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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:12 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Do you genuinely believe I'm incapable of analyzing incidents on a case-by-case basis; of realizing that a "prank" can be mild and funny and harmless when done this way, but not that way? That if I am okay with someone cracking an egg over a Nazi's head as a means of mocking him in these instances, that means I must endorse absolutely anything that anyone could ever possibly do with an egg, no matter how "badly" it goes? Do you not believe in the existence of nuance at all, or do you just think I'm not intelligent enough to discern it and need to be "taught" about it?

No. I don't think laughing about what the fellow did in that video means it would be hypocritical of me to condemn someone for risking serious injury by forcefully pitching an egg into someone's eye-socket. I can do both with a clear conscience. Slide-tackle = good; tripping or spiking someone's shin = bad.
The thing is, you have been cheering hitting 'nazis' with eggs from the beginning of this thread, but pooh-poohing punches. I am arguing that there is no important difference. Dickless Spencer wasn't even bruised with the pop he got. I laughed like hell. Replayed the video set to Hollaback Girl. But it is not okay, as you do, to endorse egg-pelting as fine and dandy. Just like I won't endorse blindside punching on the street, much as I would like to.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:12 PM   #122
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This is an interesting take on this kind of protest.
that lad throwing a milkshake over tommy robinson has done exponentially more to 'challenge his views' than the procession of bbc presenters getting him on prime time telly and going "hmm, that's interesting robinson, what makes you say that? please elaborate further"
https://twitter.com/tristandross/sta...479042568?s=21
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:16 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
How do you feel about the Tommy Robinson milkshakes?
Pretty much the same. Funny in hindsight. Not something we can endorse. Would have respected milkshake tosser if he didn't try to run away immediately. You start it, you finish it.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:20 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
The thing is, you have been cheering hitting 'nazis' with eggs from the beginning of this thread, but pooh-poohing punches. I am arguing that there is no important difference. Dickless Spencer wasn't even bruised with the pop he got. I laughed like hell. Replayed the video set to Hollaback Girl. But it is not okay, as you do, to endorse egg-pelting as fine and dandy. Just like I won't endorse blindside punching on the street, much as I would like to.
Well, sorry you feel that way, but I don't share your opinion. I think you're wrong, but I don't think you're a bad person or being dishonest on account of disagreeing with me, because this kind of thing is a subjective judgment call and people will make different calls. I think a punch has vastly more and far easier potential to result in pain or injury than an egging. I think someone can responsibly approach an egging and quite handily realize a goal of no pain and injury; whereas with a punch, pain is the entire point. I believe this fact alone makes a substantial enough difference between the two that I have to object to being labeled "dishonest" for saying so.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:22 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
This is an interesting take on this kind of protest.
that lad throwing a milkshake over tommy robinson has done exponentially more to 'challenge his views' than the procession of bbc presenters getting him on prime time telly and going "hmm, that's interesting robinson, what makes you say that? please elaborate further"
https://twitter.com/tristandross/sta...479042568?s=21
Agreed, it's a waste of time to try to debate these clowns. but any kind of assault goes uncontrolled fast, so it's not something we should be championing. some posters here have a fantasy of a little egg cracking, the nazi slumping his shoulders with that 'wah...wah...waaaaaahhhh' music playing, and a good laugh is had by all. These vids show the egg recipients squaring off. And that's more likely- an escalation started by an eggy edgelord. Not good stuff.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:24 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Pretty much the same. Funny in hindsight. Not something we can endorse. Would have respected milkshake tosser if he didn't try to run away immediately. You start it, you finish it.
Yeah, makes no difference whether he ran or not from a guy with assault convictions.

“You start it, you finish it.” Lol Yeah, even if I had grown up on the wrong side of the tracks, a street fightin man, I would hope to have abandoned that kind of machismo.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:29 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Agreed, it's a waste of time to try to debate these clowns. but any kind of assault goes uncontrolled fast, so it's not something we should be championing. some posters here have a fantasy of a little egg cracking, the nazi slumping his shoulders with that 'wah...wah...waaaaaahhhh' music playing, and a good laugh is had by all. These vids show the egg recipients squaring off. And that's more likely- an escalation started by an eggy edgelord. Not good stuff.
The risk you take when dealing with nasty and frequently unstable white supremacists. If you are doing it while the news cameras are rolling, as was the case with Fraser Anning, perhaps that is fair risk mitigation? I am all for risk mitigation in these cases while retaining the humiliation value.

