FBI Warns of Right-Wing Mass Destruction Terrorism

ChristianProgressive · 1st October 2020, 01:40 PM

https://www.thenation.com/article/po...cist-boogaloo/

From the memo:

Quote:

“significant increase of violent social media posts of several boogaloo adherents in Texas which … indicate a propensity toward violence and acquiring weapons that cause mass casualties, used by a small number of attackers.”

and they may have police help in pulling them off.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...macists-police

If you're liberal and aren't armed, you need to make friends with ones who are.

Norman Alexander · 1st October 2020, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

https://www.thenation.com/article/po...cist-boogaloo/

From the memo:

and they may have police help in pulling them off.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...macists-police

If you're liberal and aren't armed, you need to make friends with ones who are.

Sure! Because adding more guns to a gun problem is guaranteed to make it better.

Bob001 · 1st October 2020, 01:49 PM

Quote:

A Pro-Trump Militant Group Has Recruited Thousands of Police, Soldiers, and Veterans

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...il-war/616473/

ChristianProgressive · 1st October 2020, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Sure! Because adding more guns to a gun problem is guaranteed to make it better.

"If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus

No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation.

The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't.

Stacyhs · 1st October 2020, 02:05 PM

Just what we need: more testosterone fueled guys who think they're heroes with guns and God on their side who get their training from playing video games and acting like a bunch of beer swilling, camouflage wearing, flag waving idiots on weekends.

ChristianProgressive · 1st October 2020, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Just what we need: more testosterone fueled guys who think they're heroes with guns and God on their side

You mean like the Founding Fathers? Like the Union Army under Lincoln? The WW II generation?

Stacyhs · 1st October 2020, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

You mean like the Founding Fathers? Like the Union Army under Lincoln? The WW II generation?

I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing, or states seceding and attacking our military, then we'll talk. Until then, you're just fomenting violence and behaving no differently than the Proud Boys. Same mentality. Get a grip.

varwoche · 1st October 2020, 11:23 PM

CP -- I urge you to put aside your fantasies for one short month, and channel your energy into getting out the vote. You could write postcards -- crowd source meets pandemic.

uke2se · 2nd October 2020, 12:17 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing, or states seceding and attacking our military, then we'll talk. Until then, you're just fomenting violence and behaving no differently than the Proud Boys. Same mentality. Get a grip.

Sounds like it would be a bit late to talk by then.

Stacyhs · 2nd October 2020, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by uke2se

Sounds like it would be a bit late to talk by then.

Cuz it ain't happening. It's just more scare mongering by Imma gonna git me a gun and hunker down cuz theyz cummin fer us crap.

ChristianProgressive · 2nd October 2020, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing,.

we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors.

ChristianProgressive · 2nd October 2020, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by varwoche

CP -- I urge you to put aside your fantasies for one short month, and channel your energy into getting out the vote. You could write postcards -- crowd source meets pandemic.

You assume our electoral process is secure. It isn't and hasn't been since 2000. As long as Republicans count the elections and control the voting machines, they will throw any close election to their guy.

Joe Random · 2nd October 2020, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors.

The pills actually help if you take them.

cullennz · 2nd October 2020, 07:01 PM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

"If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus

No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation.

The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't.

Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this?

chrispy · 2nd October 2020, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by cullennz

Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this?

*sigh* My brother.

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 12:32 AM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors.

So your suggestion is for us to buy guns, form our own little armies and attack ICE, CBP, DHS, the prisons, etc? Do I have that right? I just want to make sure I'm not misunderstanding you.

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by cullennz

Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this?

Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters.

Mumbles · 3rd October 2020, 01:36 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters.

Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them.

But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts.

The Don · 3rd October 2020, 03:28 AM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

"If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus

No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation.

The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't.

They also weren't stopped by a well-armed but otherwise poorly organised and trained populace.

uke2se · 3rd October 2020, 04:35 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

They also weren't stopped by a well-armed but otherwise poorly organised and trained populace.

Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan?

dirtywick · 3rd October 2020, 04:54 AM

People who have these violent fantasy scenarios always imagine themselves as the hero who survives everything and everyone else is the victim.

Craig4 · 3rd October 2020, 05:23 AM

The smart play is when the election is called and it's a Biden victory, stay home. Don't go out to counter protest the Trumptrash. Trump will want to exploit the violence in the streets. That can't happen is no one shows up. Besides if Biden wins, what's to protest?

As to the gun thing, if you're in Portland, Oregon who could you possibly shoot that would have an impact on the transfer of power? What good does it do you? The transfer of power will happen in Washington DC and no amount of violence anywhere else will have an impact on that. So relax, the Police in Washington DC aren't the police in Kenosha. Have an armed, open carry protest here and your brains are will be wall art.

Finally, if I'm the voice of reason, there's a ******* problem here.

Craig4 · 3rd October 2020, 05:27 AM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation.

Bull-****. Lots of internal fascist aggressors have been stopped with application of the laws. You're not talking about an external fascist state attacking us, you're talking about an internal insurrection. Law enforcement stops those all the time. The fact that the FBI issued a report on the topic likely means that stopping these groups through enforcing the law is sort of what they have in mind.

Hlafordlaes · 3rd October 2020, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive

No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation.

Agreed. Appeasement does not work at all; rather, it is a big come-on.

Originally Posted by Craig4

Bull-****. Lots of internal fascist aggressors have been stopped with application of the laws. You're not talking about an external fascist state attacking us, you're talking about an internal insurrection. Law enforcement stops those all the time. The fact that the FBI issued a report on the topic likely means that stopping these groups through enforcing the law is sort of what they have in mind.

True as well, but this relies on internal law enforcement being uncompromised, and increasingly it seems local police are indeed so, as well as the effects of whatever erosion in the due diligence and credentials of the Justice Department/FBI/judicial system/SCOTUS that has taken place, i.e., everything Trump et al have been "fixing" full time, full swing, full bore, like good mobsters.

I do not, however, believe guns to be the solution. If there is a goon takeover, it will be game over in short order for the stock market and US ability to influence the world. Most likely short term outcome is a shift to a new world currency, or a basket thereof, as former allies beat a very hasty retreat, especially from the US-dominated international banking system. Yet oddly, and as is their custom, when those with the real money decide the goons they've been financing are a greater threat to their interests than would be a return to a tax-and-spend society, they will beat a partial retreat. The first to jump ship from the far-rightward push may be the wealthy Jewish supporters of today's GOP, who are beginning to see the big "oops" that partnering with fascists is (the Trump to "Cruz Missile" threat). High tech and advanced industry in this day and age need global markets, far more than they did last century, and will always push back enough to counter protectionism, so there's that as well.

When things are in the balance, it is the balance of powerful interests that will call the shots, barring insurrection. The latter is not worth it, I would argue, as the chain reaction from a Trump win/takeover will automatically align world events greatly against US interests and provoke an internal backlash of critical support for the rule of law. Or so one hopes.

Civil war, FWIW, would be far worse.

tanabear · 3rd October 2020, 12:21 PM

Well, it looks like some white supremacists got away with it again. Some white racist frat boys from Wisconsin attacked Althea Bernstein, a biracial woman, because they are all racist and stuff.

"A biracial Wisconsin woman who says a group of white men set her on fire while she was driving wants her attackers to know they hurt her but hopes they will improve themselves.

Althea Bernstein told ABC’s “Good Morning America” for a Friday segment that she hasn’t slept and doesn’t have an appetite. But she called the attack in the state’s capital city of Madison."

Even after Good Morning America and the Duchess of Sussex, Meghan Markle, bring attention to the attack those racist frat boys remain elusive. Is Haven Monahan still at large? Unfortunately, it looks like those racist frat boys will remain free to terrorize other biracial people.

