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Old 3rd April 2007, 01:52 AM   #1
ref
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Something odd about Lt. Col. Guy S. Razer

Yet another military person has come out to support the truth movement.

http://www.911blogger.com/node/7482

Quote:
Lt. Col. Guy S. Razer, MS, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Retired U.S. Air Force fighter pilot (F-111, F-15E, F-16, B-1, F-18, Mig-29, and Suu-22). Flew combat missions over Iraq. Former instructor at the USAF Fighter Weapons School and NATO’s Tactical Leadership Program.

After 4+ years of research since retirement in 2002, I am 100% convinced that the attacks of September 11, 2001 were planned, organized, and committed by treasonous perpetrators that have infiltrated the highest levels of our government. It is now time to take our country back.

The "collapse" of WTC Building 7 [570 feet tall, 47 stories, and not hit by an airplane] shows beyond any doubt that the demolitions were pre-planned. There is simply no way to demolish a 47-story building (on fire) over a coffee break. It is also impossible to report the building’s collapse before it happened, as BBC News did, unless it was pre-planned. Further damning evidence is Larry Silverstein's video taped confession in which he states "they made that decision to pull [WTC 7] and we watched the building collapse."

We cannot let the pursuit of justice fail. Those of us in the military took an oath to "support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic". Just because we have retired does not make that oath invalid, so it is not just our responsibility, it is our duty to expose the real perpetrators of 9/11 and bring them to justice, no matter how hard it is, how long it takes, or how much we have to suffer to do it.

But who is this guy? I found no info about him. Only that he is on the patriotsquoestion911 list, and stj911.org members list. No photos, no other personal info, nothing.

We have a retired airforce pilot, so I suspected he would talk about NORAD and the military response. But no, he only talks about WTC 7 and repeats all the classic lies. No mention of NORAD or military.

He repeats the classic lines "treasonous perpetrators that have infiltrated the highest levels of our government", "support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic" and "expose the real perpetrators of 9/11 and bring them to justice". Does this sound familiar to you? I've heard them a hundred thousand times. Classic Alex Jones material. Sounds almost manufactured by the Jones/Prisonplanet fearmongering factory.

If he is a USAF guy, why has he flown a Russian manufactured fighter MIG, and what is SUU-22? These might be stupid questions, but I just wondered.

I'm not saying this guy is a fraud. He might just be a mislead person who took the CT bait.

But the question that arised is, could it be possible that the truth movement would boost their rankings by adding fictional personalities to their lists? They lie all the time anyway. Why not add a few credible sounding people, who comment topics such as WTC 7 but not military actions, although they are fighter pilots. And repeat all the classic lies and catch phrases.
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Last edited by ref; 3rd April 2007 at 01:56 AM.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 01:56 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Guy Razer
The "collapse" of WTC Building 7 [570 feet tall, 47 stories, and not hit by an airplane] shows beyond any doubt that the demolitions were pre-planned. There is simply no way to demolish a 47-story building (on fire) over a coffee break. It is also impossible to report the building’s collapse before it happened, as BBC News did, unless it was pre-planned. Further damning evidence is Larry Silverstein's video taped confession in which he states "they made that decision to pull [WTC 7] and we watched the building collapse."
Guy, meet Occam. Occam, Guy.


Somebody's canopy didn't pop before he ejected!


Edit: I wonder if he's this "Guy."

Quote:
Guy Razer of Arkansas pleaded guilty to the trespassing charge on Monday. He also must pay $25 in fines and $191 in court costs, but he said he does not regret what he did.

I regret that I didn't get to do what I wanted to do, he said Monday. My real intention was to go in there and glue it (the monument) down.
If he is, someone needs to tell him about the fourth Commandment.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 02:42 AM   #3
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The USAF purchased about 20-odd MiG-29s from Moldova.

The Su-22 is the 'export' version of the Su-17. They were exported to a number of countries, but he doesn't say where he flew one - though it is quite possible that he has.

Since he says he was an instructor at the USAF FWS, that should be fairly easy to check.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 02:50 AM   #4
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It's possible he could've flown the F/A-18(a Navy/Marines Corp jet) as an instructor, but I think both the United States Navy Fighter Weapons SchoolWP and the United States Air Force Weapons SchoolWP still operate the F-5 and T-38 as Aggressors. The wiki entry for TopGun states that F-16s have been added to simulate the MiG-29 and Su-27....not F-18s. Don't know how else he would've flown a Navy aircraft in the Air Force.

