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Tags John Hagelin , law of attraction , Rhonda Byrne

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Old 8th July 2007, 07:29 AM   #1
yairhol
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Who is Dr. John Hagelin?

Hi gang,

On "The secret" web site appears the biographies of the participants of the DVD. One of them is a physicist called Dr. John Hagelin which is:
"...regarded by many as one of the greatest scientists on the planet today."
http://www.thesecret.tv/teachers.html

Has anyone heard of him?

Regards,
Yair
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:33 AM   #2
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http://hagelin.org/about.html

Now, whether he's actually published any meaningful studies on quantum physics that are peer-reviewed and accepted is another matter...

-Dr. Imago
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:36 AM   #3
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I'm at work now and I am blocked from accessing his web site (can't imagine why).
Care to share?

Regards,
Yair
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:38 AM   #4
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ABOUT DR. JOHN HAGELIN

John Hagelin, Ph.D., is a world-renowned quantum physicist, educator, public policy expert, and leading proponent of peace.

Dr. Hagelin received his A.B. summa cum laude from Dartmouth College and his M.A. and Ph.D. from Harvard University, and conducted pioneering research at CERN (the European Center for Particle Physics) and SLAC (the Stanford Linear Accelerator Center). His scientific contributions in the fields of electroweak unification, grand unification, super-symmetry and cosmology include some of the most cited references in the physical sciences. He is also responsible for the development of a highly successful Grand Unified Field Theory based on the Superstring. Dr. Hagelin is therefore at the pinnacle of achievement among the elite cadre of physicists who have fulfilled Einstein’s dream of a “theory of everything” through their mathematical formulation of the Unified Field—the most advanced scientific knowledge of our time.

But Dr. Hagelin is unique among scientists in being the first to apply this most advanced knowledge for the practical benefit of humankind. He has pioneered the use of Unified Field-based technologies proven to reduce crime, violence, terrorism, and war and to promote peace throughout society—technologies derived from the ancient Vedic science of consciousness. He has published groundbreaking research establishing the existence of long-range “field effects” of consciousness generated through collective meditation, and has shown that large meditating groups can effectively defuse acute societal stress—thereby preventing violence and social conflict, and providing a practical foundation for permanent world peace.

For the last quarter century, Dr. Hagelin has led an international investigation into the nature and origin of consciousness, including higher states of human consciousness. In his seminal book, Manual for a Perfect Government, Dr. Hagelin shows how, through educational programs that develop human consciousness, and through policies and programs that effectively harness the laws of nature, it is possible to solve and to prevent acute social problems, and to profoundly enhance governmental achievements.

In recognition of his outstanding achievements, Dr. Hagelin was named winner of the prestigious Kilby Award, which recognizes scientists who have made “major contributions to society through their applied research in the fields of science and technology.” The award recognized Dr. Hagelin as “a scientist in the tradition of Einstein, Jeans, Bohr and Eddington.”

Dr. Hagelin is currently Director of the Institute of Science, Technology and Public Policy, a leading science and technology think tank, and International Director of the Global Union of Scientists for Peace, an organization of leading scientists throughout the world dedicated to ending nuclear proliferation and establishing lasting world peace. Dr. Hagelin also serves as President of the United States Peace Government, a knowledge-based, complementary government composed of hundreds of America’s top scientists, which advocates proven, prevention-oriented solutions to critical social problems; and Minister of Science and Technology of the Global Country of World Peace, an international organization dedicated to prevention-oriented government, world peace, and global administration through natural law.
http://hagelin.org/about.html

Good scientist gone to the dark side? Or, just someone who's made that dangerous (il)logical leap into thinking he knows and understands more than he actually does?

-Dr. Imago
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:43 AM   #5
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Wow...amazing how apparently a great scientist can take part in such nonsense as "the secret".
I'm speechless....I have no speech.

thanks for the post.

Regards,
Yair
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:49 AM   #6
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He won an IgNobel prize in 1994.
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:58 AM   #7
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Oh right....
Peace - Presented to John Hagelin of Maharishi University and The Institute of Science, Technology and Public Policy, for his experimental conclusion that 4,000 trained meditators caused an 18 percent decrease in violent crime in Washington, D.C.



Regards,
Yair
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Old 8th July 2007, 08:57 AM   #8
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what is the secret?
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Old 8th July 2007, 09:02 AM   #9
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Yair, you posted a reference to an article on "science in the courts" written by Bob Park, there is a brief mention of Hagelin on page 2. If you look in Park's book, Voodoo Science (Oxford, 2000), there is more about Hagelin. (This is an excellent book.)

