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Old 14th December 2021, 10:38 AM   #41
Segnosaur
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
Re: Why republicans seem to engage in voter fraud more often....
Quote:
....and the preponderance of evidence.
Other than anecdote?
I think these are a little more than 'anecdotes', since they involve actual legal cases, arrests, media reports, etc.

(i.e. its not someone claiming "I saw bigfoot in a polling station, and he voted for Biden!)

Now could it just be a case of us "noticing" it more when republicans do it (because of the hypocrisy of it)? Possible. But then, since republicans like to complain about voter fraud so much you would expect Stubby McBonespurs, Guilliani, and MyPillow guy to by hyping each and every case of fraud on behalf of the democrats. But we don't see it.
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Old 14th December 2021, 11:09 AM   #42
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Ah yes the point where someone pretends that Republicans haven't already openly admitted they can't maintain power fairly without powergrabs and do the whole "Show me where someone said that" routine.

Everyone take a shot.
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Old 14th December 2021, 11:23 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I think these are a little more than 'anecdotes', since they involve actual legal cases, arrests, media reports, etc.

(i.e. its not someone claiming "I saw bigfoot in a polling station, and he voted for Biden!)

Now could it just be a case of us "noticing" it more when republicans do it (because of the hypocrisy of it)? Possible. But then, since republicans like to complain about voter fraud so much you would expect Stubby McBonespurs, Guilliani, and MyPillow guy to by hyping each and every case of fraud on behalf of the democrats. But we don't see it.
They are in fact anecdotes, a short amusing or interesting story about a real incident or person, Republican hypocrisy not withstanding.
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Old 14th December 2021, 11:25 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
Republican hypocrisy not withstanding.
Republican hypocrisy is always not withstanding for some reason.
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Old 14th December 2021, 12:24 PM   #45
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*Shrug* Given the fact that the sort of voter fraud that Republicans are always going on about is so rare that anecdotes are really the only kind of evidence you will ever see for it (as opposed to what you'd expect to see for organized and large-scale efforts at fraud, which would leave more empirical evidence), the prevalence of Republicans doing it even only anecdotally is still evidence of how ridiculous their whole self-righteous charade about it is. They're CTists frothing at the mouth about a conspiracy they want to pass laws to prevent, but which only demonstrably exists in the scattered actions of their own followers.
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Old 14th December 2021, 12:28 PM   #46
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Yeah basically all the Republicans can prove is that even when they attempt to turn into a self-fulfilling prophecy, you can't actually do the kind of large scale voter fraud they have convinced their cult members is common place.

It won't matter because facts don't exist anymore, but it's still funny.
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Old 14th December 2021, 12:35 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Yeah basically all the Republicans can prove is that even when they attempt to turn into a self-fulfilling prophecy, you can't actually do the kind of large scale voter fraud they have convinced their cult members is common place.

It won't matter because facts don't exist anymore, but it's still funny.
I'm not sure if that highlighted bit is an effect of the Trump years or what led to them, likely a little of both, but it really is just depressing as hell when our whole political system has become a reality show that has no reality beyond how well it does in the ratings with fevered fans.
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Old 14th December 2021, 12:37 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
I'm not sure if that highlighted bit is an effect of the Trump years or what led to them.
The post-fact world has been a long time coming, people (like me) said it was coming and got called dramatic, and I'm still bitter about that and have zero intent of getting over it.

We stood by why the internet let woo, pseudoscience, and trolling perfect ways to destroy rational discourse while we jerked ourselves off about how good we were at ignoring it, and now it's escaped the lab and we don't have any weapons to fight it.
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Old 14th December 2021, 12:57 PM   #49
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The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:10 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
They are in fact anecdotes, a short amusing or interesting story about a real incident or person, Republican hypocrisy not withstanding.
I think there is a non trivial correlation between those doing it and being republican, because the republican party has been using it as a thing to bring up fear and talk their supporters don't all realize it is just empty talk to justify racist policies and think it is something they can actually do.

