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Tags Ahmaud Arbery , Georgia incidents , Gregory McMichael , prosecutorial misconduct , racism charges , racism incidents , shooting incidents , Travis McMichael , William Bryan

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Old 6th May 2020, 09:29 PM   #121
Thermal
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Originally Posted by whoanellie View Post
d

https://www.fox23.com/news/trending/...AXW6DAYVRW6EQ/

The person in the car filming the video was allied with the two men in the pickup. Likely Arbery knew that.
Why...uhh...would he have known that? If he was just going out for a jog, and one truck was around the corner ahead of him, and the other car pulling up from 50 yards behind him...umm, why would he have 'known' they were allies?

Quote:
Does he turn around to look at the car while running? (I can't actually even find a clean version of the video today). Arbery couldn't turn around and run the other way. The two men in the pickup had stopped because they knew Arbery was being driven towards them. I don't know if it's possible he could have run off the road but if it isn't safe for him to jog on the public road does anyone really think he should have gone onto private property.
Yeah...umm...that 911 call? It was reporting Arbery on someone else's private property, that the caller said was an 'ongoing thing'.

Plus if your life is in danger, cutting across someone's grass is probably a worthwhile risk. You disagree?

Good catch on the article though. Lot of new information.
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Old 6th May 2020, 09:33 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
And the runner failed to avoid contact in that situation.
Not only did Arbery avoid contact with McMichael, he intentionally participated in it.

Before he goes out of the camera's frame, Arbery is moving to the right side of the truck. When he comes back into frame, his rearmost foot is approximately 4 feet away from the right edge of the road on the grass. As the camera pans back to the left, McMichael's rearmost foot is on the yellow line in the center of the road. That leaves a fairly significant gap between the two.

Instead of continuing on straight, or turning right into the open yard, he cuts back across the road and the front of the truck to engage McMichael.
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Old 6th May 2020, 09:40 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
Just to repeat, we have the suggestion that an unarmed black person out for a jog who gets chased by white guys with shotguns in a pickup deserves to get shot if he doesn't surrender to them.
That's awful! Who said such a horrible thing?

*scans thread*

Hm. Nobody said such a thing. Closest I can find is when you asked me:

Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
As skeptics, shouldn't we be asking "What did he do to deserve being shot?"
And I responded:

Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Absolutely. And I would say nothing to deserve it.
I would also opine that if you see a truck barracading a road with armed hillbillies in Georgia...

Don't run down the street towards them unarmed and attack them with your bare hands. Something predictably bad might happen.
Nothing to deserve a horribly unjust thing happening. But it might happen anyway. Especially if you run straight into them and try to wrestle a shotgun from one.

Oh, and you say the 911 caller was lying, I assume? Arbery was just out jogging, he wasn't in the empty house, and it wasn't an 'ongoing thing'? How do you know he was lying to 911 dispatch?

Does the lying about other posters bother you at all? Seems like it should.
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Old 6th May 2020, 09:40 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
Not sure what Christian Bale has to do with anything. Does he trespass on property and in houses that does not belong to him on his afternoon jogs, as well?
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Old 6th May 2020, 09:57 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Not sure what Christian Bale has to do with anything. Does he trespass on property and in houses that does not belong to him on his afternoon jogs, as well?
Murders people and gets away with it?
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Old 6th May 2020, 09:59 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
That's awful! Who said such a horrible thing?

*scans thread*

Hm. Nobody said such a thing. Closest I can find is when you asked me:



And I responded:



Nothing to deserve a horribly unjust thing happening. But it might happen anyway. Especially if you run straight into them and try to wrestle a shotgun from one.

Oh, and you say the 911 caller was lying, I assume? Arbery was just out jogging, he wasn't in the empty house, and it wasn't an 'ongoing thing'? How do you know he was lying to 911 dispatch?

Does the lying about other posters bother you at all? Seems like it should.
Was the 911 call made by one of the shooters?

I ask because the initial report said the shooter said he thought Arbery looked like a suspect in a surveillance video - not that he was. Is it established that Arbery had actually done anything unusual or wrong? People do occasionally step off and look inside a house under construction, just out of curiosity, but is it even established that he is the one who did that?