Coincidentally, on the same night and almost at the same time, there was a mostly peaceful protest going on in Madison, Wisconsin. This mostly peaceful protest included fire-bombing a Madison government building. Now I'm sure an all-American girl like Althea Bernstein wouldn't have been involved in this mostly peaceful arson attack. You see she just happened to be near the event, she was not participating in the event.

"The firebombing was part of a larger Black Lives Matter protest in which protesters tore down two statues on the Capitol Square, including one of a Union Civil War soldier and abolitionist. The protest had started in response to the arrest hours before of a local Black Lives Matter activist now facing state and federal charges for allegedly trying to extort money from at least one Downtown business."

NO! Those statues of a Union soldier and an abolitionist were obviously torn down by the same racist confederates who attacked a biracial woman.

varwoche · 3rd October 2020, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by Hlafordlaes

I like to think that if Trump steals the election, so many people will passionately oppose that we will take to the street -- strategically and peacefully. We can shut down the country if there's enough of us.

Every major airport, seaport, rail line, and every city block that has a Trump property. No democracy, no commerce.

Unfortunately for the forces of fascism and theocracy, Trump has already made it completely impossible for the opposition to trust a Trump outcome. It would be funny, in a most demented way, if he were to win "legitimately". Scare quotes due to unknowability. A most uncomfortable future awaits you no matter the election outcome. Tough luck.

I hope it's not neccesary. We need to be patient and not freak out on Nov 4.

The_Animus · 3rd October 2020, 01:52 PM

If a peaceful resolution to all this is possible it's obviously preferred. I don't think anyone here actually wants violence. The difference is that some here feel that the belief that everything is just going to work out via non-violent means is naive. There have been a hundred times where people kept thinking this time, this thing, it will break the camels back and the Democrats or the FBI or whoever will finally stop the fascists' march to authoritarianism. How's that been working out?

If the trend of ICE/DHS/Border Patrol/Police/Right Wing Militias escalating violence and fascism continues (and why would you assume otherwise given what we've seen), then why isn't being prepared to counteract that, through force if needed, a prudent action?

What else do you expect to stop them when they decide to go full SS for Trump?

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters.

Originally Posted by Mumbles

Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them.

But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts.

True, those were around before Trump and they support Trump.

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by uke2se

Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan?

Fantasies of Red Dawn are just that: fantasies. This is the real world.

Captain_Swoop · 3rd October 2020, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by uke2se

Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan?

haha

CORed · 3rd October 2020, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by Mumbles

Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them.

But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts.

I think you're right. These guys are no real threat to take over, but they can cause a lot of trouble, even if they are about as likely to shoot themselves in the feet as they are to shoot somebody else.

Hercules Rockefeller · 3rd October 2020, 04:21 PM

Don't know if this is the best thread to post this in, but All Gas No Brakes just released a video from a Proud Boys Rally in Portland, OR. What a bunch of ******* wankers. Dangerous wankers.

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

uke2se · 3rd October 2020, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Fantasies of Red Dawn are just that: fantasies. This is the real world.

In the real world, fascists are murdering and kidnapping people in the streets and their leader occupies the White House.

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 11:37 PM

Originally Posted by uke2se

In the real world, fascists are murdering and kidnapping people in the streets and their leader occupies the White House.

You've convinced me. What would you suggest? An AK 47, an AR 15, or maybe a Bushmaster for a beginner like me? Something I don't have to really aim since I'm not a trained shooter. Something I can just point and spray bullets and do a lot of damage. Or maybe hand grenades? Nah. I'll just see if I can get a tank. I've got a three car garage I can fit one into. Do they have camouflage outfits in pink?

Stacyhs · 3rd October 2020, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by Hercules Rockefeller

Don't know if this is the best thread to post this in, but All Gas No Brakes just released a video from a Proud Boys Rally in Portland, OR. What a bunch of ******* wankers. Dangerous wankers.