Basically, Hagelin was a serious physicist doing post-doctoral research at either Stanford or Berkeley. One day, his cheese slipped off his cracker, and he disappeared without a word to anyone. He later surfaced in the company of Maharishi Mahesh Yogi (where he imparted weird ideas about quantum mechanics to Deepack Chopra). He also ran for US President on the Natural Law Party ticket some time ago.

Today, Hagelin is simply bonkers.
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Old 8th July 2007, 09:20 AM   #10
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He has pioneered the use of Unified Field-based technologies proven to reduce crime, violence, terrorism, and war

So we can send him to Iraq?

Double dog dare!
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Old 8th July 2007, 09:44 AM   #11
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Do you think that Hagelin has fibers growing out of sores on his skin? Perhaps particle accelerators have some effect on mold, viruses, and dermatological parasites.

(this is part of my "theory of everything". Stay tuned for more 'links', as they pop into my head- ooo, another link!)
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Old 8th July 2007, 09:52 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
what is the secret?
The 'Secret' is simply asking the universe for something. The steps are as follows:
1. Ask - Ask the universe for what you want
2. Believe - Believe that what you want is already on its way.
3. Receive - Receive what you have asked for.

It's based off of the 'Law of Attraction'. It's really wishful thinking with the coincidence factor.
A short vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usbNJMUZSwo
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Old 8th July 2007, 11:07 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by JJM
Yair, you posted a reference to an article on "science in the courts" written by Bob Park, there is a brief mention of Hagelin on page 2. If you look in Park's book, Voodoo Science (Oxford, 2000), there is more about Hagelin. (This is an excellent book.)
Yeah, I noticed the mention of Hagelin in the article I posted. In fact, I found the article while doing a search on Hagelin.
I didn't know about the book. Thanks for the reference. I'll take a look at it.

Regards,
Yair
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Old 8th July 2007, 04:10 PM   #14
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It looks to me like he worked a little too hard and lost it.
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Old 8th July 2007, 05:40 PM   #15
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Clearly being a scientist confers no immunity against insanity.
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Old 8th July 2007, 06:03 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by kerikiwi View Post
Clearly being a scientist confers no immunity against insanity.
The scientists who I've studied have all been a lot closer to the line than most. Even closer would be the mathematicians.
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Old 8th July 2007, 06:20 PM   #17
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How absolutely classic. The driveby posting skeptoid from hell thinks that most scientists are insane. Now THAT would be signature material, if it were graced with a pejorative.
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:17 PM   #18
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Rest assured Dr Wolf's co-star, John Hagelin, does not entirely* believe The Secret is baloney.

In a March 25th, 2007 Des Moines Register article, reporter Mike Kilen writes*:



"A scientific basis exists for the ideas in "The Secret" but was simplified for the masses, counters John Hagelin, a professor of physics at Maharishi University of Management in Fairfield who is featured in the DVD.

Hagelin said his research has shown that thoughts can affect the physical environment,but advanced training in mind techniques is needed. Advanced practitioners of Transcendental Meditation are currently involved in mass meditation in Fairfield to create world peace.
'The Secret' sells because people don't have to do anything," Hagelin said. "They just have to want a necklace and it will come to them. But so weak an influence is working at the time that they are better off getting a job and buying a necklace."



However Incidentally*, as a follower of Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, many of Dr Hagelin's fellow physicists and researchers have accused him of distorting science to fit his own guru-like agenda.

So, while Dr Hagelin may not think The Secret is complete* baloney, his fellow physicists sure think it is may have reason to disagree*.
http://thesecretlie.blogspot.com/200...ng-secret.html
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Old 8th July 2007, 07:43 PM   #19
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This from another link in another thread...

Quote:

Here
they were -- yogic fliers demonstrating the mechanics of creating peace.
Excellent photo opportunities; the poster said, camera crews were welcome,and all you see are these three young fellows who look like they aresort of hovering. I could not resist this. My office is in the press building,so all I had to do was go upstairs to watch it.

