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Tags donn de grandpre , 911 conspiracy theory

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Old 1st October 2006, 11:16 PM   #1
JamesB
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Colonel Donn de Grand Pre

Now that the JREF ninjas have helped expose one military fraud, this guy has been bugging me for a while.

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com...grand-pre.html

Can anyone do an FOIA on him, or at least explain to me how to? He is popping up in conspiracy circles everywhere the "scholars", the "veterans", Alex Jones, even the American Free Press' little holocaust denial fest.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:09 AM   #2
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Try the POW Network.

They can help you track down (and interpret) his service records and they just love to hear about people falsely claiming military service.

They were very helpful to an Australian I know who was being harrassed on another internet forum by someone exagerating their US service record.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 02:05 AM   #3
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I do hope you nail the guy. I dont care what armed force or what branch it is. To claim military service when you have not - is right down there with the low of the lows
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Old 2nd October 2006, 02:14 AM   #4
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What has he said that makes you doubt his authenticity? The sites often do a bad job of reporting and often will use each other as a source, rather than contact the original source themselves. It then becomes a game of telephone, where the story is slightly altered everytime it is copied. The specific branch of service may have been mis-reported by one site and the others carried it on. However, if he had been serving since WWII, he could have been in both the Army and Air Force. I am not defending their source, by any means, and you should suspect anything coming from the sources you name and are right to check his credentials.
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Last edited by CptColumbo; 2nd October 2006 at 02:23 AM. Reason: clarifying point
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Old 2nd October 2006, 03:39 AM   #5
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Well For mine - I have a couple of problems. He says he has been releasing books since 1975 - try and find them, there is just nothing about this guy before 2002

He has not actually been published - If you look carefully he is self published. Its called vanity press in the industry, generally not a good sign.

I listened to a little of an impromtu phone interview on Vets for 911 - It doesn't proves anything, but he doesn't sound 80 years old. Also in the interview he laid claim to being a full bird (what ever that is) colonel in the army. He didn't mention other services, so I think your theory of Chinese whispers might be right

Last edited by MG1962; 2nd October 2006 at 03:50 AM. Reason: bad english
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Old 2nd October 2006, 05:10 AM   #6
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3 entries in amazon.com for him, none before 2000

TAM

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Old 2nd October 2006, 05:19 AM   #7
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Here is a listing for an airport he owns. I noticed the "de" is gone from his name, so it is possible it is a different guy, but unlikely.

http://www.airports.com/pages/Airpor...n/more277.html

TAM
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Old 2nd October 2006, 05:42 AM   #8
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this book appears to be from 1979.

http://isbndb.com/d/book/confessions...s_peddler.html

Odd that a christian book publisher would publish it. are they a vanity press?
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Old 2nd October 2006, 05:51 AM   #9
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This is from the Alex Jones interview available at:http://www.prisonplanet.com/022904degrand.html

Quote:
DGP: Well, what I was trying to get through here, John has done a beautiful job of laying it all out here on 911. What I want to carry away is that the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs himself has agreed, there were no hijackers. There were no cell phone calls. Everybody aboard that aircraft, pilots and crew, were unconscious within 8 to 18 minutes after take-off. And you can take it from there. I've got it covered in books 2 and 3, what actually happened.

AJ: So, they're knocked out and then the remote control takes place and the rest is history.

DGP: Yeah, there was remote control and .. yes.

AJ: By the way, people don't believe they have that. Kennedy's oldest son, JFK's big brother, died in a chase plane with remote controlling in a bomber loaded with explosives as a drone in 1944.

DGP: That is correct.
Wouldn't the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff have something to say about this guy prattling on? The interview has no date on it (or I'm too dense to figure out where it's posted), so I don't know who the Chariman was at that time. But the page copyright reads 2002-2003, so I take it it was in 2003.

He also seems to claim he was hired by Robt. MacNamara but in the review of his book released in 2003 they cite that he was the chief Middle East arms negotiator under Ford and Carter. Long career, eh?

Surely there'd be something out there on him. He makes no claim to being deep cover, so whether he was with State or another department, there should still be records.