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

They have the combined IQ of a slug. And I'm insulting slugs.

uke2se · 4th October 2020, 02:05 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

You've convinced me. What would you suggest? An AK 47, an AR 15, or maybe a Bushmaster for a beginner like me? Something I don't have to really aim since I'm not a trained shooter. Something I can just point and spray bullets and do a lot of damage. Or maybe hand grenades? Nah. I'll just see if I can get a tank. I've got a three car garage I can fit one into. Do they have camouflage outfits in pink?

I don't think you should get a gun. I just think you should think about what you are going to do if it all kicks off.

Mumbles · 4th October 2020, 04:03 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

True, those were around before Trump and they support Trump.

Yup, he's a symptom, not a cause.

But, well, how should I put this? Even with his raving about "poll watchers" making sure everyone is legal (another long-running GOP strategy), there's a reason why these guys pick marginal areas, and never show up in, say, the Bronx, the South Side, and other such areas. Same reason why white nationalists shoot up bible study groups or folks out shopping.

Simply put, they know if they show up in a heavy nonwhite area, particularly a urban black area, it's them against a 2+ hour long line of black people who are already on a mission, and they're going to get their dumb asses beat.

cullennz · 4th October 2020, 04:25 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters.

Um no.

It tends to come from both sides in the US.

Odd old place the US

Hlafordlaes · 4th October 2020, 05:29 AM

Originally Posted by The_Animus

... What else do you expect to stop them when they decide to go full SS for Trump?

Could happen. Seems most every cop in the nation is friendly to the Proud Boys and envy the freedom to pound liberals at will. In the case of the goons taking over, Russia, Turkey, Poland, Hungary, the Saudis and Bolsonaro's Brazil, plus a few more, will cheer. Not a strong enough alliance of strategic interests, as this excludes both the EU and China. More of a losers club.

Whatever happens, it will be a very close call between private interests and the public interest. Will the 0.1% go for Hitler 2.0?

kookbreaker · 4th October 2020, 05:31 AM

Originally Posted by Mumbles

Yup, he's a symptom, not a cause.

But, well, how should I put this? Even with his raving about "poll watchers" making sure everyone is legal (another long-running GOP strategy), there's a reason why these guys pick marginal areas, and never show up in, say, the Bronx, the South Side, and other such areas. Same reason why white nationalists shoot up bible study groups or folks out shopping.

Simply put, they know if they show up in a heavy nonwhite area, particularly a urban black area, it's them against a 2+ hour long line of black people who are already on a mission, and they're going to get their dumb asses beat.

I dunno, they just tried that stunt in Philadelphia (hence the "bad things happen" line from Trump). Mind you, they did so at the City Hall location which is probably more racially balanced than say, North Philadelphia.

https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile...nd-disruptive/

I expect there may be a lot of yahoos from out of town trying to do stunts by driving their jacked-up picks by minority neighborhood polling places and yelling insults and threats. But yeah, I expect that they won't slow their trucks down for anything for fear of a beat-down.

1st October 2020, 01:40 PM	#1
ChristianProgressive Master Poster Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 2,805	FBI Warns of Right-Wing Mass Destruction Terrorism https://www.thenation.com/article/po...cist-boogaloo/ From the memo: Quote: “significant increase of violent social media posts of several boogaloo adherents in Texas which … indicate a propensity toward violence and acquiring weapons that cause mass casualties, used by a small number of attackers.” and they may have police help in pulling them off. https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...macists-police If you're liberal and aren't armed, you need to make friends with ones who are.
	__________________ "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man." - Matthew 24:37 "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." - Luke 21:28

1st October 2020, 01:43 PM	#2
Norman Alexander Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Gundungurra Posts: 8,458	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive https://www.thenation.com/article/po...cist-boogaloo/ From the memo: and they may have police help in pulling them off. https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...macists-police If you're liberal and aren't armed, you need to make friends with ones who are. Sure! Because adding more guns to a gun problem is guaranteed to make it better.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

1st October 2020, 01:53 PM	#4
ChristianProgressive Master Poster Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 2,805	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander Sure! Because adding more guns to a gun problem is guaranteed to make it better. "If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation. The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't.
	__________________ "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man." - Matthew 24:37 "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." - Luke 21:28 Last edited by ChristianProgressive; 1st October 2020 at 01:54 PM.

