Bjarne on: Dark Energy, only an illusion.

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You don’t know what happens further inside the black holes since it is black.
That is right. Black holes are black because thay do not emit light. Thank you for admiting that you beliive that black holes are black (have event horizons :jaw-dropp.

There is a lot of energy ion the Jet whereby it is possible that all the energy from matter is converted and blown out by the jet.
Furthermore matter is in the end only contracted space, if matter is ripped completely apart space would just expand a little bit faster the day a star should be completely ripped apart.
There is a lot of energy in the jet. This has nothing to do with matter falling beyond the event horizon.

More ignorance from you:
The force of gravity at the event horizon is not enough to pull matter apart. An astronaut in a spacecraft orbiting just outside the event horzion is Ok. It is not until thay are well within the event horizon that tidal forces start to tear them apart. And you have just admitted that you that you beliive that black holes are black :eye-poppi !

But still you do not know:
  • The cause of black hole
  • How matter deforms space.
  • Why the magnitude of black holes are proportional with the surrounding mass.
But you are stilll ignorant
 
And you have just admitted that you that you beliive that black holes are black !
Why should I not. I have never deny that.


The cause of black hole = mass.
Right but outside the black hole, not from inside, You will get that point the day you understand why the mass surroundings a black hole certainly is proportional with the magnitude of a black hole. That day you understand this you begin to understand d the nature of gravity itself.

Matter curves spacetime. We measure that it does so it does.
You cannot “measure” that,- you cans see light bends, this is not the same as space bends. You have a personal obsession of creeds, with how just because you have no idea about it yourself.
 
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No not at all, when the floor height is only 2 cm of it means 0.6 * 0.3048 mgal, that’s a lot.

Bjarne, the floor hight is about 3 meters.


It is not silly but an important measurement experiment for the future.
http://www.science27.com/images/Container.jpg
It can easy be done, for example to execute the container measurement experiment as shown (and describe) above, and then repeat it but this time with “a bobble” without matter around the COG (gravity center).

A cavity around the center of gravity will not make a lot of difference.

As I wrote, it would not surprise me if ADG values in both cases are the same.

It won't surprise me either. Conventional gravity predicts that, apart from a small loss of mass, it will be the same (depends on the size of the cavity, of course).

We must probably understand gravity as a UNITY. Probably the effect on the central “point” (COG) must always be the same.

The center of gravity for a massive and a hollow sphere is the same.

This effect on that point is so far I see it the basic for that a gravitational field at all can exist. – This is the “anker” of gravity that make it possible to pull space (and matter) from an outwards direction.

Bjarne, this is not 'the julekalender', use a dictionary. Anker = Anchor.

The center of gravity is, basically, just a virtual point, calculated depending on which masses we include. For instnace, the COG for the Earth alone is approximately at the center of the planet, but the COG for the Earth/Sun system is very close the the center of the sun.

First at all the underground here in this country is very predictable.
Of course there are anomalies, but notice these are fast decreasing, based on /r2 .

It is very predictable. You problem is that you have no idea what the exact surface gravity is where the Domus Vista stands.

For example a anomaly 2 meter inside of the underground give you only 25% effect, 4 meter above it is only 6.25%

What about an anomaly 100 meters down, weighing in at a few million tons (like e.g. a clay deposit)?

Bjarne, I don't care what you think about this. It is a provable fact that surface gravity varies more than the measly 1,4mGal from the Domus Vista.

So as long as you have no baseline reference, you can place the COG wherever you please in the building, depending on the assumed baseline.

This is a fact. Do try to live wiht it.

The FAG reflects the Earths ADG and distances to its COG (6254000 meter) therefore this one is pretty stable and predictable. .

The FAG is pretty much the same everywhere on Earth, but it makes a difference what the elevation of each floor is. - So I'm looking forward to your data for that.

Of course it also makes a difference what the ground elevation is, but that is part of the baseline.