A lot of the speculation here is with the presumption that Arbery knew what was going on.

Of course many things are possible, but it often seems in cases like this that people fail to take into account how a person who is actually innocent will react. It's normal enough to be be offended, indignant, even obscene, when confronted with false accusation and inappropriate behavior, but it often seems that when black people react the same way, dire consequences are ascribed to their bad attitude.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:02 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Not sure what Christian Bale has to do with anything. Does he trespass on property and in houses that does not belong to him on his afternoon jogs, as well?
If this story was about trespassing, it wouldn't even be a thread.

1)It isn't,

2)No one is buying your ******** shifting of goalposts.

Being willfully obtuse might entertain you, but it isn't fooling anyone familiar with your antics.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:13 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Plus if your life is in danger, cutting across someone's grass is probably a worthwhile risk. You disagree?
If it requires you to turn your back on the man with the shotgun, it could be a poor decision.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:28 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Was the 911 call made by one of the shooters?

I ask because the initial report said the shooter said he thought Arbery looked like a suspect in a surveillance video - not that he was. Is it established that Arbery had actually done anything unusual or wrong? People do occasionally step off and look inside a house under construction, just out of curiosity, but is it even established that he is the one who did that?
Agreed, all possible. Little tiny bit conspiratorial, but certainly possible.

Quote:
A lot of the speculation here is with the presumption that Arbery knew what was going on.

Of course many things are possible, but it often seems in cases like this that people fail to take into account how a person who is actually innocent will react. It's normal enough to be be offended, indignant, even obscene, when confronted with false accusation and inappropriate behavior, but it often seems that when black people react the same way, dire consequences are ascribed to their bad attitude.
Very true. I can see going out for a run and checking out a cool open house under construction. Wouldn't think twice about it.

I just watched the video again. Arbery is running straight into shotgun boy, and veers last minute to get behind the truck, and turns again without any hesitation to grab the gun. He knew what he was doing. Pretty damned ballsy, too. I likely would have been heading for cover of the trees on either side, and putting some acreage between me and the boomstick.

I can't blame him for confronting the rednecks straight on. But I've known way too many genuinely crazy armed hillbillies to charge a truckfull of them empty handed. While brazen, 'twas not with an eye for self-preservation. It's not the movies, we are not bulletproof, and the good guys don't always ride off into the sunset. Sometimes the bad guys kill you and waltz away.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:31 PM   #130
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
If it requires you to turn your back on the man with the shotgun, it could be a poor decision.
Quite true. At a choice between beating feet through the cover of the flanking properties, versus actually running up and grabbing the gun, with his buddies at the ready...I'm going with my fast-moving discretion on that day.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:33 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Not only did Arbery avoid contact with McMichael, he intentionally participated in it.

Before he goes out of the camera's frame, Arbery is moving to the right side of the truck. When he comes back into frame, his rearmost foot is approximately 4 feet away from the right edge of the road on the grass. As the camera pans back to the left, McMichael's rearmost foot is on the yellow line in the center of the road. That leaves a fairly significant gap between the two.

Instead of continuing on straight, or turning right into the open yard, he cuts back across the road and the front of the truck to engage McMichael.
Well, yes. When threatened, there's the well known "fight or flight" response. It's not so much a choice as a reaction. He picked "fight". That didn't turn out so well, but we'll never know how "flight" would have turned out. You can't outrun a bullet.


But that doesn't really matter in terms of the legalities. He had to make that choice because someone used a gun to threaten him. That's a crime.
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Old 6th May 2020, 10:45 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
Well, yes. When threatened, there's the well known "fight or flight" response. It's not so much a choice as a reaction. He picked "fight". That didn't turn out so well, but we'll never know how "flight" would have turned out. You can't outrun a bullet.
Going out on a limb: maybe no worse than the outcome chosen? No?