Up next we dismiss the the incredible disparity in political violence and terrorism as just an anecdote. Because events are anecdotes and it never becomes real data and so you can't ever say anything about anything.
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:23 PM   #51
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Absolutely ******* hilarious.

Quote:
...pro-Donald-Trump-affiliated material can be found on Facebook pages appearing to belong to Halstead and Rider. WKMG reported that a Facebook page appearing to belong to Ketcik also had pro-Trump posts.
3 residents of The Villages [Orlando, FL] arrested after casting multiple votes in 2020 election
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:28 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
I think there is a non trivial correlation between those doing it and being republican, because the republican party has been using it as a thing to bring up fear and talk their supporters don't all realize it is just empty talk to justify racist policies and think it is something they can actually do.

Up next we dismiss the the incredible disparity in political violence and terrorism as just an anecdote. Because events are anecdotes and it never becomes real data and so you can't ever say anything about anything.
This is totally a non-sequitur. Lately, there has been more political violence from the right in the US, there is actually data to support that. I only see anecdotes to support the notion that electoral fraud is more prevalent on the right. Nobody has even bothered saying otherwise, they've just got a bunch of special pleading for why they must be right.
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:30 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
You know what would have been better than this childish sputtering? Show us how it's done- show some evidence for more than just the handful of cases, something more empirical than anecdotal evidence for any systematic effort by either party. If you can do that, you're doing more than any of the other pols pushing the meme as a way to scare their flock, or the idiots who gobble that crap up. Otherwise, all you're doing here is making exactly the sort of mindless noises that really are comically stupid.

Put up or shut the **** up- my guess is that you won't be able to do either.
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:32 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
This is totally a non-sequitur. Lately, there has been more political violence from the right in the US, there is actually data to support that.
Nonsense just anecdotes.
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Old 14th December 2021, 01:48 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
You know what would have been better than this childish sputtering? Show us how it's done- show some evidence for more than just the handful of cases, something more empirical than anecdotal evidence for any systematic effort by either party. If you can do that, you're doing more than any of the other pols pushing the meme as a way to scare their flock, or the idiots who gobble that crap up. Otherwise, all you're doing here is making exactly the sort of mindless noises that really are comically stupid.

Put up or shut the **** up- my guess is that you won't be able to do either.
Tough words.

Who said anything about large-scale organized efforts by either party? Maybe read what I wrote again, and analyze it more closely.

Then again, I am not asking anyone to leave their comfort zone, here.
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Old 14th December 2021, 02:36 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by ahhell View Post
Other than anecdote?
A curious comment, given the details in the OP.

But feel absolutely free to provide evidence that there is more pro-Democrat voter fraud.
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Old 14th December 2021, 02:51 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
Can you provide evidence that it is more than just the handful of reported cases?
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Old 14th December 2021, 02:56 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
Can you please point us to other, larger, verified instances of voter fraud in US elections?
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Old 14th December 2021, 02:59 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Cat Not Included View Post
Can you please point us to other, larger, verified instances of voter fraud in US elections?
Are you telling me you think the extent is only the few cases reported in the media? Is that really what you believe? Out of 155 million votes cast?

Again, I have said nothing about large-scale organized efforts...by either party.
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:03 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Are you telling me you think the extent is only the few cases reported in the media? Is that really what you believe? Out of 155 million votes cast?

Again, I have said nothing about large-scale organized efforts...by either party.
Wow.. just... wow.
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:06 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Are you telling me you think the extent is only the few cases reported in the media? Is that really what you believe? Out of 155 million votes cast?

Again, I have said nothing about large-scale organized efforts...by either party.
Until there's some evidence that there is more than is being reported then assuming makes an ass out of u and ming.
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:07 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
You know what would have been better than this childish sputtering? Show us how it's done- show some evidence for more than just the handful of cases, something more empirical than anecdotal evidence for any systematic effort by either party. If you can do that, you're doing more than any of the other pols pushing the meme as a way to scare their flock, or the idiots who gobble that crap up. Otherwise, all you're doing here is making exactly the sort of mindless noises that really are comically stupid.