Hans
 
Right but outside the black hole, not from inside, You will get that point the day you understand why the mass surroundings a black hole certainly is proportional with the magnitude of a black hole. That day you understand this you begin to understand d the nature of gravity itself.
Wrong but inside the black hole, not from ouside.
You will get that point the day you understand the physics of black holes.
The event horizon is a surface through which mass passes without any effects. The mass is inside the black hole.
You agree that black holes are black. That means that light does not escape. That also means that nothing else can since nothing else can move faster than light.

You cannot “measure” that,- you cans see light bends, this is not the same as space bends. You have a personal obsession of creeds, with how just because you have no idea about it yourself.
Wrong: Light moves in straight lines in flat space. Thus light bending means spacetime curves.
You have a personal obsession of ignorance, with how just because you have no idea about it yourself.

 
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Bjarne, the floor hight is about 3 meters.
No, the most floors are floors are 259 + either 20 or 22 cm.
These uncertainties (2 cm) you must multiply with 30 floors, hence the total difference is 0.6 meter this is unacceptable.

You seem to accept a deviation 10 times large, this is hence 10 times so unacceptable. You cannot use such rubbish for anything.

It won't surprise me either. Conventional gravity predicts that, apart from a small loss of mass, it will be the same (depends on the size of the cavity, of course).
But the difference is that you have a big zero, I have increasing ADG.

It is very predictable. You problem is that you have no idea what the exact surface gravity is where the Domus Vista stands.
It is not a problem, because based on the result you can calculate (the difference between the 2 column) you should experimentally easy just deduct or add whatever you want to accuse the underground for and then show that the ADG pattern of the building, you believe in, had surveyed, - you cannot.

What about an anomaly 100 meters down, weighing in at a few million tons (like e.g. a clay deposit)?
This is hypothetical julekalender nonsense.
First at all is the question; if not the FAG already is already included a average layer of clay. But let's now say this is not the case.

Frederiksberg have a less as than 5 meter clay > http://www.frederiksberg.dk/Borgers...~/media/4A121D28254E4B21B4C3ACB5C153F928.ashx
(It can some place be up to 75 meter but not at Frederiksberg) http://www.furesoe.dk/MiljoeEnergiO...and/Grundvandsbeskyttelse Furesø syd pdf.ashx
Hence below Domus vista you shall only expect to find 70m * 20 meter * 5 meter clay.= 7000 m3
But only the density difference matter, - let estimate that to 200kg/m3 – Hence that clay layer should (with center in 100 meters depth as you suggested ) give you 70*20*5*200*6,67E-11 /1002 = 0,9 microgal (notice not mgal – but less than 1 microgal.) – so little it is beyond the possibility to measure any difference.

Bjarne, I don't care what you think about this. It is a provable fact that surface gravity varies more than the measly 1,4mGal from the Domus Vista.
This is possible, but don’t try to deduct that must at Domus Vista, - try to deduct or add exactly so much that it reveal the building ADG you believe it to have, and tell me if the pattern fits to what you believe it to be. .

My good friend Hans let me mention it again, - you are defending a pattern that do not exist, also not behind “a clay scene”.

So as long as you have no baseline reference, you can place the COG wherever you please in the building, depending on the assumed baseline.
This is a fact. Do try to live with it.
The baseline can't save the old creeds, - instead it will soon finally and completely turn over.

The FAG is pretty much the same everywhere on Earth, but it makes a difference what the elevation of each floor is. - So I'm looking forward to your data for that.
Don’t worry

Of course it also makes a difference what the ground elevation is, but that is part of the baseline.
Yes, - but still, you can’t hide the building's own ADG for the Julemand.
 
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The fatal flaws and basic ignorance in Bjarne's ideas in his threads

The answer to:
seems to be that Bjarne has no idea what he thinks. He states that black holes are black but seems to also think that jets come from inside their event horizon.