Last edited by apathoid; 3rd April 2007 at 02:54 AM. Reason: clarified
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Old 3rd April 2007, 02:51 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Obviousman View Post
The USAF purchased about 20-odd MiG-29s from Moldova.

The Su-22 is the 'export' version of the Su-17. They were exported to a number of countries, but he doesn't say where he flew one - though it is quite possible that he has.
Ok. Thanks for that info.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 03:00 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gravy View Post
Edit: I wonder if he's this "Guy."

If he is, someone needs to tell him about the fourth Commandment.

Glue the monument down. Right.. Bright idea. Well, the WTC 7 claims made by the OP Guy are not bright either. I smell something here
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Old 3rd April 2007, 03:17 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by ref View Post
Yet another military person has come out to support the truth movement.

http://www.911blogger.com/node/7482




But who is this guy? I found no info about him. Only that he is on the patriotsquoestion911 list, and stj911.org members list. No photos, no other personal info, nothing.

We have a retired airforce pilot, so I suspected he would talk about NORAD and the military response. But no, he only talks about WTC 7 and repeats all the classic lies. No mention of NORAD or military.
If he is part of the US military, he'll end up being chased on the massive conspiracy which had the US airforce at it's heart. They must have been involved in the two missing airliners (though the army probably took care of disposing of the missing passengers).

It would be quite typical for the movement to get a real expert in, and to corral him into the areas about which he knows nothing. A genuine colonel might have some interesting insights in how two aircraft could be disappeared, and aircraft wreckage distributed.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 03:23 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Obviousman View Post
The USAF purchased about 20-odd MiG-29s from Moldova.

The Su-22 is the 'export' version of the Su-17. They were exported to a number of countries, but he doesn't say where he flew one - though it is quite possible that he has.

Since he says he was an instructor at the USAF FWS, that should be fairly easy to check.
My preliminary InvestigooglingTM suggests that the MiG-29 purchase was to keep the MiGs from falling into the wrong hands and to eyeball the various systems.

Quote:
In 1997, the United States purchased 21 Moldovan aircraft for evaluation and analysis, under the Cooperative Threat Reduction accord. Fourteen of the aircraft were the 'Fulcrum-C' model, which is equipped with an active radar jammer in its spine and is capable of being armed with nuclear weapons. Part of the United States motive to purchase the Moldovan MiG-29s, was to prevent these aircraft from being sold to Iran[1]. In late 1997, the MiGs were delivered to the National Air Intelligence Center (NAIC) at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base near Dayton, Ohio. One former Moldovan 'Fulcrum-C' is currently stored in a restoration hangar belonging to the National Museum of the United States Air Force at Wright-Patterson, and another is on display at the base itself. The fate of all the former Moldovan MiG-29s is unknown, although many are believed to have been scrapped.
From the MiG-29 wiki. It doesn't appear that they were used in any training or operational capacity. Maybe LTC Razer was a ferry pilot for one of them?

I don't think the USAF would have any use for the Su-22, though it's probable that at least a few Soviet pilots defected in them.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 03:25 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by apathoid View Post
My preliminary InvestigooglingTM suggests that the MiG-29 purchase was to keep the MiGs from falling into the wrong hands and to eyeball the various systems.

From the MiG-29 wiki. It doesn't appear that they were used in any training or operational capacity. Maybe LTC Razer was a ferry pilot for one of them?

I don't think the USAF would have any use for the Su-22, though it's probable that at least a few Soviet pilots defected in them.

Yep, I found it rather surprising, that USAF would use Russian fighters in any occasion.

ETA: Of course, he could have flown them somewhere. But he is dead wrong about WTC 7, a parrot.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 03:34 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by ref View Post
Yep, I found it rather surprising, that USAF would use Russian fighters in any occasion.
They don't even use Navy fighters(F-18).