The guy also claims he KNOWS THE PILOT THAT SHOT DOWN 93!

Where do they find these people, and why hasn't he had a firm public thrashing? The Jones interview is a must! There's so much ranting in there, you could fill a month of research.

ETA: I also found the book from '79 and the airport address is the same as his current (owned) publishing company or very nearby, so that's likely him.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 06:01 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by MG1962 View Post
Also in the interview he laid claim to being a full bird (what ever that is) colonel in the army.
Just FYI, "full bird" is a full Colonel, not a Lieutenant Colonel, who is also normally addressed as "Colonel". The bird refers to the Eagle on the shoulders as designation of the rank.

Did a quick Google. Col Grand Pre notes he served with the 236th Combat engineers in the Burma/China Theatre in WWII and a quick look seems to bear out that unit was assigned to that theatre. He also mentions serving in the 27th Infantry in Korea and a webpage http://www.kolchak.org/ bears that out, albeint not mentioning the Colonels' name (of course, he was probably a lower rank then).

There is a Dickinson State University in North Dakota, where he claims a Political Science Degree from 1956. http://www.dickinsonstate.com/

He also claims to have been appointed Director, Ground Weapons Systems, International Logistics Negotiation, in 1967. That, I will try to look into more deeply as that is my balliwick.

In sum, some areas to check out, but in the initial history check, he has his story straight, at least in the details.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 06:05 AM   #11
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Yahooing is better than Googling.

I think I found you an ally..... unfortunately, he's anonymous, but he gives a good lead.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/022904degrand.html

I also located an AFP newsletter that said the Col. Donn couldn't attend a symposium on Labor Day, due to ill health, so he's obviously known at AFP, that bastion of enlightened journalism.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 07:35 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by CptColumbo View Post
What has he said that makes you doubt his authenticity? The sites often do a bad job of reporting and often will use each other as a source, rather than contact the original source themselves. It then becomes a game of telephone, where the story is slightly altered everytime it is copied. The specific branch of service may have been mis-reported by one site and the others carried it on. However, if he had been serving since WWII, he could have been in both the Army and Air Force. I am not defending their source, by any means, and you should suspect anything coming from the sources you name and are right to check his credentials.
Well I don't know for sure, but I am highly suspect. He claims to have done everything, and know everybody, but he doesn't pop up anywhere. He claims to be good friends with General Shelton, but when Popular Mechanics contacted him he had never heard of Grand Pre. He claims to know the pilots who "shot down United 93" but that is all made up, and he gets all the facts wrong. It doesn't make sense that you could have this elaborate of a military career without showing up somewhere, except in the last couple of years trying to promote your conspiracy theories. Especially considering how odd his name is.

BTW I looked up his name on military.com and it shows someone by that name as an E-7, not proof by any means, but more oddities.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 07:37 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by kevin View Post
this book appears to be from 1979.

http://isbndb.com/d/book/confessions...s_peddler.html

Odd that a christian book publisher would publish it. are they a vanity press?
They have his name wrong, weird.

'Grand Pre, Donn R'
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Old 2nd October 2006, 07:48 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Yahooing is better than Googling.

I think I found you an ally..... unfortunately, he's anonymous, but he gives a good lead.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/022904degrand.html

I also located an AFP newsletter that said the Col. Donn couldn't attend a symposium on Labor Day, due to ill health, so he's obviously known at AFP, that bastion of enlightened journalism.
Oh now this is just bizarre. Where do they get these people?

Quote:
AJ: Okay, can you break that down for us?

DGP: Well, I break it down in the time frame that we had satellite images of rounds or missiles being fired from the Negev desert toward Baghdad. That's 600 miles distance. And six or eight of the rounds came in. That was February of 1991.

AJ: Are you saying that the Israelis used miniaturized nuclear weapons?

DGP: Yes sir. That's what I'm saying, in plain English.

AJ: Well I remember, I know they bragged that they had a lot of really sophisticated miniaturized nuclear weapons, of the little mini-frogs, or whatever. But and I know there were these giant mushroom clouds on the news. They'd say, "Oh, that's not a nuke. That's just a weapons depot." But you are saying that it is common knowledge at the Pentagon that Israel was firing nuclear weapons at Iraq?