The person leading the whole thing, was Dr. John Hagelin. Well, Dr.
Hagelin is a Physicist. He has a Ph.D. in theoretical physics from Harvard
University, was Summa Cum Laude from Dartmouth, and at one time
worked at the Stanford Linear Accelerator, and published many respectable papers. But the first rule you have to keep in mind is that there is no claim so preposterous that a Ph.D. scientist cannot be found to vouch for it.
Remain alert for this one. Hagelin is now the Chairman of the Physics
Department at Maharishi University. He explained that meditating to create a peace field is very scientific.
http://www.nesl.edu/lawrev/vol36/3/park.pdf
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Old 8th July 2007, 08:08 PM   #20
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John Hagelin was a repeat candidate for President on the Natural Law Party ticket. The NLP is a political front for the Maharishi's "Transcendental Meditation" cult.
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Old 8th July 2007, 11:08 PM   #21
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Great input from all of you. Thanks.
Eos of the Eons, you found some extra nice exerpts from the physicists from the movie. That's a big help.

Regards,
Yair
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Old 9th July 2007, 10:09 PM   #22
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Why do you want to know so much about the nutter anyways?
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Old 9th July 2007, 11:26 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Eos of the Eons
Why do you want to know so much about the nutter anyways?
I'm in the middle of a big e-mail discussion with a friend who is a big "the secret" supporter. All of his reasoning for this theory is pure blind belief mixed with anecdotal evidence. Of course all of my evidence is based on science and research so I had to find out who the is the physicist who supports this theory.

The discussion at first was fruitfall because while he stated all the usuall reasoning for this theory I crushed it one by one. For example he used the reasoning that it can't be false if so many people believe in it. In response I gave him the korean example of fan death belief. So he stopped talking about that. Then he said that humans only use 10% of their brain power so maybe the other 90% can be telepathic, telekinetic etc. In response I quoted a medical source which stated that the 10% is a myth and actually we use all of the brain or almost all of it. So my friend stopped talking about that too. For his anecdotal evidence of brain power and so called radiation coming out of our bodies to detect things paranormal I gave the test results performed on people who thought that they can detect when someone is looking at them. So now he's not talking about that either.
What he is left with now is pure inner belief that the theory works. He says "don't ask me how or why or to give you more evidence. It has worked for me in the past in many cases when I believed strong enough in something and that is all the evidence that I need".
The discussion is now at a place where I have nothing new to add since I'm clearly not talking to reason. He says "science doesn't know everything". Of course science doesn't know everything but that does not mean that we need to be believers in the paranormal. Has science ever prooved that rocks don't have feelings? No. But why should we start believing in that?

I'm afraid it's hopeless. Although one bright light appears in the far far distance. My friend had never come across data which he needed to supply proof of (duh) and he's very impressed with the research that I have done and the proof that I supply for every claim that I make. He says that it's the first time where he had to deal with such strong arguments.
Could there be hope for him?

Regards,
Yair
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Old 10th July 2007, 12:15 PM   #24
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I don't know if there is hope for him, in any sense that he'll just start using the scientific method to evaluate information. Some people don't even know where to start evaluating, some don't even want to know. Wishful thinking is really more fun than reality (although I personally & oddly prefer reality).

I did an experiment on my own classmates. Our teachers would read us emails, and told us we should research stuff like that. So, I researched the emails they read to us on snopes and 'break the chain', and found them (unsurprisingly) very bogus (don't freeze water in plastic bottles, aspartame causes cancer, etc.). I thought that was what my teachers wanted me to do, but they quite often had arguments against what I found (saying aspartame is not "natural", so even though you'll find "natural" methanol/formaldehyde compounds in fruit, it won't cause cancer/Lupus like aspartame will). So, I stopped arguing with them, as they will be evaluating me for practicum postions, etc. But, in the mean time, the other students had learned how to look things up. So I sent them old emails on other myths (sodium lauryl sulfate, antiperspirants, etc.). I guess I caused a panic... ooops. I'm not exactly sure how they feel about me, but uh, I'm not feeling the love

So, if you can sneak in what you can without making yourself enemy #1, then you are doing what you can, where you can. That's admirable. Sometimes I just don't know if I should push it and create problems for myself. Nobody likes a know-it-all, and nobody likes to be shown they are wrong (unless they don't really care-and that would be awesome).

It's a prevailing issue among "skeptics". How far can you push the issue without causing yourself more trouble than it is worth? Do you want to be viewed as the "close-minded" one?

If your friend is still open to talking to you (as some of mine are after I debunk things), then there's hope that you won't piss them off so much that they stop talking to you at least. As for getting them to stop believing in things like the secret altogether, then you're probably bashing your head against a brick wall for nothing.