1st October 2020, 06:02 PM	#6
ChristianProgressive Master Poster Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 2,805	Originally Posted by Stacyhs Just what we need: more testosterone fueled guys who think they're heroes with guns and God on their side You mean like the Founding Fathers? Like the Union Army under Lincoln? The WW II generation?
	__________________ "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man." - Matthew 24:37 "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." - Luke 21:28

1st October 2020, 11:23 PM	#8
varwoche Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Puget Sound Posts: 15,371	CP -- I urge you to put aside your fantasies for one short month, and channel your energy into getting out the vote. You could write postcards -- crowd source meets pandemic.
	__________________ To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot. My authority is total - Trump

1st October 2020, 01:49 PM	#3
Bob001 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: US of A Posts: 12,362	Quote: A Pro-Trump Militant Group Has Recruited Thousands of Police, Soldiers, and Veterans https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...il-war/616473/

1st October 2020, 02:05 PM	#5
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Just what we need: more testosterone fueled guys who think they're heroes with guns and God on their side who get their training from playing video games and acting like a bunch of beer swilling, camouflage wearing, flag waving idiots on weekends.

1st October 2020, 06:09 PM	#7
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive You mean like the Founding Fathers? Like the Union Army under Lincoln? The WW II generation? I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing, or states seceding and attacking our military, then we'll talk. Until then, you're just fomenting violence and behaving no differently than the Proud Boys. Same mentality. Get a grip.

2nd October 2020, 12:17 AM	#9
uke2se Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 14,174	Originally Posted by Stacyhs I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing, or states seceding and attacking our military, then we'll talk. Until then, you're just fomenting violence and behaving no differently than the Proud Boys. Same mentality. Get a grip. Sounds like it would be a bit late to talk by then.
	__________________ Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list. "If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1

2nd October 2020, 12:39 AM	#10
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by uke2se Sounds like it would be a bit late to talk by then. Cuz it ain't happening. It's just more scare mongering by Imma gonna git me a gun and hunker down cuz theyz cummin fer us crap.

2nd October 2020, 05:30 PM	#11
ChristianProgressive Master Poster Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 2,805	Originally Posted by Stacyhs I tell ya what. When we have an army being shipped by the thousands into our states, being billeted in our houses, and sent against us to enforce laws we had no say in passing,. we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors.
	__________________ "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man." - Matthew 24:37 "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." - Luke 21:28

2nd October 2020, 05:31 PM	#12
ChristianProgressive Master Poster Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 2,805	Originally Posted by varwoche CP -- I urge you to put aside your fantasies for one short month, and channel your energy into getting out the vote. You could write postcards -- crowd source meets pandemic. You assume our electoral process is secure. It isn't and hasn't been since 2000. As long as Republicans count the elections and control the voting machines, they will throw any close election to their guy.
	__________________ "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man." - Matthew 24:37 "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." - Luke 21:28

2nd October 2020, 06:23 PM	#13
Joe Random Master Poster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,682	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors. The pills actually help if you take them.

2nd October 2020, 07:01 PM	#14
cullennz Embarrasingly illiterate Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 19,682	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive "If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation. The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't. Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this?
	__________________ "I mean, you've got the first sort of mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy. I mean, that's a story-book, man," Biden said. 2007 https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna16911044

2nd October 2020, 07:44 PM	#15
chrispy Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Solola, Guatemala Posts: 1,042	Originally Posted by cullennz Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this? sigh My brother.
	__________________ Just a spec in the Spectrum...