DGP: That is correct.
Why didn't they just use supernanothermite?
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Old 2nd October 2006, 08:01 AM   #15
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This is from the Popular Mechanics article:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...42.html?page=8
Quote:
F-16 Pilot
CLAIM:
In February 2004, retired Army Col. Donn de Grand-Pre said on "The Alex Jones Show," a radio talk show broadcast on 42 stations: "It [Flight 93] was taken out by the North Dakota Air Guard. I know the pilot who fired those two missiles to take down 93." LetsRoll911.org, citing de Grand-Pre, identifies the pilot: "Major Rick Gibney fired two Sidewinder missiles at the aircraft and destroyed it in midflight at precisely 0958."

FACT: Saying he was reluctant to fuel debate by responding to unsubstantiated charges, Gibney (a lieutenant colonel, not a major) declined to comment. According to Air National Guard spokesman Master Sgt. David Somdahl, Gibney flew an F-16 that morning--but nowhere near Shanksville. He took off from Fargo, N.D., and flew to Bozeman, Mont., to pick up Ed Jacoby Jr., the director of the New York State Emergency Management Office. Gibney then flew Jacoby from Montana to Albany, N.Y., so Jacoby could coordinate 17,000 rescue workers engaged in the state's response to 9/11. Jacoby confirms the day's events. "I was in Big Sky for an emergency managers meeting. Someone called to say an F-16 was landing in Bozeman. From there we flew to Albany." Jacoby is outraged by the claim that Gibney shot down Flight 93. "I summarily dismiss that because Lt. Col. Gibney was with me at that time. It disgusts me to see this because the public is being misled. More than anything else it disgusts me because it brings up fears. It brings up hopes--it brings up all sorts of feelings, not only to the victims' families but to all the individuals throughout the country, and the world for that matter. I get angry at the misinformation out there."
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Old 2nd October 2006, 08:02 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by CurtC View Post
This is from the Popular Mechanics article:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...42.html?page=8
He is in the PM book too.

page 79:

Quote:
Sondahl says he is familiar with Grand-Pre's allegations. "I know he claims he knows our pilots, which is false. I know he claims he knows our adjustant general, which is false," he says. "I know everything he has claimed about Lieutenent Colonel Rick Gibney and the 119th Fighter Wing is complete crap."

General Shelton, who is now retired, also refutes Frand-Pre's claims. "I don't know this individual," Shelton tells Popular Mechanics. "The name doesn't ring a bell and I certainly never saw a report that he rendered alleging there was some type of conspiracy or that National Guard pilot shot down [Flight 93]." Shelton continues" I have a reputation for being candid, and I had seen a paper like that or heard a story like that, I would tell you, and I would tell you what I did with it. I never heard anything that was anything close to what he was saying. From my perspective, all that is hogwash."
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Last edited by JamesB; 2nd October 2006 at 08:18 AM. Reason: added quote
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Old 2nd October 2006, 09:46 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by JamesB View Post
Now that the JREF ninjas have helped expose one military fraud, this guy has been bugging me for a while.

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com...grand-pre.html

Can anyone do an FOIA on him, or at least explain to me how to? He is popping up in conspiracy circles everywhere the "scholars", the "veterans", Alex Jones, even the American Free Press' little holocaust denial fest.
JamesB:

THis site:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...13/MN11636.DTL

gives good info on how to request military records under FOIA. IN fact, they even link to an FOIA generator that will write up the request for you (you just have to print/copy it and send it to the relevent government org...it provides contact info).
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Old 2nd October 2006, 10:22 AM   #18
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Doesnt this guy smell an aweful lot like an older version of our friend Chavez?