So onto the next 3 question
The fatal flaws and basic ignorance in Bjarne's ideas in his threads
Bjarne states
  • "Based on the prevailing thesis we should be able to measure 267μGal at the roof so soon one container is full ( I believe)."
  • "According to the new theory we will only measure 67 μGal".
The obvious question is: Bjarne - Please cite the equations you used for the silo calculations.
First asked 19th July 2010
Which splits into these 3 questions:
27. Please show your calculation of the expected ADG at the top of the silo. I expect that you used and can cite the equation for the gravitational field inside a cylinder.
I suspect that you used the "spherical cow" approximation yet again. Thus the actual number will never be measured.
28. Please show your calculation of the expected ADG at the top of the silo. I hope that you used and can cite the equation for the gravitational field inside a cylinder according to your theory.
29. So if you measure 66 or 68 μGal then both theories according to your calcualtions are wrong.
Will you then throw away your theory?
​

​
 
Bjarne's silo experiment - fatal flaws

Bjarne,
From what I have read your silo experiment is
  1. Measure the baseline ADG underneath the bottom of one silo in a set of 4 silos.
    This has been done and you are waiting for the report.
  2. The silos will be filled by the farmer.
  3. Measure the ADG underneath the bottom of the original silo and at the top.
I can see at least 2 fatal flaws with this so far - maybe you can too. I hope that this is not your plan.

The next step would be to compare these irrelevant results with what your fantasy predicts, i.e. you need to answer: Bjarne - Please cite the equations you used for the silo calculations.
Or maybe you really did pull these numbers out of your pet cow's bottom :jaw-dropp !
 
seems to be that Bjarne has no idea what he thinks. He states that black holes are black but seems to also think that jets come from inside their event horizon.

How can you know whether the jets also affects the inner black hole or not SIR, it is black , night, exactly like it is on the other side of yours anti crackpot glasses.

27. Please show your calculation of the expected ADG at the top of the silo. I expect that you used and can cite the equation for the gravitational field inside a cylinder.
I suspect that you used the "spherical cow" approximation yet again. Thus the actual number will never be measured.
28. Please show your calculation of the expected ADG at the top of the silo. I hope that you used and can cite the equation for the gravitational field inside a cylinder according to your theory.
I have already answered that question.

29. So if you measure 66 or 68 μGal then both theories according to your calcualtions are wrong.
Will you then throw away your theory?
Nuts question.
 
Bjarne,
From what I have read your silo experiment is
  1. Measure the baseline ADG underneath the bottom of one silo in a set of 4 silos.This has been done and you are waiting for the report.
  2. The silos will be filled by the farmer.
  3. Measure the ADG underneath the bottom of the original silo and at the top.
  4. I can see at least 2 fatal flaws with this so far - maybe you can too. I hope that this is not your plan.

Yehh yehh you never see anything else as flaws.
Are you sure it not is 2 cracks in you anti crackpot glasses ?

We could not measure at the top, due to too much g noise.
Thin steel vibrate much too much in the wind.
Hence measurement at the top had been given up.

g6.jpg


Instead we have measured in the bottom of each silo and will very soon measure the exact same place, after the containers are full.

To calculate the expected pull towards the expected gravitational center a special equation shall be used, due to the angel to the center.
I am waiting for that.

It is according to the prevailing thesis expected upwards pull to (roughly estimated to around minus 100 microgal), - but let’s now patient and wait and calculate it exactly.

According to the experience from Domus Vista, Iexpect that ADG DIFFERNCE at the ground level , at the silos will be almost zero.
Maybe a very little + (max +10 microgal).

Still I have to say I am not finish to analyze the result from Domus, but so fare everything point to that the gravitational center only (not surprising) must be very close the ground level and in no way at the physical center. (a cellar is also expected in the building)… Therefore I am not afraid to predict a zero difference by the silos.