3rd October 2020, 12:32 AM	#16
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive we already do. they work for ICE, CBP, DHS, the prison systems, etc and they were deployed all across the US this year in sanitized uniforms to beat protesters, kidnap people off the streets to inject them with drugs and violate their civil rights. Meanwhile, their compatriots rum concentration camps where women have their uteruses ripped out by unqualified doctors. So your suggestion is for us to buy guns, form our own little armies and attack ICE, CBP, DHS, the prisons, etc? Do I have that right? I just want to make sure I'm not misunderstanding you.

3rd October 2020, 12:33 AM	#17
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by cullennz Can I assume this is a parody account, or do some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this? Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters.

3rd October 2020, 01:36 AM	#18
Mumbles Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 8,282	Originally Posted by Stacyhs Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters. Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them. But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts.
Mumbles Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 8,282

3rd October 2020, 03:28 AM	#19
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 31,019	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive "If you want peace, prepare for war."- Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation. The problem isn't too many guns, it's who has them and who doesn't. They also weren't stopped by a well-armed but otherwise poorly organised and trained populace.

3rd October 2020, 04:35 AM	#20
uke2se Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 14,174	Originally Posted by The Don They also weren't stopped by a well-armed but otherwise poorly organised and trained populace. Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan?
	__________________ Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list. "If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1

3rd October 2020, 04:54 AM	#21
dirtywick Master Poster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,868	People who have these violent fantasy scenarios always imagine themselves as the hero who survives everything and everyone else is the victim.
dirtywick Master Poster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,868

3rd October 2020, 05:23 AM	#22
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Alexandria, VA Home to the Deep State. Posts: 22,322	The smart play is when the election is called and it's a Biden victory, stay home. Don't go out to counter protest the Trumptrash. Trump will want to exploit the violence in the streets. That can't happen is no one shows up. Besides if Biden wins, what's to protest? As to the gun thing, if you're in Portland, Oregon who could you possibly shoot that would have an impact on the transfer of power? What good does it do you? The transfer of power will happen in Washington DC and no amount of violence anywhere else will have an impact on that. So relax, the Police in Washington DC aren't the police in Kenosha. Have an armed, open carry protest here and your brains are will be wall art. Finally, if I'm the voice of reason, there's a ******* problem here.
	__________________ A MAGA hat = a Swastika arm band. A vote for Trump is a vote for treason.

3rd October 2020, 05:27 AM	#23
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Alexandria, VA Home to the Deep State. Posts: 22,322	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation. Bull-****. Lots of internal fascist aggressors have been stopped with application of the laws. You're not talking about an external fascist state attacking us, you're talking about an internal insurrection. Law enforcement stops those all the time. The fact that the FBI issued a report on the topic likely means that stopping these groups through enforcing the law is sort of what they have in mind.
	__________________ A MAGA hat = a Swastika arm band. A vote for Trump is a vote for treason.

3rd October 2020, 09:01 AM	#24
Hlafordlaes Disorder of Kilopi Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: State of Flux Posts: 14,320	Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive No fascist aggressor was ever stopped by laws, treaties, or negotiation. Agreed. Appeasement does not work at all; rather, it is a big come-on. Originally Posted by Craig4 Bull-***. Lots of internal fascist aggressors have been stopped with application of the laws. You're not talking about an external fascist state attacking us, you're talking about an internal insurrection. Law enforcement stops those all the time. The fact that the FBI issued a report on the topic likely means that stopping these groups through enforcing the law is sort of what they have in mind. True as well, but this relies on internal law enforcement being uncompromised, and increasingly it seems local police are indeed so, as well as the effects of whatever erosion in the due diligence and credentials of the Justice Department/FBI/judicial system/SCOTUS that has taken place, i.e., everything Trump et al have been "fixing" full time, full swing, full bore, like good mobsters. I do not, however, believe guns to be the solution. If there is a goon takeover, it will be game over in short order for the stock market and US ability to influence the world. Most likely short term outcome is a shift to a new world currency, or a basket thereof, as former allies beat a very hasty retreat, especially from the US-dominated international banking system. Yet oddly, and as is their custom, when those with the real money decide the goons they've been financing are a greater threat to their interests than would be a return to a tax-and-spend society, they will beat a partial retreat. The first to jump ship from the far-rightward push may be the wealthy Jewish supporters of today's GOP, who are beginning to see the big "oops" that partnering with fascists is (the Trump to "Cruz Missile" threat). High tech and advanced industry in this day and age need* global markets, far more than they did last century, and will always push back enough to counter protectionism, so there's that as well. When things are in the balance, it is the balance of powerful interests that will call the shots, barring insurrection. The latter is not worth it, I would argue, as the chain reaction from a Trump win/takeover will automatically align world events greatly against US interests and provoke an internal backlash of critical support for the rule of law. Or so one hopes. Civil war, FWIW, would be far worse.
	__________________ Driftwood on an empty shore of the sea of meaninglessness. Irrelevant, weightless, inconsequential moment of existential hubris on the fast track to oblivion. His real name is Count Douchenozzle von Stenchfahrter und Lichtendicks. - shemp