Put up or shut the **** up- my guess is that you won't be able to do either.
Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Tough words.

Who said anything about large-scale organized efforts by either party? Maybe read what I wrote again, and analyze it more closely.

Then again, I am not asking anyone to leave their comfort zone, here.
<--- There's one you've earned. Seriously, good job, very Trumpian- all you did there was to act exactly as I guessed you would. And are continuing with it, I see- very comical (at least).
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:10 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by plague311 View Post
Until there's some evidence that there is more than is being reported then assuming makes an ass out of u and ming.
"The only crimes that are committed are those which are discovered and reported to authorities."

Sometimes I wonder how people get through life with this sort of thinking.
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:11 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"The only crimes that are committed are those which are discovered and reported to authorities."

Sometimes I wonder how people get through life with this sort of thinking.
That's a nice strawman you've built there.
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:31 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Are you telling me you think the extent is only the few cases reported in the media? Is that really what you believe? Out of 155 million votes cast?

Again, I have said nothing about large-scale organized efforts...by either party.
What voter fraud are you referring to?
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Old 14th December 2021, 03:37 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by Cat Not Included View Post
What voter fraud are you referring to?
The sooper-sekrit kind, obviously.
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Old 14th December 2021, 04:22 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Yeah basically all the Republicans can prove is that even when they attempt to turn into a self-fulfilling prophecy, you can't actually do the kind of large scale voter fraud they have convinced their cult members is common place.

It won't matter because facts don't exist anymore, but it's still funny.
It's a feedback loop. Republicans need to have pretext for election rigging (voter purges, access restriction, etc), so they spread lies about impersonation fraud (which doesn't happen to any meaningful degree), and the biggest rubes in their base are convinced it's true and try to give it a whirl to get instantly found out.

3 deranged Florida boomers decided that voter fraud was easy to do and painted big felony targets on their backs, but that's just a bit of collateral damage for the right wing project of entrenching the Republican party as a permanent ruling minority. Their lives getting complicated by felony charges is just the result of the waste heat of the Republican vote suppression machine. Operatives in the party don't give a **** about "voter fraud", but these idiots are too stupid to realize that.

ETA personal anecdote: The most brain-poisoned Massachusetts CHUDs are absolutely convinced that MA liberals bus up to NH to commit voter impersonation fraud, to the point that some have gone on "stakeouts" to spot the buses traveling north. Seems only a matter of time before one of these morons trips dick-first into a criminal vote fraud charge.
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Old 14th December 2021, 04:23 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
The sooper-sekrit kind, obviously.
Double Secret, ask the Dean!
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Old 14th December 2021, 04:30 PM   #69
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Again I love as a longtime skeptic watching the general masses hit the brick wall of arguing with Woo Slingers.

"Oh it's a conspiracy so there's no evidence, so the fact that there's no evidence means the conspiracy is true" hidden under a bunch of trolling and doublespeak.

Yeah that's a very, very old tactic. The "normies" just have to put up with now so it's a big deal.
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Old 14th December 2021, 04:33 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Again I love as a longtime skeptic watching the general masses hit the brick wall of arguing with Woo Slingers.

"Oh it's a conspiracy so there's no evidence, so the fact that there's no evidence means the conspiracy is true" hidden under a bunch of trolling and doublespeak.

Yeah that's a very, very old tactic. The "normies" just have to put up with now so it's a big deal.
Sometimes I really wonder if you read the thread comments. My gut feeling is, "NO".
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Old 14th December 2021, 05:21 PM   #71
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Sounds like we need a forensic audit of every race Republicans won.
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Old 14th December 2021, 05:27 PM   #72
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What I'm seeing from the GQP so far is this:

There's PLENTY of Democratic voter fraud. That's how they won! They won, so it MUST have been fraud. Just that every time you look for it, "they" cover it up. All 320 million of "they". And Italy. And China. But we will find it! One fine day...