IMO, there's a small chance that he flew either the F-18, MiG-29, or Su-22. The chances that he flew all of them.....?
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Old 3rd April 2007, 05:04 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by westprog View Post
(though the army probably took care of disposing of the missing passengers).

we did NAH - ZING!
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Old 3rd April 2007, 05:14 AM   #12
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which guys' razer is he? That name and being a (certainly) lying rectum of a troofer make me just a little suspicious.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 05:27 AM   #13
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Okay, real simple here. He is not saying that he is a whistle-blower or has insider information into what happened. Ergo, that he was a fighter pilot is moot and is a fallacious appeal to authority. So he bought in to the Alex Jones spiel, so what? He's a fighter pilot, not a Vulcan.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 05:27 AM   #14
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Being an ex-Army ground pounder I'm not going to pretent to know the ins and outs of the AF. However, the Mig part doesn't bother me, but being a "fighter" pilot and having stick time on the B-1 does. A buddy of mine was a Navy pilot on the Kitty Hawk moons ago, I'll give him a ring see what he thinks.

As mentioned though, talking about WTC7 and not about Norad protocols etc seems a little odd.

Regardless, let's say this guy is what he says he is.......if people think you can't be a little "touched" because you served in the military.....well people who think that haven't served in the military lol.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 06:14 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Wartrac View Post
Being an ex-Army ground pounder I'm not going to pretent to know the ins and outs of the AF. However, the Mig part doesn't bother me, but being a "fighter" pilot and having stick time on the B-1 does. A buddy of mine was a Navy pilot on the Kitty Hawk moons ago, I'll give him a ring see what he thinks.
It would be very unlikely that he flew both fighters and bombers. The pilots are trained in a specific type of aircraft, with fighters being the most desired, because they are far different. They do not want jack-of-all-trades pilots, but experts at their respective aircraft.

Also, like others have mentioned, he most likely would not fly Navy aircraft. The only possibility might be if he had been stationed at the Reykjavik Naval Air Station in Iceland and flew missions there. I am not even sure what aircraft they have there, though the three times I was there it had some cargo planes and layovers.

ETA: My mistake, the NAS in Iceland only housed USAF planes (F-15, refuelers), some rescue helicopters and some anti-sub airplanes.

Last edited by Disbelief; 3rd April 2007 at 06:32 AM.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 06:30 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Disbelief View Post
It would be very unlikely that he flew both fighters and bombers. The pilots are trained in a specific type of aircraft, with fighters being the most desired, because they are far different. They do not want jack-of-all-trades pilots, but experts at their respective aircraft.

Also, like others have mentioned, he most likely would not fly Navy aircraft. The only possibility might be if he had been stationed at the Rejkavik Naval Air Station in Iceland and flew missions there. I am not even sure what aircraft they have there, though the three times I was there it had some cargo planes and layovers.
Some info about the Keflavik, Iceland Air Base.

http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/ice/usforces.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Air_Station_Keflavik
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Old 3rd April 2007, 06:33 AM   #17
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Call me a contrarian, but at this stage I'd be much more impressed with a high ranking officer who deals with logistics saying there was a conspiracy than some F-jockey.

"Missing planes? Absent missiles? Well, here's how you could do it..."
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Old 3rd April 2007, 06:41 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by ref View Post
If he is a USAF guy, why has he flown a Russian manufactured fighter MIG, and what is SUU-22? These might be stupid questions, but I just wondered.
He might have flown them on an exchange tour, as part of a Test Pilot School program (one of my guys who was a TPS instructor went to Russia to fly a few Russian Helicopters as part of the TPS syllabus and NATO Partnership for Peace program) or as an adversary instructor in Nellis. (But I don't recall if the USAF has adversary Russian planes, I am pretty sure they don't. )

As far as flying F-18's, there were some Air Force instructors at Strike U as part of an interservice exchange program. Not sure if Strike U still has them. (Top Gun is now part of Strike U, it no longer is based in Mirimar NAS San Diego, that's a Marine Base now thanks to El Toro and Tustin shutting down.) I worked for a General who served as a back seater in F-14's on one of his assignments with the Navy. He was an Air Force General. The interservice deal isn't as far fetched as some of you might think.

As to the rest, if this guy is for real, then we have someone whose trust in politicians has been shattered. Smedley Butler likewise became a bitter opponent of the Congressional Financial Complex when he retired from the Marine Corps.

If this guy is not for real, then it really doesn't matter.