The next step would be to compare these irrelevant results with what your fantasy predicts, i.e. you need to answer:
The people from DTU that are measuring are top professionals, and in fact measuring the same spots many places in Denmark to watch land-raising (after the last ice age) just 3 microgal decrease is immediately interpreted as 1 cm land rise. – These people know what they are doing SIR.
So don’t worry..
 
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No, the most floors are floors are 259 + either 20 or 22 cm.
These uncertainties (2 cm) you must multiply with 30 floors, hence the total difference is 0.6 meter this is unacceptable.

Hilarious you should say this when you don't even know the figure yourself. Bjarne, if our lack of precise knowledge of the floor hights invalidates my calculations, they also invalidate yours. Fine, let's call the result inconclusive, and wait for the measurements.

But spare me the nonsense of you having proved anything.

But the difference is that you have a big zero, I have increasing ADG.

Are you claiming that there is increased gravity caused by a cavity around the COG?? That's bizarro even for you.

It is not a problem, because based on the result you can calculate (the difference between the 2 column) you should experimentally easy just deduct or add whatever you want to accuse the underground for and then show that the ADG pattern of the building, you believe in, had surveyed, - you cannot.

Which is what I did. It worked. It will be even better when the right elevation data is in. Just wait and see.

First at all is the question; if not the FAG already is already included a average layer of clay. But let's now say this is not the case.

The local gravity has nothing to do with the FAG, as you noted yourself just recently.

Frederiksberg have a less as than 5 meter clay > http://www.frederiksberg.dk/Borgers...~/media/4A121D28254E4B21B4C3ACB5C153F928.ashx
(It can some place be up to 75 meter but not at Frederiksberg) http://www.furesoe.dk/MiljoeEnergiOgVej/Grundvand/~/media/Hjemmeside/MiljoeEnergiOgVej/Grundvand/Grundvandsbeskyttelse%20Fures%C3%B8%20syd%20pdf.ashx
Hence below Domus vista you shall only expect to find 70m * 20 meter * 5 meter clay.= 7000 m3

Nice that you do some research. Too bad it's not so relevant. That article is about the sealing layer over the ground water, but of course, when we talk gravity we need to take far greater depths into account.

Anyway, we really need not discuss this. The local variability of gravity is a fact.

Hans
 
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g6a1.jpg

Center of gravity for both containers when both are full, shown in orange.

Paul

:) :) :)
 
Hilarious you should say this when you don't even know the figure yourself. Bjarne, if our lack of precise knowledge of the floor heights invalidates my calculations, they also invalidate yours. Fine, let's call the result inconclusive, and wait for the measurements.

But spare me the nonsense of you having proved anything.
There is 2 options...
The green and yellows column or something between.
We are hence CLOSE and 10 times closer than the nonsense in yours julekalender.

Are you claiming that there is increased gravity caused by a cavity around the COG?? That's bizarro even for you.
I am keeping this possibility open, that there is an increasing ADG towards to the center instead of a stable ADG. ( As you know this was what I climbed first). But I expect a stable ADG.

So, - I have also not completely given up the idea that ADD could be increasing towards the center, and even also after matter have been left behind.

I know these sounds a “strange” or “bizarre” if you like, but only if you ignore the “magic” of the center.
It is hard to put word on what I mean, - which role the center actually plays,- and off course this must be measure, in several different measurements experiments.

I suspect that:
1.) Gravity must properly be understood as unity.
2.) The pull on the center must always be proportional to the total overall magnitude of the sourrounding overall gravitational field; simply because of gravity always is a unity.

3.) For example;
A big ball shaped “hole” in the center, of a homogeneous ball shaped mass (for example inside the earth, or inside a cluster of galaxies, could probably give (almost) the exact same (inner measurement) result as if there was mass close/all around the center. – THIS would not surprise me. ( This can relative easuy be tested here on the earth).
This is build on the idea (simple math) that whether you pulls space from the direction of outwards “infinity” or if you pull it from the inwards “infinity” –require the exact same force.
Space can “give” from both directions.
Hence the pull from inwards and outwards space is always “shared" based on distance and mass-balance.
And this is where the “unity” idea emerges.
This mean you can not get stronger outwards effect that inwards effect.