Quote:
But that doesn't really matter in terms of the legalities. He had to make that choice because someone used a gun to threaten him. That's a crime.
I would think so. But the State of Georgia seems to allow it. Open carry laws, and the guys were legal. Hard to see on the video, but it looks like shotgun boy is holding level and perpendicular to Arbery when he runs up to the truck. The first time the gun points in Arbery's direction is when they meet at the front of the truck, when it was go time for both of them.
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:02 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by TheGoldcountry View Post
If this story was about trespassing, it wouldn't even be a thread.
See, you could not be more mistaken. This story has everything to do with trespassing.

Arbery's trespassing on the day of, and trespassing previously on video, led to two individuals independently identifying him as the trespasser previously caught on video. If he would have chose not to trespass, he could have continued his routine jog through the neighborhood like he had been doing for years, according to his mother and neighbors, but he didn't. His trespassing precipitated a confrontation and now he's dead because of it.
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:07 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
See, you could not be more mistaken. This story has everything to do with trespassing.

Arbery's trespassing on the day of, and trespassing previously on video, led to two individuals independently identifying him as the trespasser previously caught on video. If he would have chose not to trespass, he could have continued his routine jog through the neighborhood like he had been doing for years, according to his mother and neighbors, but he didn't. His trespassing precipitated a confrontation and now he's dead because of it.
In your take some good old boys get to play cop, judge and executioner. You live in a banana republic so why not?
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:37 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
In your take some good old boys get to play cop, judge and executioner. You live in a banana republic so why not?
Yup.

The punishment is death for any black person committing any transgression above failing to address whitey as "Yezz Mazzah"!
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:37 PM   #136
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
Well, yes. When threatened, there's the well known "fight or flight" response. It's not so much a choice as a reaction. He picked "fight". That didn't turn out so well, but we'll never know how "flight" would have turned out. You can't outrun a bullet.


But that doesn't really matter in terms of the legalities. He had to make that choice because someone used a gun to threaten him. That's a crime.

Apparently he did try flight the first time.
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:39 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Yup.

The punishment is death for any black person committing any transgression above failing to address whitey as "Yezz Mazzah"!

Don’t be ridiculous, he could have said Yezz Mazzah in a sarcastic manner causing emotional harm to his murderer!
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Old 6th May 2020, 11:45 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
See, you could not be more mistaken. This story has everything to do with trespassing.

Arbery's trespassing on the day of, and trespassing previously on video, led to two individuals independently identifying him as the trespasser previously caught on video. If he would have chose not to trespass, he could have continued his routine jog through the neighborhood like he had been doing for years, according to his mother and neighbors, but he didn't. His trespassing precipitated a confrontation and now he's dead because of it.
Let's have some fun here..

Lets assume that the person seen on the camera was indeed Arbery. Is there anything illegal about being on a building site that isn't yours?

Let's check Georgia Law.....

Quote:
Georgia Code Title 16. Crimes and Offenses § 16-7-21

(a) A person commits the offense of criminal trespass when he or she intentionally damages any property of another without consent of that other person and the damage thereto is $500.00 or less or knowingly and maliciously interferes with the possession or use of the property of another person without consent of that person.

(b) A person commits the offense of criminal trespass when he or she knowingly and without authority:

(1) Enters upon the land or premises of another person or into any part of any vehicle, railroad car, aircraft, or watercraft of another person for an unlawful purpose;

(2) Enters upon the land or premises of another person or into any part of any vehicle, railroad car, aircraft, or watercraft of another person after receiving, prior to such entry, notice from the owner, rightful occupant, or, upon proper identification, an authorized representative of the owner or rightful occupant that such entry is forbidden; or

(3) Remains upon the land or premises of another person or within the vehicle, railroad car, aircraft, or watercraft of another person after receiving notice from the owner, rightful occupant, or, upon proper identification, an authorized representative of the owner or rightful occupant to depart.

(c) For the purposes of subsection (b) of this Code section, permission to enter or invitation to enter given by a minor who is or is not present on or in the property of the minor's parent or guardian is not sufficient to allow lawful entry of another person upon the land, premises, vehicle, railroad car, aircraft, or watercraft owned or rightfully occupied by such minor's parent or guardian if such parent or guardian has previously given notice that such entry is forbidden or notice to depart.