ETA: Does the removal of the hard egg and associated risks make this acceptable, retaliation asside?
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:29 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Well, sorry you feel that way, but I don't share your opinion. I think you're wrong, but I don't think you're a bad person or being dishonest on account of disagreeing with me, because this kind of thing is a subjective judgment call and people will make different calls. I think a punch has vastly more and far easier potential to result in pain or injury than an egging. I think someone can responsibly approach an egging and quite handily realize a goal of no pain and injury; whereas with a punch, pain is the entire point. I believe this fact alone makes a substantial enough difference between the two that I have to object to being labeled "dishonest" for saying so.
Ok, fair enough. There is a qualitative difference in a punch that makes it exponentially more likely to be damaging than an egg. I think we can agree on that? Punch much less excusable than a non-intense egging.

The difference, though, is in degree. Endorsing assault, petty though it may be, is a dicey position to hold. I'll withdraw dishonest as a descriptor, though. The videos we've seen haven't ended with the eggs. They chased the attackers down. Endorsing the egging is endorsing what will likely follow, and that is where we have to part ways.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:33 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Ok, fair enough. There is a qualitative difference in a punch that makes it exponentially more likely to be damaging than an egg. I think we can agree on that? Punch much less excusable than a non-intense egging.

The difference, though, is in degree. Endorsing assault, petty though it may be, is a dicey position to hold. I'll withdraw dishonest as a descriptor, though. The videos we've seen haven't ended with the eggs. They chased the attackers down. Endorsing the egging is endorsing what will likely follow, and that is where we have to part ways.
Hahhahha Where is TheBigDog and his rule of so?
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:35 PM   #130
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Yeah, makes no difference whether he ran or not from a guy with assault convictions.

“You start it, you finish it.” Lol Yeah, even if I had grown up on the wrong side of the tracks, a street fightin man, I would hope to have abandoned that kind of machismo.
Not meant as swagger. Nobody likes a cut-and-runner. It's cowardly, by any standard. What I mean is that if you pick a fight, have your fight. Sucker punching and scurrying away is nothing but cowardice. Not that I'm picking fights one way or the other.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:36 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
I don't think laughing about what the fellow did in that video means it would be hypocritical of me to condemn someone for risking serious injury by forcefully pitching an egg into someone's eye-socket..


I wouldn't laugh at him, I'd egg him on!
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:38 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Hahhahha Where is TheBigDog and his rule of so?
You don't think (generic) you would be responsible for predictable consequences of your actions? You pick a fight, you might get a fight. Everyone in the videos seemed to. Except the guy with the eye injury who was walking with his daughter on his shoulders.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:42 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Not meant as swagger. Nobody likes a cut-and-runner. It's cowardly, by any standard. What I mean is that if you pick a fight, have your fight. Sucker punching and scurrying away is nothing but cowardice. Not that I'm picking fights one way or the other.
This too reads like country barroom masculinity.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:43 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
You don't think (generic) you would be responsible for predictable consequences of your actions? You pick a fight, you might get a fight. Everyone in the videos seemed to. Except the guy with the eye injury who was walking with his daughter on his shoulders.
Yes, eye injuries are no laughing matter. Better to use a milkshake, sans straw. Or if you gotta use an egg be real careful.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:44 PM   #135
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If for any reason you thought a hateful bigoted piece of trash should not have gotten harmlessly egged, please, please, place me on ignoring. I don't wish to ever speak with you or see anything else you have to say.

Thank you
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:46 PM   #136
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
The risk you take when dealing with nasty and frequently unstable white supremacists. If you are doing it while the news cameras are rolling, as was the case with Fraser Anning, perhaps that is fair risk mitigation? I am all for risk mitigation in these cases while retaining the humiliation value.

ETA: Does the removal of the hard egg and associated risks make this acceptable, retaliation asside?
Tricky to answer with a straight yes or no, but generally yes. Ridicule and humiliation are perfect approaches. These guys hate to be made fools of, as you said. The trick is to do it without stepping over the legal line and becoming the instigator. Also, a few more eggs and the nazi boys will be packing eggs or worse. Gets a little gray regarding who provoked that kind of escalation.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:52 PM   #137
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And once again we see the "skeptics" crying their crocodile tears because some nazi crapstain had an egg or a milkshake thrown at them for advocating genocide.