3rd October 2020, 12:21 PM	#25
tanabear Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: The Lion's Den Posts: 435	RE: FBI Warns of Right-Wing Mass Destruction Terrorism Well, it looks like some white supremacists got away with it again. Some white racist frat boys from Wisconsin attacked Althea Bernstein, a biracial woman, because they are all racist and stuff. "A biracial Wisconsin woman who says a group of white men set her on fire while she was driving wants her attackers to know they hurt her but hopes they will improve themselves. Althea Bernstein told ABC’s “Good Morning America” for a Friday segment that she hasn’t slept and doesn’t have an appetite. But she called the attack in the state’s capital city of Madison." Even after Good Morning America and the Duchess of Sussex, Meghan Markle, bring attention to the attack those racist frat boys remain elusive. Is Haven Monahan still at large? Unfortunately, it looks like those racist frat boys will remain free to terrorize other biracial people. Coincidentally, on the same night and almost at the same time, there was a mostly peaceful protest going on in Madison, Wisconsin. This mostly peaceful protest included fire-bombing a Madison government building. Now I'm sure an all-American girl like Althea Bernstein wouldn't have been involved in this mostly peaceful arson attack. You see she just happened to be near the event, she was not participating in the event. "The firebombing was part of a larger Black Lives Matter protest in which protesters tore down two statues on the Capitol Square, including one of a Union Civil War soldier and abolitionist. The protest had started in response to the arrest hours before of a local Black Lives Matter activist now facing state and federal charges for allegedly trying to extort money from at least one Downtown business." NO! Those statues of a Union soldier and an abolitionist were obviously torn down by the same racist confederates who attacked a biracial woman.
	__________________ pomeroo: "Mark, where did this guy get the idea that you talked about holding aluminum in your hand?" Undesired Walrus: "Why, Ron, Mark mentioned this on your very own show!"

3rd October 2020, 12:39 PM	#26
varwoche Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Puget Sound Posts: 15,371	Originally Posted by Hlafordlaes <snip thoughtful post for brevity> I like to think that if Trump steals the election, so many people will passionately oppose that we will take to the street -- strategically and peacefully. We can shut down the country if there's enough of us. Every major airport, seaport, rail line, and every city block that has a Trump property. No democracy, no commerce. Unfortunately for the forces of fascism and theocracy, Trump has already made it completely impossible for the opposition to trust a Trump outcome. It would be funny, in a most demented way, if he were to win "legitimately". Scare quotes due to unknowability. A most uncomfortable future awaits you no matter the election outcome. Tough luck. I hope it's not neccesary. We need to be patient and not freak out on Nov 4.
	__________________ To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot. My authority is total - Trump Last edited by varwoche; 3rd October 2020 at 12:48 PM.