(d) A person who commits the offense of criminal trespass shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

(e) A person commits the offense of criminal trespass when he or she intentionally defaces, mutilates, or defiles any grave marker, monument, or memorial to one or more deceased persons who served in the military service of this state, the United States of America or any of the states thereof, or the Confederate States of America or any of the states thereof, or a monument, plaque, marker, or memorial which is dedicated to, honors, or recounts the military service of any past or present military personnel of this state, the United States of America or any of the states thereof, or the Confederate States of America or any of the states thereof if such grave marker, monument, memorial, plaque, or marker is privately owned or located on land which is privately owned.
So... There is no reports of damage being done to the site, so that rules out (a) and (e).

(b) (2) he didn't have a vehicle (3) there is no evidence that the rightful owner told him to leave.

So that leaves (b) (1), and there is no evidence that he was at the building site for an unlawful purpose, so by Georgia Law, no Trespass was committed.

But let's say that he did have an unlawful purpose and thus did commit criminal trespass. (d) stats that such is a misdemeanor.

Now let's look at Citizens Arrest in Georgia Law.

Quote:
Georgia Code Title 17. Criminal Procedure § 17-4-60

A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.
Hmmm, spot the problem here. For a citizen's arrest to be made based on suspicion of the person having committed a crime, then the suspect must both being trying to escape, and the offence must be a Felony. Criminal Trespass, which we have already determined didn't happen, is a misdemeanor not a Felony. Thus there is no right to enact a citizen's arrest based on the suspicion that this was the same person as seen in the video. In fact those doing so were in danger of breaking this law....

Quote:
Georgia Code Title 16. Crimes and Offenses § 16-5-41

(a) A person commits the offense of false imprisonment when, in violation of the personal liberty of another, he arrests, confines, or detains such person without legal authority.

(b) A person convicted of the offense of false imprisonment shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor more than ten years.

(c) Any person convicted under this Code section wherein the victim is not the child of the defendant and the victim is less than 14 years of age shall, in addition, be subject to the sentencing and punishment provisions of Code Section 17-10-6.2 .
because it is quite clear that they had no legal authority because even if he was the man on the security footage, there is no evidence of a law being broken by his mere presence on the building site, and all they had to go on was their suspicions of it being the same person, which is not enough to enact a Citizen's Arrest for a non Felony, such as Criminal Trespass.
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:13 AM   #139
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In what jurisdiction is the death penalty appropriate for trespassing anyway?

This was vigilantism, pure and simple.
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:21 AM   #140
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
In what jurisdiction is the death penalty appropriate for trespassing anyway?

This was vigilantism, pure and simple.
But property theft? You gotta be able to shoot some ****** running off with your TV, right?
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:23 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by Sideroxylon View Post
But property theft? You gotta be able to shoot some ****** running off with your TV, right?
Well, for a start you know me and my thoughts about guns for self defence. But did that happen? I thought the man was just poking about an unfinished house. He didn't actually take anything. Did I miss something?
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:27 AM   #142
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I don't understand. Can people in parts of the USA actually walk around and/or accost people with a loaded shotgun in their hands like they're in Mad Max or something? I'd assume this to be a pretty serious crime even without the killing, but I guess I'm wrong?
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:31 AM   #143
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Well, for a start you know me and my thoughts about guns for self defence. But did that happen? I thought the man was just poking about an unfinished house. He didn't actually take anything. Did I miss something?
Allegedly at the unfinished house. Unconfirmed 911 calls mean next to nothing, but “the only good ****** is a dead ******” crowd will latch on to anything.
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:35 AM   #144
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Originally Posted by Olmstead View Post
I don't understand. Can people in parts of the USA actually walk around and/or accost people with a loaded shotgun in their hands like they're in Mad Max or something? I'd assume this to be a pretty serious crime even without the killing, but I guess I'm wrong?
Apparently, in some parts of the USA, yes. Don't try doing it in Times Square or Hollywood Boulevard though.
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Old 7th May 2020, 12:52 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Apparently, in some parts of the USA, yes. Don't try doing it in Times Square or Hollywood Boulevard though.
Legally though? Does anyone of the locals bat an eye? This feels so bizzare to me. If I travelled to the US (Georgia for example) and saw someone with a gun in their hand, my first thought would be that a mass shooting is imminent and that I need to get the hell out of there.
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Old 7th May 2020, 01:40 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
See, you could not be more mistaken. This story has everything to do with trespassing.