TAM
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Old 2nd October 2006, 11:11 AM   #19
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Quote:
He took off from Fargo, N.D., and flew to Bozeman, Mont., to pick up Ed Jacoby Jr., the director of the New York State Emergency Management Office. Gibney then flew Jacoby from Montana to Albany, N.Y., so Jacoby could coordinate 17,000 rescue workers engaged in the state's response to 9/11. Jacoby confirms the day's events. "I was in Big Sky for an emergency managers meeting. Someone called to say an F-16 was landing in Bozeman. From there we flew to Albany."
[derail]
It was the worst day of the 21st century, I have noything but respect and sympathy for those who lost family and loved ones that day.

That being said, is anyone else reading that thinking a personal chauffer driven F-16 would be cool as all hell?
[/derail]

EDIT: This was my 666th post, the NWO obviously made me do it.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 12:45 PM   #20
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Grand Pre -> Grand Prix ??
Somehow when I read his name, it felt funny allready.

the 119th fighter wing sounds funny to... 119th -> 9/11 ??
Thet are based in North Dakota
http://www.happyhooligans.com/
so what would they be doing in Pennsylvania?
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Old 2nd October 2006, 12:48 PM   #21
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http://www.whtt.org/popupdetails.php?popup=1&prodId=17

Quote:
BARBARIANS INSIDE THE GATES
Colonel Donn de Grand Pre'
Colonel Donn de Grand Pre, while serving as arms negotiator in the Pentagon, received a wake-up call from President Gerald Ford soon after the second attempt on his life. Ford said, 'Something has gone terribly wrong in our country when a president can no longer walk among the people.' This jarred Donn from his pursuit of striving to become the world's leading arms peddler. Disillusioned with our government's course, both at home and abroad, Donn exited Washington, DC to begin an intensive research program which slowly revealed an enemy already inside the gates, totally dedicated to the destruction of our sovereignty as a nation-state and the enslavement or extermination of all who might block their despotic plans for World domination. His thesis is since WWII, and the unconstitutionally waged wars that for whatever reason, caused a net loss of political power and have diverted our attention away from the true enemy within, contriving an enemy outside our borders. He defines the enemy and tactics in detail and what we must do to defeat the enemy and restore our republic under the Constitution. -Hardcover [ printer seconds ] c. 2000 425 pages
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Old 2nd October 2006, 12:49 PM   #22
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They may have been responsible for the MidWest States. There weren't that many squadrons designated to protecting the Continental US.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:04 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
Doesnt this guy smell an aweful lot like an older version of our friend Chavez?

TAM
Which is why I thought to bring the subject up now. He claims to know everyone, and nobody knows him. I don't know he is a fake, but I would like to find out one way or another.

He claims to have been in the OSS during WWII, but there is no record of this.

http://www.osssociety.org/

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin...mes;read=45174
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:07 PM   #24
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Well perhaps we should keep a list of who he says he knows and a seperate list of those on the first list who deny knowing him or deny his claims. There were a couple mentioned above already.

TAM
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:20 PM   #25
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It's funny in a sad way, when a shady CT military officer claims he knows who shot down UA93, the deniers hang to every word. But when witnesses say they saw AA77 crash, they are obvious lying and shills. I still haven't figured out how the deniers seperate fraud from fact. Well, not by logical means, that is.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:40 PM   #26
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I did a little sniffing on the publisher

Chosen Books are a divison of of Baker Publishing

Their mission statement

Ever since the 1971 publication of The Hiding Place by Corrie ten Boom, Chosen Books has been publishing powerful books that help millions to live the Spirit-filled life.

They are subsequently owned by Baker Publishing who list Cambridge Universty Press as part of their portfolio in North America.

He has also released two other fiction books

The boys from Bent Willow: A saga of World War II in 2003

Look homeward cowboy: A saga of World War II in 2002


For the life of me - I cant find any review, discussion or extract of these books anywhere on the net. They must exist because they have been assigned ISBN numbers

Last edited by MG1962; 2nd October 2006 at 01:47 PM.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:42 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Bell View Post
Grand Pre -> Grand Prix ??
Somehow when I read his name, it felt funny allready.
Grand Pre National Historic Park, Nova Scotia

But I agree that Donn de Grand Pre is probably a pseudonym.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 01:50 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by CurtC View Post
Grand Pre National Historic Park, Nova Scotia

But I agree that Donn de Grand Pre is probably a pseudonym.
Ah, Great Meadow. But it still sounds funny

It's difficult to find anything unbiased on him, when you Google his name, all you get is PrisonPlanet, AFP, and hellalot 9/11 deniers sites.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 03:40 PM   #29
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If it's an anagram, here are the possible choices. Excluding Colonel.