For now, you can show him that the secret's "experts" are out there, and that it's their opinions and not facts that got them as "experts". These experts are trying to show "something is out there", but failing.

John Hagelin's bouncing "fliers" are not levitating. All the wishful thinking in the world won't get you a brand new car just sitting in the driveway with a wrapped key in the mailbox. Somebody has to make and then buy or win the car. Chances are that if you do enter a draw and wish to win, that one time you might. However, some people want to feel they are in some control of situations like that, and a book is telling them that they can be.

Are these people dumb for believeing that stuff? Most people I know that believe in weird things are not dumb. They just want to believe, and latch onto things that confirm or endorse those beliefs. Some more than others may even accept that there is no basis for them, but it is what they feel is part of them. So, we must accept that everyone is different. Just be glad if you aren't ostracized for pointing out that there is another side to things. I like peppermint ice cream, and others hate it. Some people want to believe the impossible is possible.

As long as your friend isn't rejecting getting a broken bone set because he figures the universe will heal it perfectly as it is (all crushed into splinters and gangrenous) with wishful thinking, then view the conversation as fun. Don't view the conversations/arguments as a goal to change your friend's way of thinking.

The best part is when you can have those conversations and still part friends. Agree to disagree, and one isn't making the other feel as though they are completely stupid. I hate it when someone tells me I'm a moron for not believing their pet belief, and they hate it when you tell them they are stupid for believing their pet belief. Live and let live. C'est la vie.

I only wish more folks could just accept differences and not push their point of view on others in a way that tells them they are stupid and wrong just because they don't agree (or kill each other over simple differences in points of view).
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Old 10th July 2007, 12:54 PM   #25
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He is also responsible for the development of a highly successful Grand Unified Field Theory based on the Superstring. Dr. Hagelin is therefore at the pinnacle of achievement among the elite cadre of physicists who have fulfilled Einstein’s dream of a “theory of everything” through their mathematical formulation of the Unified Field—the most advanced scientific knowledge of our time.
He's solved the Unified Field Theory? Why hasn't he received a Nobel Prize?

He's worked too hard.
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Old 10th July 2007, 08:44 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
what is the secret?
We can't tell you. It's a secret.
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Old 10th July 2007, 10:22 PM   #27
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E of the E, I agree with every word you said.

Originally Posted by Eof the E
Are these people dumb for believeing that stuff? Most people I know that believe in weird things are not dumb. They just want to believe, and latch onto things that confirm or endorse those beliefs. Some more than others may even accept that there is no basis for them, but it is what they feel is part of them. So, we must accept that everyone is different.
My friend is definately not dumb either but wants to believe that he has full control of his life. That It is all solely up to him.

Originally Posted by E of the E
So, if you can sneak in what you can without making yourself enemy #1, then you are doing what you can, where you can. That's admirable. Sometimes I just don't know if I should push it and create problems for myself. Nobody likes a know-it-all, and nobody likes to be shown they are wrong (unless they don't really care-and that would be awesome).
That's a problem I have and I admit it. I get irritated very quickly with woo believers and argue with them to the death. I know for sure that I have lost some would be friends along the way because of this attitude but the skeptical side of me is stronger than my willing to compromise with what I call nonsense (woo).
I think in general women are more willing to compromise. My wife tells me to just let it go and let others believe in whatever nonsense they want to. I admit, I'm not at that point yet.

Originally Posted by E of the E
I only wish more folks could just accept differences and not push their point of view on others in a way that tells them they are stupid and wrong just because they don't agree (or kill each other over simple differences in points of view).
I wish too but how do you do that? How can you hear someone you know talk about the universe and what it will do for you or not do for you but not have a shred of proof for what they are saying? Personally, it drives me nuts.

There was a thread some time ago in this forum about skeptics being loners. I agree with that because most of the people around us have no scientific background or scientific way of thinking (skeptical thinking). So skeptics are trying to make everyone around them understand that words with no sound proof are just words which contradicts what most people would like to think about the world around them. And so us skeptics stay isolated from others unless we have the ability to let go of our skepticism around these people.

Regards,
Yair
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Old 13th July 2007, 03:11 PM   #28
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John H is finally a "president" there does not seem to be a permanent link yet, the date is July 13, 2007 http://bobpark.physics.umd.edu/current_issue.html
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