On the other hand, there's NO Republican voter fraud. Zero. None. Just as long as you overlook the tiny handful of instances of Republicans who the authorities found DID do voter fraud. But they're just yokel dummies. They can be ignored. And it didn't change the outcome anyway. So, meh.
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Old 14th December 2021, 06:12 PM   #73
Stacyhs
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The Heritage Foundation...not exactly know for its liberalism ...has compiled all the known cases of voter fraud convictions. I went through the first 3 pages and in almost every single case where the political party of the convicted fraudster is given, it's Republican. So much for 'anecdotal'.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/search

Click on the down arrow under "details".
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Old 14th December 2021, 06:24 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
The Heritage Foundation...not exactly know for its liberalism ...has compiled all the known cases of voter fraud convictions. I went through the first 3 pages and in almost every single case where the political party of the convicted fraudster is given, it's Republican. So much for 'anecdotal'.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/search

Click on the down arrow under "details".
I was waiting for an extremely non-partisan analysis. Stacy never disappoints.

******* clown shoes. I love laughing at this stuff.

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Old 14th December 2021, 06:45 PM   #75
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Democrats actually do this way more often, they are just much more competent than the Republicans. Not sure why the right wingers are so stupid.
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Old 14th December 2021, 06:51 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
The real funny part is that some people believe that voter fraud is just the reported handful of cases out of 155 million ballots cast. And that it is predominantly only from the "other party", of course.

This is what passes for "critical thought", around here. Comically stupid.
Let's ignore the preponderance of actual, reported instances of Repub voter fraud and wank off over the imagined deluge of Dem fraud that surely must be occurring.
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Old 14th December 2021, 07:00 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
"The only crimes that are committed are those which are discovered and reported to authorities."

Sometimes I wonder how people get through life with this sort of thinking.
By this metric everyone is allowed to imagine whatever they wish. No evidence required.

Out of curiosity, of 155 million ballots cast, what fraction do you claim are fraudulent? And how do they break down by Party? And if you have any evidence... a cite?
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:20 AM   #78
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Yes, it is funny how Warp takes absence of proof of voter fraud as proof of voter fraud.
It just feels truthy that Dems cheat, because the only other conclusion is that Democrats have a significant majority of Americans behind them, and that can't be true.
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:30 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Yes, it is funny how Warp takes absence of proof of voter fraud as proof of voter fraud.
It just feels truthy that Dems cheat, because the only other conclusion is that Democrats have a significant majority of Americans behind them, and that can't be true.
The absence of evidence of Democratic Party malfeasance is clear evidence of how corrupt the Democratic Party must be whereas the abundance of evidence of Republican Party malfeasance is evidence of their fundamental honesty.

You see, only someone who is, at heart, honest would bungle their misdeeds so badly that they are easily discovered. They simply aren't practiced enough to cover things up properly.

OTOH someone with a clean record is clearly a master of covering up and must have a massive network of Deep State operatives to help them. Any occasional slip in the cover up (like with Franken's or Cuomo's sexual assaults) is likely to be deliberate (to give the impression of fallibility) and/or because they have fallen out of favour with TPTB.
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Old 15th December 2021, 01:37 AM   #80
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there is some truth to that: if you know that the cops and prosecutors and most of the Senate will always support you if you are White, thinking about how not to attract the attention of the Johnny Law isn't something you bother to learn.
The Jan 6 communications show how blissfully unaware the Putschists were that they might be spending the next decades behind bars.

Compare that to Black Bloc, where people work to stay anonymous because they know that PDs will put in 100x the effort to find a left-wing protestors near the scene of a broken window than right-wing militia guys using violence against reporters or minorities.
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