3rd October 2020, 01:52 PM	#27
The_Animus Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3,252	If a peaceful resolution to all this is possible it's obviously preferred. I don't think anyone here actually wants violence. The difference is that some here feel that the belief that everything is just going to work out via non-violent means is naive. There have been a hundred times where people kept thinking this time, this thing, it will break the camels back and the Democrats or the FBI or whoever will finally stop the fascists' march to authoritarianism. How's that been working out? If the trend of ICE/DHS/Border Patrol/Police/Right Wing Militias escalating violence and fascism continues (and why would you assume otherwise given what we've seen), then why isn't being prepared to counteract that, through force if needed, a prudent action? What else do you expect to stop them when they decide to go full SS for Trump?
The_Animus Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3,252	__________________ Don't feed the trolls. Just ignore them. Last edited by The_Animus; 3rd October 2020 at 02:01 PM.

3rd October 2020, 02:16 PM	#28
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Quote: Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post Some Americans actually think stupid stuff like this but they're usually called Trump supporters. Originally Posted by Mumbles Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them. But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts. True, those were around before Trump and they support Trump.

3rd October 2020, 02:18 PM	#29
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by uke2se Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan? Fantasies of Red Dawn are just that: fantasies. This is the real world.

3rd October 2020, 02:23 PM	#30
Captain_Swoop Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 31,363	Originally Posted by uke2se Last time they were stopped by the Red Army. Should we just decide to wait for those guys agan? haha

3rd October 2020, 03:11 PM	#31
CORed Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Central City, Colorado, USA Posts: 10,000	Originally Posted by Mumbles Nah, it's been true the entire time. Main problem is that the far right that actually tries to act usually consist of bungling oafs that snitch on themselves to the FBI, small groups that promptly stab one another in the back, and so forth. Most of the rest are puppies yapping at whatever frightens them. But let's not pretend we haven't seen a bunch of mass shootings, intimidation rallies, pipe bombs sent out, and the like, often with the open approval of local police - and often operating in areas where the cops have a long history of aiding violent far right nuts. I think you're right. These guys are no real threat to take over, but they can cause a lot of trouble, even if they are about as likely to shoot themselves in the feet as they are to shoot somebody else.

3rd October 2020, 04:40 PM	#33
uke2se Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 14,174	Originally Posted by Stacyhs Fantasies of Red Dawn are just that: fantasies. This is the real world. In the real world, fascists are murdering and kidnapping people in the streets and their leader occupies the White House.
	__________________ Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list. "If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1

3rd October 2020, 11:37 PM	#34
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 17,395	Originally Posted by uke2se In the real world, fascists are murdering and kidnapping people in the streets and their leader occupies the White House. You've convinced me. What would you suggest? An AK 47, an AR 15, or maybe a Bushmaster for a beginner like me? Something I don't have to really aim since I'm not a trained shooter. Something I can just point and spray bullets and do a lot of damage. Or maybe hand grenades? Nah. I'll just see if I can get a tank. I've got a three car garage I can fit one into. Do they have camouflage outfits in pink?

4th October 2020, 02:05 AM	#36
uke2se Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 14,174	Originally Posted by Stacyhs You've convinced me. What would you suggest? An AK 47, an AR 15, or maybe a Bushmaster for a beginner like me? Something I don't have to really aim since I'm not a trained shooter. Something I can just point and spray bullets and do a lot of damage. Or maybe hand grenades? Nah. I'll just see if I can get a tank. I've got a three car garage I can fit one into. Do they have camouflage outfits in pink? I don't think you should get a gun. I just think you should think about what you are going to do if it all kicks off.
	__________________ Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list. "If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1

4th October 2020, 04:03 AM	#37
Mumbles Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 8,282	Originally Posted by Stacyhs True, those were around before Trump and they support Trump. Yup, he's a symptom, not a cause. But, well, how should I put this? Even with his raving about "poll watchers" making sure everyone is legal (another long-running GOP strategy), there's a reason why these guys pick marginal areas, and never show up in, say, the Bronx, the South Side, and other such areas. Same reason why white nationalists shoot up bible study groups or folks out shopping. Simply put, they know if they show up in a heavy nonwhite area, particularly a urban black area, it's them against a 2+ hour long line of black people who are already on a mission, and they're going to get their dumb asses beat.
Mumbles Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 8,282