This is off course difficult to know how must and how easy you can pull space from the inwards “infinity” direction, unless testing this, by measuring, - by several more special constructed measurements experiments.
BUT - THIS – seems what we can expect, since it already seams to be what is written everywhere on the sky.

I simply do not believe in huge mass so heavy like billion of stars, - in a small point.
This is a sick idea.
The truth is that space pulls from all directions, also from an inwards direction.
Very compact mass = BANG >>> Supernova and that is ALWAYS it , - BEFORE a mass can get “huge”.

The local gravity has nothing to do with the FAG, as you noted yourself just recently.
No of course not, but the local gravity is not so strange that it should could steel the picture underlaying picture from you.

Nice that you do some research. Too bad it's not so relevant. That article is about the sealing layer over the ground water,
but of course, when we talk gravity we need to take far greater depths into account.
Anyway, we really need not discuss this. The local variability of gravity is a fact.
Ground water beneath large cities are fetched from very deep beneath, I think an all right research have been done.

But off course based on the the measurement so far, people can always invent doubts.
This is why I am allready focusing on completely well defined projects where we exactly know what we talk about.
Off course this is necessary. - You know I do not like unnecessarily violence, - , then better use the sledge hammer one time, - to kill the old thesis, - and then a single final time to kill the dark matter idea, - one time for all.

But anyway I am prepared that the scientific community will require these experiments repeated at least 10.000 times, before the language of even a sledge hammer is completely understood.
 
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How can you know whether the jets also affects the inner black hole or not SIR, it is black , night, exactly like it is on the other side of yours anti crackpot glasses.
SIR, we both agree that black holes are black.
We know that the jets do not affect the inner back hole SIR beacuse a black hole is black (nothing goes out), exactly like it is on the other side of yours crackpot glasses.

I have already answered that question.
No you have not.
What was the equation that you used to get the number from your theory? This is not in any post that I have seen.
All you have to do is give the equation of a link to the post.

Nuts question.
Nuts answer.
The question is if your exeriment invalidates your theory then is your theory invalid?
This is so obvious that even a cow will say yes.

The fatal flaws and basic ignorance in Bjarne's ideas in his threads
 
We know that the jets do not affect the inner back hole SIR beacuse a black hole is black (nothing goes out),
Rats and Fox always have exists, I believe there are such in black holes too.
The escape of energy also from inside the black hole is possibleright angled, this is not a coincidence, (the day you begin to understand the cause of a black hole).
I also believe the jets affects the center. But none of us can know this.
Hence all this is for both of us assumptions.

In the near future I am sure that we will execute many black hole experiments on this planet, - it is easy to research these phenomena’s here, by simple ADG measurement in special build object experiment.

And as I wrote it will not surprise me if we will discover that matter surrounding a central point, can cause the inner pull (and hence ADG) in space to continue towards the center, also even thought matter is left outside / behind.

This is 180 degree against our logical way of thinking. I agree to that.
BUT gravity doesn’t ask us what is logical or illogical, it have its own cow logic.

What was the equation that you used to get the number from your theory? This is not in any post that I have seen.
First answered you = minus 75% at the top, - of what you expect, then corrected to 50% because of 50% of the space pull access is “blocked” by the earth. (still measured at the top)

The question is if your experiment invalidates your theory then is your theory invalid?
You must expect a significant upwards pull from these silos.
If this is not the case YOU have a problem.
We are not talking about 1 cow stupid microgal, but rather minus 100.
 
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Center of gravity for both containers when both are full, shown in orange.
I hope to meassure when only one is full.
We have measured between all the 4 silos.
 