I hope you are proud of yourselves. Seriously, what is wrong with you people?
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:54 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Yes, eye injuries are no laughing matter. Better to use a milkshake, sans straw. Or if you gotta use an egg be real careful.
I'm liking the milkshake more. Pretty safe, still makes the point and he looks like a fool. Still, the inevitable escalation. That keeps me from supporting it wholeheartedly. It's the first physicality, however mild.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:58 PM   #139
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Hey guys, you remember how in the 1930's the jews sat down with the nazis and worked everything out through "civil debate"? And how well that went?

Yeah, me neither, because that didn't happen.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:59 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I'm liking the milkshake more. Pretty safe, still makes the point and he looks like a fool. Still, the inevitable escalation. That keeps me from supporting it wholeheartedly. It's the first physicality, however mild.
So milkshakes or eggs in cups and running away it is. I knew we could find common ground on this.

I still don’t mind eggs if used with due care.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:01 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
Hey guys, you remember how in the 1930's the jews sat down with the nazis and worked everything out through "civil debate"? And how well that went?

Yeah, me neither, because that didn't happen.
Read up. No one ITT has said a peep about civil debate. It's also not the 1930's anymore. Just an fyi brah.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:07 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
So milkshakes or eggs in cups and running away it is. I knew we could find common ground on this.

I still don’t mind eggs if used with due care.
I'm cool with eggs if we watch the eyes and face, then. Maybe pre-crack the shells? Safety Eggs! There's money there, somewhere.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:11 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
I'm cool with eggs if we watch the eyes and face, then. Maybe pre-crack the shells? Safety Eggs! There's money there, somewhere.
just soak them in vinegar.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:19 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Well yes, it is about how you were raised. That’s where we get out unexamined worldviews.

Now, in the highlighted we have some false equivalence getting snuck in. Lets walk that back to what we are talking about, which is egging.
All the egging vids were essentially sucker punching...er, sucker egging. Blindsided. Which is okay in context I guess. No need to slap a glove to the face.

I guess what ultimately worries me is: what happens when the first young guy who thinks these egg vids are super cool tries it on the wrong guy. We can all see how bad that could go. So should we be cheering it now, or saying 'yeah, it was funny, but come on, guys'?
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:27 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Thermal, you said it in a previous post - rationalizing. This thread is a perfect example of it.

Man injured by egging is "grateful" egg didn't hit daughter


https://ktvl.com/news/local/man-inju...t-hit-daughter
Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Well, that didn't take long, did it? Couple eggs on tv and here we are already. I wonder how our brave eggers are feeling about their newyuck-yuck non-violent protesting technique?
How does one do a Reverse Slippery Slope? (You do realize that the egg incident is a year and a half before the NYC incident, right?) I'm sure those dastardly 2017 eggers were inspired by the 2019 nazi pelters.

Egging has been going on for decades, if not centuries. That doesn't excuse it, necessarily, but playing the slippery slope fallacy is right up there with homos leading to bestiality, marijuana leading to heroin and lettin' darkies in the school and pretty soon they'll be wantin' to marry your sister.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:30 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
All the egging vids were essentially sucker punching...er, sucker egging. Blindsided. Which is okay in context I guess. No need to slap a glove to the face.
Yes, the element of surprise is necessary. Lets not keep dressing it up in this street conflict or honour defence language however.

Quote:
I guess what ultimately worries me is: what happens when the first young guy who thinks these egg vids are super cool tries it on the wrong guy. We can all see how bad that could go. So should we be cheering it now, or saying 'yeah, it was funny, but come on, guys'?
By nature of the protest you will be dealing with “the wrong guy.” Dont pretty much all of these things end up in the target and their thug mates getting some kicks and punches in? Was the case with Fraser Anning. Seems self evident. But if we are now just at the point where sincere concern is focused on the well being of safety conscious eggers then we have arrived at a nice place.

On that note though:
'Egg boy' and Fraser Anning: Man who allegedly kicked teen charged with assault
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...scapes-charges
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:35 PM   #147
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
LOL. I mean it as a responsibility thing. Own what you do and accept the consequences. A blindside pop and fleeing just doesn't feel right to me. I don't recommend taking swings at anybody, ever. But if you do, make it a fair fight.
A punch in exchange for an egg may be a predictable reaction from someone like a neo-nazi; but that doesn't make it a case of "an eye for an eye". You don't automatically owe someone a fight just because they've decided something you said is fightin' words.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:44 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Yes, the element of surprise is necessary. Lets not keep dressing it up in this street conflict or honour defence language however.