AD REDDEN GNP NOR
AD REDDEN GNP RON
AD DEN END GNP ORR
AD DEN REND PRONG
AD DEN REND GNP OR
AD DEN RED GNP NOR
AD DEN RED GNP RON
AD END REND PRONG
AD END REND GNP OR
AD END RED GNP NOR
AD END RED GNP RON
AD REND RED GNP NO
AD REND RED GNP ON
ADD RENDER GNP NO
ADD RENDER GNP ON
ADD DREG PENN NOR
ADD DREG PENN RON
ADD DEN ERR GNP NO
ADD DEN ERR GNP ON
ADD END ERR GNP NO
ADD END ERR GNP ON
DAD RENDER GNP NO
DAD RENDER GNP ON
DAD DREG PENN NOR
DAD DREG PENN RON
DAD DEN ERR GNP NO
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DAD END ERR GNP ON
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ADDEND ERR GNP NO
ADDEND ERR GNP ON
DEAD REND GNP NOR
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DAN REND DROP ENG
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AND REDDEN PRONG
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AND REND DROP ENG
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RAND DEED GNP NOR
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RAND PEND REND GO
RAND PEND DON ERG
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RAND REND GOD PEN
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RAND REND DON PEG
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RAND RED GOD PENN
RAND RED DOG PENN
RAND RED POND ENG
DARN DEED GNP NOR
DARN DEED GNP RON
DARN REDDEN PONG
DARN DOD ERG PENN
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DARN REND GOD PEN
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DARN REND DON PEG
DARN REND NOD PEG
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DARN RED GOD PENN
DARN RED DOG PENN
DARN RED POND ENG
PAD DREG REND NON
GARNER DODD PENN
NAG DODD PENN ERR
NAG DEN REND DROP
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NAG PEND REND ROD
NAG REND RED POND
PANG DEN REND ROD
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PANG REND RED DON
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AN DREG REND POND
NAN DREG DEN DROP
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NAN DREG PEND ROD
NAN DREG REND POD
NAN DREG RED POND
ANN DREG DEN DROP
ANN DREG DEN PROD
ANN DREG END DROP
ANN DREG END PROD
ANN DREG PEND ROD
ANN DREG REND POD
ANN DREG RED POND
PAN DREG REND DON
PAN DREG REND NOD
NAP DREG REND DON
NAP DREG REND NOD
RAN DODD ERG PENN
RAN DOD DREG PENN
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RAN DREG DEN POND
RAN DREG END POND
RAN DREG PEND DON
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RAN PEND REND GOD
RAN PEND REND DOG
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Old 2nd October 2006, 04:04 PM   #30
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The following info comes up from doing a reverse directory search (using the number he published during the AJ interview).

Grand Pre Donn
1681 Wilderness Rd
Culpeper, VA 22735-3623
(540) 547-2996


A small but odd thing, to me anyway, is that he went out of his way to correct his surname in the AJ interview (by pointing out that Grand-Pre is hyphenated) and yet all of his book covers are missing the hyphen.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 04:24 PM   #31
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He also seems to have added the "de" somewhere along the line.
Since his earlier books were Donn Grand Pre, and his airport (and now the reverse search) yield Donn Grand Pre, I guess we can assume that's the name. But whether it's a nom de plume or alias has yet to be seen.

The various book reviews and blurbs seem to have him all over the political landscape. He says he came back to gov't service to work for Bob MacNamara, presumably under Johnson. Then somewhere later he is said to have worked for Ford and Carter, yet one blurb has him quitting when he saw the light in a conversation with Gerald Ford. What happened during the Nixon years? And why is he introduced as working for Carter when he seems to have quit before Carter came in?