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Old 3rd April 2007, 06:56 AM   #19
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So is the Trooth movement so pathetic, that every time a person in the military falls for it, that's news?

I think they're hoping that people with poor critical thinking skills get this confused, and think that a whistleblower with inside information has come forward.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 07:25 AM   #20
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The F-111, B-1 and F-16? That makes no sense.

These are three very different types of planes. It would be like a doctor who specialized in cardiology, pediatrics and neurology. It would be like a family law attorney who does mergers and acquisitions.

Just about the only thing an F-16 pilot could do in the cockpit of a B-1 is yank and bank, stall, overstress the airplane and rip the wings off.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 07:30 AM   #21
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If 'Howling Mad' Murdoch could fly anything in the sky, surely this guy could?

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Old 3rd April 2007, 07:44 AM   #22
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I wonder if this is the same "Guy."

Anyway, aside from the issue with the fact he claims to have flown both fighters and bombers, the only info I can find on variations of the name is conspiracy web site crap with the same info.

Anyone know a way to check a list of former Air Force personnel? I don't need a service record, just name verification.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 07:59 AM   #23
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I find it odd that he retired in 2002. You figure he may actually get a chance to use his skills and he leaves. Better yet the military is headed to war and they let an experienced pilot leave? I am by far no expert on the military but you think he would have stayed for at least 1 tour in Afganistan.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 09:18 AM   #24
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Before reading Stolen Valor by B.G. Burkett and Fake Warriors by Henry Mark Holzer, I used to wonder about guys like Razer. Now, I just assume that they're fakes.

http://www.stolenvalor.com/
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Old 3rd April 2007, 09:29 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
The F-111, B-1 and F-16? That makes no sense.

These are three very different types of planes. It would be like a doctor who specialized in cardiology, pediatrics and neurology. It would be like a family law attorney who does mergers and acquisitions.

Just about the only thing an F-16 pilot could do in the cockpit of a B-1 is yank and bank, stall, overstress the airplane and rip the wings off.
I am sorry, but you are insulting pilots here.

Pilots know how to fly different planes, particulary if they go through the FTU to transition to new planes. Or, do you insist that no fighter pilot could fly a bus -- sorry 757? Guess what? There are hundreds, hell, thousands, of them doing it today, in the not so friendly skies of our ARTCC system. Ask beachnut, if you don't believe me.

The F-111 community began to leach people out of it in the late early 1990's, then the EF-111's shut down. Meanwhile, B-1 and F-16 were robust enough to keep alive. It is sometimes cheaper for the Air Force to transition a pilot than to create a new one.

If this Razer guy started as an F-111 pilot, going to either B-1, or F-16, or both is not much of a stretch, pilot wise. Depends on which guard unit or wing needed an experienced pilot. Also, he may have flown in multiple aircraft when he was assigned to the FWS at Nellis.

I flew in helicopters, and instructed in both helicopters and fixed wing trainers. No, I never tried to do a loop in a helicopter, but I taught people how to do them in fixed wing trainers.

DR
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Old 3rd April 2007, 09:32 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by firecoins View Post
I find it odd that he retired in 2002. You figure he may actually get a chance to use his skills and he leaves. Better yet the military is headed to war and they let an experienced pilot leave? I am by far no expert on the military but you think he would have stayed for at least 1 tour in Afganistan.
WHy do you think that? LTC's don't control whether or not the country goes to war. He may well have had his career plan beyond tghe Air Force mapped out well before 9-11.

That data point is irrelevant. He also may haver retired due to principle, in believing that the war in Iraq was immoral, or whatever.

Ever hear of LTGEN Newbold?

DR
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Old 3rd April 2007, 10:53 AM   #27
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Rob Riggle, the guy on the Daily Show, was an inactive reservist on 9/11 after spending years in the Marines. He was activated and spent a year in Afganistan. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1443527/

I am wondering why this guy wasn't kept on for the Afganistan invasion.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 01:33 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
The F-111, B-1 and F-16? That makes no sense.

These are three very different types of planes. It would be like a doctor who specialized in cardiology, pediatrics and neurology. It would be like a family law attorney who does mergers and acquisitions.
This, I would agree with.