Arbery's trespassing on the day of, and trespassing previously on video, led to two individuals independently identifying him as the trespasser previously caught on video. If he would have chose not to trespass, he could have continued his routine jog through the neighborhood like he had been doing for years, according to his mother and neighbors, but he didn't. His trespassing precipitated a confrontation and now he's dead because of it.
There's no evidence that Arbery or any other person trespassed on the day af the shooting.
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Old 7th May 2020, 02:42 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Going out on a limb: maybe no worse than the outcome chosen? No?
He didn't know what the outcome would be. Faced with a split second decision between fight and flight, he chose the former. It may not have worked out for him, but the latter may not have worked out any better.




Quote:
I would think so. But the State of Georgia seems to allow it. Open carry laws, and the guys were legal. Hard to see on the video, but it looks like shotgun boy is holding level and perpendicular to Arbery when he runs up to the truck. The first time the gun points in Arbery's direction is when they meet at the front of the truck, when it was go time for both of them.
They may be allowed to have the guns, but that doesn't mean that it's not a crime to threaten him with them.
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Old 7th May 2020, 02:50 AM   #148
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
I don't say it doesn't happen, and I suppose I'd better not say it isn't protected. I am presuming here sniping before the victim has been given any warning that there's anything happening. If that is protected, it sure shouldn't be.
Kill black gun owners open carrying legally for following orders to put their weapon on the ground is legal why would a little sniping be such a bad thing?

You have a very inaccurate bar of what it takes to get a police officer in trouble for killing someone.
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Old 7th May 2020, 02:54 AM   #149
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Try reading harder. The hillbillies confronted him twice. The first time he ran away. The second time he charged them. They were parked. He ran up to them and attacked.

Would you do that? I wouldn't. Confronted witb armed nutjobs, and being unarmed, I would be cutting across some lawns to get away from them. As fast as I could.

So you advocate charging at armed crazies? Do tell.
So you are against stand your ground laws and for mandating retreat at all times, at least for blacks. Only whites can stand their ground.
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Old 7th May 2020, 03:39 AM   #150
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Seems no different than when George Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin for being black, and outside.

ETA: as we've seen, some people here are okay with armed white supremacists storming into state houses, but a black guy walking home from the store should be shot dead.

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Old 7th May 2020, 03:47 AM   #151
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Seems no different than when George Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin for being black, and outside.

ETA: as we've seen, some people here are okay with armed white supremacists storming into state houses, but a black guy walking home from the store should be shot dead.
I expect we'll soon hear stories about how Arbery was no angel (angle, if Trump tweets about it).
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Old 7th May 2020, 04:00 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Why is someone supposed to make a citizens arrest in the absence of a crime?

Could an actual cop have arrested Arbery for anything?

No crime = no cause for arrest, citizen or LEO. The rednecks waved their guns around. Arbery took a run at shotgun boy. This was not ending well in any scenario.
Yep. It's the black guy's fault, no matter what.

Thanks for supplying the white supremacist argument for murder.
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Old 7th May 2020, 04:03 AM   #153
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I expect we'll soon hear stories about how Arbery was no angel (angle, if Trump tweets about it).
"Oh noes, here's a picture of him with his middle fingers raised! Thus, he must have been a violent thug that attacked these two innocent white guys, please ignore the recording of him trying to escape! He must have run away, and then ran back and punched them in the face from behind!"
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Old 7th May 2020, 04:09 AM   #154
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Originally Posted by whoanellie View Post
There's no evidence that Arbery or any other person trespassed on the day af the shooting.
Look at who you are replying to!

The only evidence he needs is that the victim was black.
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Old 7th May 2020, 04:20 AM   #155
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Look at who you are replying to!