Rats and Fox always have exists, I believe there are such in black holes too.
Wrong: Rats and Foxes have existed for a short time. Even basic biology is beyond you - look up evolution.
And the ignorance of geotphysics (the age of teh Earth is 4.6 billion yeara, not infinite).
And there are no Rats and Fox in black holes unless some aliens grabbed them from Earth!

The escape of energy also from inside the black hole is possibleright angled, this is not a coincidence, (the day you begin to understand the cause of a black hole).
I also believe the jets affects the center. But none of us can know this.
Hence all this is for both of us assumptions.
So now you are calling yourself a liar?
Black = nothing comes out.

Sceince tells use that jets do not affect the interior of black holes because they are emiytted from the accretion disk outside them.
So you do not know but I do know.

The dumbness of "right angled' is obvious even to your pet cow. Any direction light goes it cannot get out of the event horizon.
You are also commiting the cardinal sin of crackpottery - thinking that energy is an object like a photon or electron. Energy is a property of the system. It cannot escape from a black hole except as the energy of light or matter which you (unless you are lying) say cannot happne because black hoels are black.

In the near future I am sure that we will execute many black hole experiments on this planet, - it is easy to research these phenomena’s here, by simple ADG measurement in special build object experiment.
Another bit of ignorance: Black holes have masses of stars!

As for your ADG fantasies having anything to do with black holes - listen to your pet cow laughing at you: HA HA HA :).

It is just possible that the LHC could create micro- black holes but these would instantly vanish due to Hawking radiation and in any case are uncontrollable.

First answered you = minus 75% at the top, - of what you expect, then corrected to 50% because of 50% of the space pull access is “blocked” by the earth. (still measured at the top)
You are wrong. It is minus 3.142% at the top. I know this is right because I pulled the number out of your pet cow's bottom :jaw-dropp!

I asked for the equation not yet another number that you pulled out of your pet cow's bottom.
What was the equation that you used to get the number from your theory? This is not in any post that I have seen.
All you have to do is give the equation ofr a link to the post.
(more emphasis added since you cannot understand English)

But maybe you can justify your really dumb "equation" of multiplying whatever Newton states by 75% (or 50% or whatever number you come up with next).
What is the equarion that you used to calculate the value of 75%/50%/0%/X%/Y%/whatever my pet cow thinks%

 
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I hope to meassure when only one is full.
We have measured between all the 4 silos.
You had better measure with only one silo full. Otherwise your experiment is invalid and you will have to start over again.

Having more than one full is one of the 2 obvious fatal flows I mention in
Bjarne's silo experiment - fatal flaws?, i.e. that you have not taking in account the ADG from the other silos. It would be like haveing 4 Domus Vista buildings side by side. One reason you picked the Domus Vista building should have been its isolation.

Once you have wasted your money (again!) with measuring the ADG at the top of the one filled silo, I may tell you about the really fatal flaw in the experiment.
 
I am keeping this possibility open, that there is an increasing ADG towards to the center instead of a stable ADG. ( As you know this was what I climbed first). But I expect a stable ADG.
Your expectations are wrong as you have known for may months.
It can also be seen to be wrong from simple logic:​
  • The ADG at the center of a sphere is zero (all the forces balance out).​
  • If the ADG is constant then it must be zero at the surface.​
  • The ADG of the Earth is not zero at the surface. It is not zero in mines or under the sea either.​
  • Thus your original idea is wrong.​
Your new idea that it increases towards the center is of course really dumb. To put it simply: As you go towards the center there is less mass below you and more mass above you. So​
  1. The ADG from mass below you is toward the center and decreases.​
  2. The ADG from mass above you is away from the center and increases.​
  3. The total ADG is the vector sum of the 2 ADG.​
  4. Thus the ADG can never increase. The pull from the mass above you always decreases the ADG.​
If you do the actual math then you take account od all of the mass and get the result that you have been persistently ignorant for so long.
​
 
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