By nature of the protest you will be dealing with “the wrong guy.” Dont pretty much all of these things end up in the target and their thug mates getting some kicks and punches in? Was the case with Fraser Anning. Seems self evident. But if we are now just at the point where sincere concern is focused on the well being of safety conscious eggers then we have arrived at a nice place.
To quote wisdom of the ages: 'Don't start none, won't be none'.

Quote:
On that note though:
'Egg boy' and Fraser Anning: Man who allegedly kicked teen charged with assault
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...scapes-charges
And from that article:

Quote:
“The 17-year-old Hampton boy has been issued with an official caution in relation to the incident,” police said.

“On assessment of all the circumstances, the 69-year-old’s actions were treated as self-defence and there was no reasonable prospect of conviction,” the force said.
That's the thing. We are treating it as a harmless prank. It's not. It can get a brother in some very serious ****.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:47 PM   #149
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
How does one do a Reverse Slippery Slope? (You do realize that the egg incident is a year and a half before the NYC incident, right?) I'm sure those dastardly 2017 eggers were inspired by the 2019 nazi pelters.

Egging has been going on for decades, if not centuries. That doesn't excuse it, necessarily, but playing the slippery slope fallacy is right up there with homos leading to bestiality, marijuana leading to heroin and lettin' darkies in the school and pretty soon they'll be wantin' to marry your sister.
But it's gaining popularity lately. No one is checking the video date of submission. People see the yuk value, and ape it for their own vid, and if they choose their targets poorly, there is a whole 'nuther kind of news story headlining. Not the kind of thing we should be cheering.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:49 PM   #150
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
A punch in exchange for an egg may be a predictable reaction from someone like a neo-nazi; but that doesn't make it a case of "an eye for an eye". You don't automatically owe someone a fight just because they've decided something you said is fightin' words.
It's not owed, of course. But it's damn sure predictable.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:51 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
To quote wisdom of the ages: 'Don't start none, won't be none'.
Cant argue with inherited wisdom, can we. Sarcasm by the way.



Quote:
And from that article:



That's the thing. We are treating it as a harmless prank. It's not. It can get a brother in some very serious ****.
Yes, as long as the hand wringing stays shifted over to the well being of the egger, we are good. The Nazis can run the gauntlet of the law if they choose to respond with disproportionate force.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:52 PM   #152
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The law should not apply to nazis. We finished that "debate" in 1945, and they lost.

It should be open season on these swine.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:53 PM   #153
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Cant argue with inherited wisdom, can we. Sarcasm by the way.





Yes, as long as the hand wringing stays shifted over to the well being of the egger, we are good. The Nazis can run the gauntlet of the law if they choose to respond with disproportionate force.
Not at all. Hold everyone to the same standard. Maybe the legal one, for instance.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:54 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
The law should not apply to nazis. We finished that "debate" in 1945, and they lost.
Yes. And they have been gone for over a half century. We have different critters now.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:54 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
But it's gaining popularity lately. No one is checking the video date of submission. People see the yuk value, and ape it for their own vid, and if they choose their targets poorly, there is a whole 'nuther kind of news story headlining. Not the kind of thing we should be cheering.
Only because things could escalate and naive eggers necessarily get drawn into a manly conflict.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:59 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Yes. And they have been gone for over a half century. We have different critters now.
In what relevant ways are they different?
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:00 PM   #157
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Since it was mentioned earlier, the simulated-egg-cracking game was bugging me.

This seems to be the same, or nearly the same, as the "weird chanting game" I remembered. I am surprised to find out this is still a thing; and I also did not recall that the alleged purpose of the game was to "predict how you will die".

Kids are into some bizarre stuff.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:01 PM   #158
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Only because things could escalate and naive eggers necessarily get drawn into a manly conflict.
I'm essentially lobbying pacifism, here. Trying to work out how I'm the unreasonable one.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:03 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
In what relevant ways are they different?
Yeah, pulling the "there are no real nazis anymore" card is just... Eh...

You can't kill an idea, National Socialism is still a thing.

An idea that needs to be stomped into the ground wherever it pops up.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:03 PM   #160
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Since it was mentioned earlier, the simulated-egg-cracking game was bugging me.

This seems to be the same, or nearly the same, as the "weird chanting game" I remembered. I am surprised to find out this is still a thing; and I also did not recall that the alleged purpose of the game was to "predict how you will die".

Kids are into some bizarre stuff.
****, that was it! I don't remember so many verses, but that was the gist
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