I find it especially amusing tht all these aircraft listed are the "sharp end of the spear". They are all frontline combat planes. While he's clearly claiming to be rated for four engines, he lists no cargo haulers among his certifications.

While I'm not saying that Col. Razer is a fraud for cewrtain, it is common among those who are frauds to try to sex up thier false resumes with all combat related stuff. You never hear about any of these jokers claiming to be a former commander of a C5 squadron or something in logistics.

Quote:
Just about the only thing an F-16 pilot could do in the cockpit of a B-1 is yank and bank, stall, overstress the airplane and rip the wings off.
I feel this borders on CT reasoning. Anyone with a multi-engine rating should be perfectly capable of guiding a B-1 to the point where the Electronic Warfare Officer and Weapons Officer take over and do their thing.

It's like saying Hani Hanjour couldn't have smeared a 757 all over the side of the widest building in DC.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 07:45 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth View Post
I feel this borders on CT reasoning. Anyone with a multi-engine rating should be perfectly capable of guiding a B-1 to the point where the Electronic Warfare Officer and Weapons Officer take over and do their thing.

It's like saying Hani Hanjour couldn't have smeared a 757 all over the side of the widest building in DC.

My only point was that the aircraft are different enough to make one really wonder about the guy's Air Force career path. Unless he's Will Smith in Independence Day, chances are he can't fly any damn thing he happens to jump into.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 08:15 PM   #30
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But hey, even if he is a fake, you have to admit that Guy Razer is a cool name for a fighter pilot.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 09:22 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
My only point was that the aircraft are different enough to make one really wonder about the guy's Air Force career path. Unless he's Will Smith in Independence Day, chances are he can't fly any damn thing he happens to jump into.
I know a guy who went from flying A-10s here at Davis-Monthan to flying B-2s. Other than going from fixed-wing to rotary (or vice-versa) I can't think of a more radical jump, but this guy did it. Based on that (admittedly small) sample, I don't think I can rule out Guy Razor's claimed list of aircraft flown.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 09:41 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by JamesB View Post
But hey, even if he is a fake, you have to admit that Guy Razer is a cool name for a fighter pilot.
Unless he pronounces it "Gee," like the only Guy I know.
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Old 3rd April 2007, 11:04 PM   #33
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I took a look at the public records available at Military.com. There is a retired Lt.Col. fighter pilot named Guy S. Razer listed. No further details of his career.
The aircraft listed in the bio above as those he flew would be very unusual, but not impossible for one pilot. I would speculate that only a graduate of Test Pilot School would have occasion to fly all those types. A later assignment to Fighters Weapons Wing at Nellis would not be unlikely for a test pilot. The NATO assignment could easily account or the MiG-29 and Su-22, either former East German aircraft (which were kept operational by the Luftwaffe for a time), or former Warsaw Pact country aircraft.
One oddity in the bio is a pilot with that experience level retiring during wartime.

All that said (as I said in the thread about Dan Davis) I think what he is said to have said about 9/11 is rubbish.

Robert Klaus
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Old 3rd April 2007, 11:32 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Pope130 View Post
One oddity in the bio is a pilot with that experience level retiring during wartime.
It's not necessarily odd for a number of reasons:

1) He could have reached an age where it was either up or out and they just didn't have a place to put him with other pilots coming up behind him.
2) He could have reached an age where he felt ready to move on. AFAIK, there's not a significant USAF pilot shortage so they probably wouldn't have reason to force him to stay, and it's not like they're going to transfer him to the Army and put him in a tank or APC.
3) Combined with 2, he could have had a job ready to go and, war or not, he'd put in his time and wanted to try the civilian life (likely better pay and definitely better hours).

Given the number of years one would usually put in going from 2nd Lieutenant to Lieutenant Colonel, I wouldn't question the retirement of any officer of that rank.

The above, of course, doesn't mean that it's not all a crock, but it doesn't seem "hinky" on its face.
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Old 4th April 2007, 01:57 AM   #35
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You know...