The only evidence he needs is that the victim was black.
I know, but I just wanted to put it on the record.
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Old 7th May 2020, 04:20 AM   #156
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
Agreed, all possible. Little tiny bit conspiratorial, but certainly possible.



Very true. I can see going out for a run and checking out a cool open house under construction. Wouldn't think twice about it.

I just watched the video again. Arbery is running straight into shotgun boy, and veers last minute to get behind the truck, and turns again without any hesitation to grab the gun. He knew what he was doing. Pretty damned ballsy, too. I likely would have been heading for cover of the trees on either side, and putting some acreage between me and the boomstick.

I can't blame him for confronting the rednecks straight on. But I've known way too many genuinely crazy armed hillbillies to charge a truckfull of them empty handed. While brazen, 'twas not with an eye for self-preservation. It's not the movies, we are not bulletproof, and the good guys don't always ride off into the sunset. Sometimes the bad guys kill you and waltz away.
Whether or not charging the armed man was a wise tactical move is largely irrelevant to the moral or legal question of the matter.

Our two vigilantes have a very narrow needle to thread to make all this lawful. Otherwise it's just two armed men brandishing firearms and attempting an unlawful arrest.


If Arbery is being met with unlawful brandishing, he is in mortal danger, and he has the full weight of the law to defend himself without attempting to flee. The fact that it didn't work out well for him doesn't change that it was his right to try.

I could easily see why someone would charge rather than risk being shot in the back by two men at close range. It's a dire situation where no good solution exists, except perhaps in hindsight. How was Arbery supposed to know these guys were LARPing as law enforcement and didn't have strictly sinister motives?

If a mugger sticks a gun in your face, the smart thing to do is to hand over your wallet. Grabbing the gun and fighting the mugger is still your legal right, and if the mugger blasts you during the struggle it's still murder.

The crux of this case is whether it was lawful for the two men to brandish firearms in an attempt to arrest Arbery. If it wasn't, Arbery had every right to defend himself, and the two men were armed aggressors who committed murder (and felony murder accomplices). The DA appears to be granting a very generous interpretation of the citizen arrest statute to paper over a daylight killing, hence the outrage.
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Old 7th May 2020, 05:08 AM   #157
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Originally Posted by Olmstead View Post
Legally though? Does anyone of the locals bat an eye? This feels so bizzare to me. If I travelled to the US (Georgia for example) and saw someone with a gun in their hand, my first thought would be that a mass shooting is imminent and that I need to get the hell out of there.
To answer your question, ...

Most of the states in the United States have provisions in the law for what is called 'open carry of firearms'.

In short, provided that one is openly carrying a firearm in public and that the person in question is not trying to conceal the firearm (the codes spell out what actually defines an open carry), then provided that the person in question is:

not a criminal,
not a person with a prior criminal record,
not a person who is engaged in some sort of illegal activity,
not in on a municipal property of some sort,
and so on.

Then that person has a legal right to openly carry a firearm.

I hope this helps.
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Old 7th May 2020, 05:14 AM   #158
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Originally Posted by Crossbow View Post
To answer your question, ...

Most of the states in the United States have provisions in the law for what is called 'open carry of firearms'.

In short, provided that one is openly carrying a firearm in public and that the person in question is not trying to conceal the firearm (the codes spell out what actually defines an open carry), then provided that the person in question is:

not a criminal,
not a person with a prior criminal record,
not a person who is engaged in some sort of illegal activity,
not in on a municipal property of some sort,
and so on.

Then that person has a legal right to openly carry a firearm.

I hope this helps.
Seems municpial properties aren't excempt everywhere.
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Old 7th May 2020, 05:20 AM   #159
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Seems no different than when George Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin for being black, and outside.

ETA: as we've seen, some people here are okay with armed white supremacists storming into state houses, but a black guy walking home from the store should be shot dead.
Big, big difference.


Video.
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Old 7th May 2020, 05:29 AM   #160
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Big, big difference.


Video.
Indeed.

The killing occurred in February. I first read about it a couple weeks ago. The video didn't come out until just recently, and now it's headline news.

These people killed the only other witness who might challenge their story. If it wasn't for the video, they would be in the clear.
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