? Serious question. To me, it shows exactly why this is not a good idea to let yo alligator mouth getcha into things yo canary ass can't getcha out of.
Again with the straw. No one's cheering on the situation. We're laughing that the posturing jerkwad who's going to rid the UK of the blight of Mooslims and Nogs (both of which groups are heavily armed) is a-scared of a wax-paper cup.

Not surprising, but you're as wrong as you've ever been on a topic. You refuse to understand the other side's position so invent points that you'd like to argue with.
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:23 AM   #395
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
That is all very well put together, but I thought the point was is it ok to throw things at people's heads.

And is this a form of violence.

If no to first and yes to second , then deal with the being called a violent idiot

And that is the extremely silly questions!
My answer can only be more questions:
Why is it so important to you to portray Nazis as the wronged victims of an act that is usually considered to be a fairly innocent prank?!
Why don't you stick with the thread title, Another Nazi egged? Why are Nazis in your version turned into people? And why is egging turned into violence?!
The thread title was short and concise. You (and yours) are dealing in weird abstractions in order to turn it into a horrendous crime:
egging = throwing things (!) at people's heads = violence.
Nazis = people.
Somebody who disagrees with this absurdity of yours = violent idiot.

OK, then I guess that according to your very weird new definition of the term I'm a violent idiot.
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"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

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Old 5th May 2019, 12:31 AM   #396
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
That is all very well put together, but ...

You didn't read a single one of those quotations, did you?!
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:34 AM   #397
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
And that is the extremely silly questions!
My answer can only be more questions:
Why is it so important to you to portray Nazis as the wronged victims of an act that is usually considered to be a fairly innocent prank?!
Why don't you stick with the thread title, Another Nazi egged? Why are Nazis in your version turned into people? And why is egging turned into violence?!
The thread title was short and concise. You (and yours) are dealing in weird abstractions in order to turn it into a horrendous crime:
egging = throwing things (!) at people's heads = violence.
Nazis = people.
Somebody who disagrees with this absurdity of yours = violent idiot.

OK, then I guess that according to your very weird new definition of the term I'm a violent idiot.
Mainly because I don't care what he is.

He is obviously a scummy racist dude holding a flag on a street

But why exactly does this justify some random throwing something at another persons head?

Has he not heard of ringing the police?

I'm guessing they have but the police wouldn't do anything as the scum is not doing anything unlawful.

Only throwing things at heads dude is
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:49 AM   #398
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I'm beginning to wonder why so many people are walking around while coincidentally carrying eggs.



Is it a US thing where everyone walks around with eggs in their pockets?



Just in case they see a wannabe Nazi?
"wannabe"? What makes someone a wannabe Nazi rather than a Nazi?
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:51 AM   #399
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
If you're not assaulting someone then the Nazis win


Superman had his Kryptonite, Vampires have garlic, and Nazis have....... eggs.
Surely we can deal with Nazis without assaulting them?
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Old 5th May 2019, 12:54 AM   #400
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I thought we had gone through the making stuff up other posters have said conversation.



Oh well





Why do you keep saying people should beat other people up holding flags within inches of death?



I find your calls for this atrocious
You seem to forget that promptly after you were bemoaning about people for making stuff up you then launched into making stuff up. Mote, eyes and beams come to mind.
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