I cringe every time I see "[the building]" or "[WTC7]" added into that quote. Makes me sick.
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Old 4th April 2007, 02:00 AM   #36
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Anyone with £12,000 burning a hole in their Ebay-purchased flightsuit can fly a MiG-29. The F/A-18 is more suspicious, as already pointed out.
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Old 4th April 2007, 02:29 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Pope130 View Post
I took a look at the public records available at Military.com. There is a retired Lt.Col. fighter pilot named Guy S. Razer listed. No further details of his career.
The aircraft listed in the bio above as those he flew would be very unusual, but not impossible for one pilot. I would speculate that only a graduate of Test Pilot School would have occasion to fly all those types. A later assignment to Fighters Weapons Wing at Nellis would not be unlikely for a test pilot. The NATO assignment could easily account or the MiG-29 and Su-22, either former East German aircraft (which were kept operational by the Luftwaffe for a time), or former Warsaw Pact country aircraft.
One oddity in the bio is a pilot with that experience level retiring during wartime.

All that said (as I said in the thread about Dan Davis) I think what he is said to have said about 9/11 is rubbish.

Robert Klaus
I almost totally agree. F-111 to B-1? Not a problem. F-16 / F-18? Not a problem (e.g. he may have done a tour with a USN / USMC squadron - or a RAAF squadron). MiG-29 / Su-22? A little less likely but certainly not impossible - especially if he is just saying "I did a hop or two in it" rather than flying it for an extended length of time.

Going from bombers to fighters is unusual, but certainly not unheard of.

I'm unsure of the US forces, but I wouldn't see anything strange about the guy paying off in 2002. Perhaps his ROSO was up; perhaps he reached retiring age. Who knows?

As people have mentioned, so far it's just another guy with an opinion: no more or less important than anyone elses.

If he starts to offer expert opinion (i.e. aircraft performance, military capability, etc) then his credentials come into play. Then it would be prudent to check and see if he does actually have the background to speak as an expert in that field.
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Old 4th April 2007, 03:30 AM   #38
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It's kind of weird that he calls himself a "USAF fighter pilot" considering he only lists one aircraft which is a USAF fighter - the F-16. All of the other aircraft are a combination of non-air force and strike aircraft.

Surely someone with a career of that nature would refer to themselves as an "Air Force Strike Pilot" or similar.

In addition, why would somone include Russian aircraft in the brackets after "USAF fighter pilot"? Normally such an inclusion would indicate the list of aircraft you flew as a USAF fighter pilot, not any aircraft you might randomly have flown once. Does he list the aircraft he did his basic in? His jet conversion? He must have seen many hours in these aircraft. And yet he sees fit to mention a 1960's era Russian ground attack aircraft. Why?

And last of all, what does it matter? All this guy mentions, after "4+ years of research" is the WTC7 canon - not hit by aircraft, "pull it", and most suspicious of all, the recently discovered "BBC goof".

He's not a structural engineer. He wasn't even an army engineer. I frankly couldn't care less if he's had 10,000 hours flying every single aircraft ever made in the history of aviation. He lacks the expertise to examine WTC7 independent of other expert assessment.

I wonder how he would feel if a structural engineer started making broad-sweeping statements about flying aircraft.

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Old 4th April 2007, 07:30 AM   #39
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I'd like to reiterate that his claim of being a fighter pilot, and what he flew, are completely moot to his claims regarding 9/11. Spending time trying to figure out if he is, or is not, a fighter pilot has no value in regards to his claims concerning 9/11.

Furthermore, even if it turns out that he is completely fabricating the fighter-pilot background it would not have any bearing on the truth, or falsehood, of his claims regarding 9/11.

Unlike, Chavez, this person is making no claims regarding 9/11 which rely upon his having been in the military. Since his claims regarding 9/11 are nothing new, and nothing that has not already been addressed I don't feel this issue deserves any more energy expended upon it.

My US$0.02
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Old 4th April 2007, 08:59 AM   #40
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I imagine with the technical complexity involved that the issue of piloting aircraft is different from other vehicles, so I don't know if this makes any point or not; but in most MLRS units I've been assigned to, it was a 'strong suggestion' that every driver be rated on every piece of equipment, from the auto-tranny Humm-V to the stick-shift deuce-and a half to the rather odd dual-stick control command post vehicles, to the almost self-driving MLRS vehicle itself, all the way up to the hefty and rather scary M88 recovery vehicle.

You never knew when a crew would be taken out of action, and you were the only person left to recover a piece of equipment from the battlefield, after all.

Still, the principles are very similar in this case, so I doubt it relates to piloting.
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