Mind you, the reviews are from notoriously unreliable sources. They may have extracted comments from other whack-job sites, because the AJ interview was picked up almost everywhere.

Most interesting - his original 72 hour think-tank seems to have been held within a month of 9/11? If this is so, shouldn't the troofers be erecting statues to the guy? He's the first nutjob theorist out of the starting gate!

And why a 72 hour non-stop gabfest? Were they under pressure? Was the Illuminati wet team storming the gate? This seems a bit of stupid drama. The original postings of the report are all identical, and rather shoddily patched together. I don't doubt it's his work, but all the more reason to question.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 04:35 PM   #32
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GRAND DON RED PEN (wasn't on the list)

Sounds like some obscure mobster.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 04:52 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by MG1962 View Post
I did a little sniffing on the publisher

Chosen Books are a divison of of Baker Publishing

Their mission statement

Ever since the 1971 publication of The Hiding Place by Corrie ten Boom, Chosen Books has been publishing powerful books that help millions to live the Spirit-filled life.

They are subsequently owned by Baker Publishing who list Cambridge Universty Press as part of their portfolio in North America.

He has also released two other fiction books

The boys from Bent Willow: A saga of World War II in 2003

Look homeward cowboy: A saga of World War II in 2002


For the life of me - I cant find any review, discussion or extract of these books anywhere on the net. They must exist because they have been assigned ISBN numbers
Can I suggest that you PM Library Lady or Zakur at this forum? They are librarians and may be able to assist.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 05:05 PM   #34
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If he worked for all these people, would a simple FOIA request yield where he worked and when?

TAM
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Old 2nd October 2006, 06:18 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by CptColumbo View Post
If it's an anagram, here are the possible choices. Excluding Colonel.
Bah. Missed: Nerd N. Pendragon (using the donn de grand pre version)

Obviously his true name.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 09:06 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
He also seems to have added the "de" somewhere along the line.
Since his earlier books were Donn Grand Pre, and his airport (and now the reverse search) yield Donn Grand Pre, I guess we can assume that's the name. But whether it's a nom de plume or alias has yet to be seen.
A little touch of Peterson Dunlap syndrome, perhaps?
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Old 3rd October 2006, 06:21 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by T.A.M. View Post
If he worked for all these people, would a simple FOIA request yield where he worked and when?

TAM
Possibly, I haven't yet heard anything back on mine so I'm not sure.

I believe it would give at least generalities, though...and things such as classified assignments would still be listed, just without any details (i.e., something like 1998-2000, details not releaseable or something...they mentioned this in the article I posted earlier).

When I get a response back, I'll know more
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Old 6th October 2006, 06:05 PM   #38
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Bump for good reason. This deserves more attention, and while waiting for some answers, the subject of Colonel Donn should be seen by anyone who isn't aware of him, yet.
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Old 30th October 2006, 10:39 PM   #39
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I ran across this Grand Pre interview on the veterans for 9/11 truth site. He is now claiming that General Pace is a good friend of his, and that 70% of senior military officers and NCOs support a coup against the Bush administration (sometime in the next 2 months). Oh, and the number one cause of terrorism in the world is the Israelis who have been causing problems for 85 years and have infiltrated the highest reaches of our government.

http://www.freedomisforeverybody.org...d-Pre%2064.mp3
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Old 30th October 2006, 10:41 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by JamesB View Post
I ran across this Grand Pre interview on the veterans for 9/11 truth site. He is now claiming that General Pace is a good friend of his, and that 70% of senior military officers and NCOs support a coup against the Bush administration (sometime in the next 2 months). Oh, and the number one cause of terrorism in the world is the Israelis who have been causing problems for 85 years and have infiltrated the highest reaches of our government.

http://www.freedomisforeverybody.org...d-Pre%2064.mp3
Well, as long as he isn't crazy.
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The tools of conquest do not necessarily come with bombs and explosions and fallout. There are weapons that are simply thoughts, attitudes, prejudices to be only found in the minds of men. Prejudices and suspicion can destroy, and a thoughtless frightened search for a scapegoat has a fallout all its own.--Rod Serling
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